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Old May 10th, 2007, 01:50 PM   #3461
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Originally Posted by fanofterps View Post
Maybe Naing is getting ready to go. I'm a liitle confused on his plan. I assume the 2nd tower would go above the parking garage?
Pretty sure the second tower he's referring to would not be on the Guilford Avenue site, but rather on the second site he owns nearby at Saratoga and Gay Streets (where MB Klein trains used to be).
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Old May 10th, 2007, 01:57 PM   #3462
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BOOKENDS

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Old May 10th, 2007, 03:22 PM   #3463
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Originally Posted by getontrac View Post
^Not convinced the economy is hot. Larger national and international economic trends will trump regional trends if the former trends shift downward drastically--and with our national debt and energy scarcity iminent [snip]
Energy (which, like matter, can neither be created nor destroyed) ain't the issue; harnessing it is. Smart people are on the case. 300 Pratt has great (and permanent, since nothing can be built in front of it) southern exposure, no? Fifty-two stories with integrated solar panels along every floor would be pretty cool. Or hot.
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Old May 10th, 2007, 03:30 PM   #3464
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 30 Floors Up View Post
BOOKENDS

originally, i was under the impression that this garage was really old and that it couldn't possibly support a tower, but i guess i was wrong. i like how swift naing is moving with this.

Last edited by MasonsInquiries; May 10th, 2007 at 03:50 PM.
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Old May 10th, 2007, 03:57 PM   #3465
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamie_hunt View Post
Energy (which, like matter, can neither be created nor destroyed) ain't the issue; harnessing it is. Smart people are on the case. 300 Pratt has great (and permanent, since nothing can be built in front of it) southern exposure, no? Fifty-two stories with integrated solar panels along every floor would be pretty cool. Or hot.
I would strongly, but respectfully disagree here. Energy is the heart of the matter. Replacing oil shortfalls fast enough to maintain a healthy economy may be difficult or impossible.

Nate
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Old May 10th, 2007, 03:58 PM   #3466
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Originally Posted by MasonsInquiries View Post
originally, i was under the impression that this garage was really old and that it couldn't possibly support a tower, but i guess i was wrong. i like how swift naing is moving with this.
Wait a moment, you're saying Naing has the Harbor Park garage now?

Nate
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Old May 10th, 2007, 04:23 PM   #3467
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Sorry for the confusion. I used the term "Bookends" in reference to the cranes.
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Old May 10th, 2007, 04:32 PM   #3468
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Originally Posted by getontrac View Post
Wait a moment, you're saying Naing has the Harbor Park garage now?

Nate
Moment of clarity here: Old parking garages are on both of Naing's properties: along Guilford between Saratoga and Pleasant and at Saratoga and Gay. Both garages are obsolete and will be demo'ed as he moves forward. He doesn't own the Harbor Park Garage, which was the one in the East Balto. pic.
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Old May 10th, 2007, 04:58 PM   #3469
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^That's what I thought.

Nate
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Old May 10th, 2007, 05:06 PM   #3470
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I wonder if Naing will be presenting plans for the entire first tower today, or if it will be solely plans for the garage upon which the first tower will sit. I've never before heard of a developer dividing his project into two phases, where phase one includes the garage and phase two includes the tower. Why not just build it all together? The only thing that I can think of is that the garage will be easier to get approval for and he wants to begin that while he trudges through the approval process for a 60-story tower. if that's his plan, then I guess he's making a smart move. I just hope that in five years we have more than another parking garage, although it would be more than J.J. Clarke ever did.
Didn't one of the forumers say that we could be seeing work on Naing's site by the end of the year? I guess if he's beginning with just a garage, that prediction might actually be quite reasonable.
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Old May 10th, 2007, 05:40 PM   #3471
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Originally Posted by PeterSmith View Post
I've never before heard of a developer dividing his project into two phases, where phase one includes the garage and phase two includes the tower. Why not just build it all together?
That was the MO for 414 Water Street ... guess there's always a ready market for parking, and having the garage in place allows him to do the tower (relatively quickly; foundation work will be done) when he feels the market's ready.
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Old May 10th, 2007, 05:59 PM   #3472
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Well, the difference with 414 Water St. was that the garage was in existence already, I think. My impression with the Naing tower is that he is building the garage, and the once that is finished, he'll go right into building the tower, so it'll be almost as if they weren't being separated at all. I don't know, I guess we'll have to wait to hear more information.

Also, I know we haven't seen any renderings of the Naing towers, but does anybody else just picture them as humongous 1960s tower blocks? For some reason, I imagine them as completely void of any architectural merit whatsoever.
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Old May 10th, 2007, 06:05 PM   #3473
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Originally Posted by scando View Post
I'm not generally pessimistic, but over the years it has seemed like whenever somebody announces something big for Baltimore, it gets downsized before the digging begins. I guess I've gotten so used to it that when something IS announced, I wait for the inevitable second news. Let's hope it stays at 37 and hope it doesn't end up shrinking again.
Hey the 4 seasons gained almost 200 ft.

