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Old June 21st, 2007, 11:22 AM   #81
Yoolee
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Hey

Good morning everyone,

Thank you all for your continued contributions on this project. I work 3rd shift and enjoy reading up on current developments.

Duke_of_Hazard, it is just my 2 cents but rents have been increasing in the chicagoland area over the past few months. With the rise in property value over the past few years, unless you use some kind of down payment, you will not get 1% of the property value in rent to cover the mortgage (may depend on the neighborhood and kind of investment). I have a 3 flat that I bought almost 4 years ago in the Belmont/Cragin area. If I had not put down 20% I would be breaking even on the mortgage with some expenses coming out of my pocket. This property has two 3bdrm units and one 2bdrm with pretty good rent being collected. My reward is in some income because of the down payment, the great appreciation and despite the current market situation, it is holding up very well. I can't complain. Back then I could have done 100% financing and broke even but opted for the other.

The 235 W. Van Buren project is 75% sold (unofficial). The demand is there. Plan on using a down payment to limit your mortgage expense, obtain a feasable rent and consider it a "hold" type of investment that will reward you with growth in equity and depending on the down payment, monthly income. I also have a 2bdrm 1bath condo in south loop that I have rented out. The rent covers the mortgage, assessment and most of taxes (have not received tax bill yet). I also had to use a down payment. My reward is in the equity already accumulated in the property. I also encourage you to take a ride through South Loop. I think the speculation in this area was a few years back. Now, it is growing so fast and selling just the same. The city government has just invested large amounts of money on the South Loop portion of Michigan Ave. There are new light fixtures and other cosmetic projects in the mix. Look up in the sky and all you see are cranes working on new structures. So many developers can't be wrong.

Also, to give you an idea, I purchased a 2bdrm, 2bath SW corner unit in the Van Buren project and my assumed assessment is around $286.

Sorry all for the long winded response but I hope this helps Duke_of_Hazard. Anyone feel free to educate me if I am misinformed.
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Old June 21st, 2007, 11:22 AM   #82
Yoolee
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..
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Old June 21st, 2007, 09:55 PM   #83
duke_of_hazard
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I am not so convinced buying a condo in downtown chicago is
a good investment. These condos are basically luxury items.
Unless I could rent a 300k condo out for $2500+, I would be
losing money. I would rather put my investment in the bank
and get a guaranteed risk free 5% return for no work. My
guess is the developers like to promote them as investments
just to give people a warm fuzzy feeling about buying them.
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Old June 23rd, 2007, 04:17 AM   #84
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^ I think that's a bit of a blanket statement. There are sub-markets within the city that are completely different from each other. Move a few blocks in any direction, and you could be talking about completely different market circumstances. Look at the south loop, or even parts of the west loop. With the union station expansion, post office conversion, and this project there could be great opportunity to get good gains a few years after the project is completed. I think people who buy here may be very pleased with what they get when they move out down the road- given no stock market decrease, a steady housing market, and of course other factors.
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Old June 23rd, 2007, 04:58 AM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chitowner245 View Post
^ I think that's a bit of a blanket statement. There are sub-markets within the city that are completely different from each other. Move a few blocks in any direction, and you could be talking about completely different market circumstances. Look at the south loop, or even parts of the west loop. With the union station expansion, post office conversion, and this project there could be great opportunity to get good gains a few years after the project is completed. I think people who buy here may be very pleased with what they get when they move out down the road- given no stock market decrease, a steady housing market, and of course other factors.
I disagree about the West Loop. In my opinion, I think it is one of the most overrated parts of the city. A small advantage is its close proximity to the Metra stations for the reverse commuters. Right now it is overpriced. It is not near any cta train stations and there are few real great places within a half mile.
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Old June 23rd, 2007, 11:55 AM   #86
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Ok, you have a point there- I'll buy that. But it's also about what the future holds, and things could definitely turn around in a few years despite the reality of what the west loop is. A few good projects could get the ball rolling, but there is concern about the way in which the west loop has progressed over the past ten years (residentially) compared with most other parts of the city.
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Old June 24th, 2007, 08:05 AM   #87
bart3
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more news for the area

Moderation note: This information belongs in the South Loop Development News thread, in which it has already been posted.

Last edited by i_am_hydrogen; June 24th, 2007 at 08:18 AM.
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Old June 25th, 2007, 07:53 AM   #88
Sir Isaac Newton
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Quote:
Originally Posted by duke_of_hazard View Post
I am not so convinced buying a condo in downtown chicago is
a good investment. These condos are basically luxury items.
Unless I could rent a 300k condo out for $2500+, I would be
losing money. I would rather put my investment in the bank
and get a guaranteed risk free 5% return for no work. My
guess is the developers like to promote them as investments
just to give people a warm fuzzy feeling about buying them.
Thousands of people have become multi-millionaires from buying and renting out real estate.....I don't think the same can be said for people who invest their money in a bank at 5% (unless they are in a job that pays them an enormous salary). And not only is 5% ROE pretty damn low to begin with, that 5% return will be taxed at your income tax rate, which is going to be much higher than the 15% capital gains rate that would be applied to the appreciation of the real estate.
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Old June 25th, 2007, 08:46 PM   #89
Chiman
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Looks like there may be a little competition across the expressway ramp if this parcel ever gets going.

(See article from Crains about Franklin Point (possible) develpment -- it's (appropriately) posted in the South Loop Development news.)

Last edited by Chiman; June 26th, 2007 at 06:51 AM. Reason: Self Monitoring -- Article should be posted in South Loop News
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Old June 25th, 2007, 09:35 PM   #90
Sir Isaac Newton
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Since 235 West Van Buren is already 75% sold (supposedly), the proposed mega-project will probably not be competing against it. By the time they start marketing condos for Franklin Point, 235 West Van Buren should be close to sold out. I think that the Franklin Point mega-project will actually be a major boost to those people who invested in 235 West Van Buren (as well as Vetro and Printers Corner) as it will bring a lot of retail and other fun stuff making that little corner of the South Loop much more desirable to live in....making condos in the area easier to rent and helping their resale value.
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Old June 25th, 2007, 11:15 PM   #91
cheeps
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I hope this happens. Is this the section of land that butts up to the new target on Roosevelt and Clark?
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Old June 26th, 2007, 12:01 AM   #92
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I believe it's from Roosevelt down to 18th, and from Clark to the river on the west. An obscenely huge chunk of undeveloped land. Very interested to see what Adrian and pals come up with. Will it be another Dearborn Park, or something decidedly more urban?

(perhaps this thread should continue in South Loop Development news...)
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Old June 26th, 2007, 01:17 AM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cheeps View Post
I hope this happens. Is this the section of land that butts up to the new target on Roosevelt and Clark?
It's the section of land on the west side of Wells, bounded by Harrison, Polk, Wells, and the river. It's directly north of the River City building.
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Old June 26th, 2007, 01:25 AM   #94
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Doh!
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Old June 26th, 2007, 05:23 AM   #95
bart3
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It looks as no work has started still on this project, minus the load testing that was started weeks ago. I know they were originally going to break ground in the spring, I wonder if they are still having issues purchasing the Chinese food joint located on the east side of the property.

Is the Wacker Drive reconstruction going to retain the on ramps located directly to the south of the building?
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Old June 26th, 2007, 06:42 AM   #96
Sir Isaac Newton
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bart3 View Post
It looks as no work has started still on this project, minus the load testing that was started weeks ago. I know they were originally going to break ground in the spring, I wonder if they are still having issues purchasing the Chinese food joint located on the east side of the property.

Is the Wacker Drive reconstruction going to retain the on ramps located directly to the south of the building?
I could be remembering things incorrectly, but I think when I spoke to the sales agent in February, he said that they were shooting for a summer groundbreaking.
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Old June 28th, 2007, 07:03 AM   #97
therock473
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hmmm

Yes groundbreaking has taken a lot longer then expected. I bought my place(s) in early February and they were suggesting a completion date of late 2009. However this is a very liberal estimate..i truly believe it wont be completed until the summer of 2010.

Who's excited about a 3 year wait!>!>!??

One thing I will say about 235 w van buren is the parking. they have limited parking (compared to amount of units)...this is very beneficial especially for those who work in the loop and may not need a car. The spot is sure to rent.

DOES ANYONE HAVE ANY ideas what amenities there will be? Such as rooftop access? pools/jacuzzis? game rooms/theaters? I heard that the Ballys in River city 800 S wells could possibly relocate to 235 w van buren. But this sounds highly unlikely. I just hope they have a gym in there of some sorts
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Old June 28th, 2007, 07:15 AM   #98
Sir Isaac Newton
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I don't think it will take until Summer of 2010 for the building to be completed.....have you seen how fast 1720 South Michigan has gone from just beginning their marketing to now being topped out???? Supposedly, they have already sold something like over 70% of their units here (and it wouldn't surprise me if that number isn't exaggerated too much, given how competitive their prices are), so lack of sales/financing won't hold them back. I guess the only thing that could hold them back is some sort of unforseen issue - like them having legal issues that delay tearing down the two story building with the Chinese restaurant in it....
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Old June 28th, 2007, 01:37 PM   #99
Yoolee
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Hey everyone! Their "guesstimates" on completion time have been, so far, pretty accurate with other projects. I have herd several people mention issues with the restaurant currently sitting on the lot. Hey, if I knew I had someone by the, you know what, I'd hold out for the right price too. I'm sure it will soon be resolved and things will get rolling accordingly. I don't think this building will have many if any amenities. I know their other projects don't (referring to pools, gyms, rooftop access) and when I spoke with my agent, there were none mentioned. I am going to say nay on the "amenitiesay". This is ok because it has kept the association fees not to exaggerated. This compared to a studio I looked at in South Shore with a $292 association fee that included gas. That's wonderful but the stove was electric and the A/C was a wall unit which, you guessed it, was also electric. Guess who pays the electric bill? Yours truly. This being said, you can bet on no ammenities. I am ok if this project takes a little longer. We know it will be a while so hopefully some more appreciation without a mortgage payment.
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Old June 28th, 2007, 05:52 PM   #100
Sir Isaac Newton
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoolee View Post
This being said, you can bet on no ammenities. I am ok if this project takes a little longer. We know it will be a while so hopefully some more appreciation without a mortgage payment.
I definitely agree that for investors, a big delay in construction is a great thing....however, for the people who plan on living there, not so good

Also, I think you're right about no amenities. There will be a decent amount of retail on the first floor, I believe. But I think that the salesperson said that there won't even be a fitness room....I think I remember him saying that they were keeping things simple and not adding extra amenities like a fitness room, pool, etc. so that they could keep the assessments and sales prices low.
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