There is a gigantic price diffrence between 37 and 57 floors. It may be a matter of not being able to line up enough creditors.
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Old May 10th, 2007, 06:07 PM   #3474
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jamie_hunt View Post
That was the MO for 414 Water Street ... guess there's always a ready market for parking, and having the garage in place allows him to do the tower (relatively quickly; foundation work will be done) when he feels the market's ready.
In 414 the garage and the tower were built by 2 diffrent people with a considerable break in time.
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Old May 10th, 2007, 06:10 PM   #3475
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When LaSalle Partners developed 414 Water Street they always envisioned it as a 2 phase development that's why the garage is so beefy, structurally speaking.
That building was accidently constructed about 2 feet over the property line to the north which no doubt gave the title insurance company major indigestion.
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Old May 10th, 2007, 06:22 PM   #3476
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Spoke to what I feel is a reputable source on the Naing stuff...

He hopes to start demolition of the warehouse between Davis and Guilford this July. He currently has three different blueprints for the "60 Story" building. Not all being 60 stories, obviously. Seems like he wants to do it @ 60 but the city is pushing back a little on it being that tall and its unclear if the finances will work out. Right now its looking like it will be just under 200 apartments, retail, etc. That puts it somewhere between 30-40 stories with a garage. Seems like a good idea to start with the garage, and move forward based on current market conditions. The second tower is a long way off. There will definitely be retail on the bottom floor of the garage.

The retail spaces in the saratoga court apartments (now 222 Saratoga) will be completed in July as well. There will be an eatery of some sort there.
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Old May 10th, 2007, 06:48 PM   #3477
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Come on, where's the excitement for the Waxter Center proposal and the Brexton!

Projects like that will really launch Mt. Vernon, esp. that section. I think if that neighborhood gets going, it will catapult itself over the harbor neighborhoods in popularity and notoriety.

Nate
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Old May 10th, 2007, 07:12 PM   #3478
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Come on, Nate. You know better than to think a mid-rise proposal can compete for our attention with 60 story towers

In reality though, the news about the Brexton and the Waxter Center is pretty exciting. We should seriously just have a thread dedicated exclusively to projects by Naing. He's all over the city.

I like how the developer of the Waxter Center project seems genuinely concerned about the fit of his building in Mt. Vernon. I'd love to get a building that is truly deserving of being in Mt. Vernon. Is 14 stories too tall though? How tall was that tower that was proposed for the carriage houses a few months back?
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Old May 10th, 2007, 07:24 PM   #3479
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scottbbfm View Post
Spoke to what I feel is a reputable source on the Naing stuff...

He hopes to start demolition of the warehouse between Davis and Guilford this July. He currently has three different blueprints for the "60 Story" building. Not all being 60 stories, obviously. Seems like he wants to do it @ 60 but the city is pushing back a little on it being that tall and its unclear if the finances will work out. Right now its looking like it will be just under 200 apartments, retail, etc. That puts it somewhere between 30-40 stories with a garage. Seems like a good idea to start with the garage, and move forward based on current market conditions. The second tower is a long way off. There will definitely be retail on the bottom floor of the garage.

The retail spaces in the saratoga court apartments (now 222 Saratoga) will be completed in July as well. There will be an eatery of some sort there.
I doubt if he will be demolishing the Terminal Warehouse come July. There is a 1 year waiting period from the "date of application for demolition" because the building is a listed Historic structure. Since he is not a church, he will actually have to abide by the rules the rest of us must follow. Imagine that. The zoning notice went up in December 2006. He has not gotten permission as of yet to demolish it and I hope he doesn't.

I wrote a letter against the proposed demolition. I did so because there are other options for him. He could site the structure in the middle of the block, or he could make the other tower site phase 1, or he could work out a land swap with the city and build on the cleared paking lot across the street. I don't see this as an "either/or" situation.

Last edited by 30 Floors Up; May 10th, 2007 at 07:51 PM.
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Old May 10th, 2007, 07:24 PM   #3480
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^That old Morton St proposal (very bad) was before the new URP with the various height limitations were firmly established.

This new project falls within in them, as MVBA VP Paul Warren said in the Sun article. My guess is that 14 stories would be about 140 feet. They're probably getting some density bonuses to make it that tall, which is probably the limit in that section of the neighborhood. They may have green units, reduced parking, more UG parking, high-design/quality building materials, and few others. The URP (but strangely not the appendexed height map) is available on the City Planning Dept website.

The Waxter Center is yet another brutalist mistake of architecture. I've seen worse, but does not work in that neighborhood at all.

Nate
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