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Old May 13th, 2007, 03:53 AM   #3541
getontrac
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^Well, that wouldn't be consistent with the US census population revision that showed DC back up to 589K--it was about 572K at 2000. If it were that expensive so that people were leaving even though it were attractive to live there, the population would be at least stable.

Nate
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Old May 13th, 2007, 04:34 AM   #3542
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I'm optimistic about the City because it's a "city". Urban living is sustainable living for the future. I reitterate my concerns about energy....

Drugs, crime, and gangs are becoming endemic everywhere, no longer in urban cores. Gangs are more problematic of late, but the dispersion of these ills will no longer be exclusive of cities. Biggest threat to urban viability versus non-urban: cities that lie to close to the sea waterfront. It's a real issue not going away. Fortunately, most of Baltimore won't be affected by moderate global warming, but those that will be affected are highly valued for the most part.

I can't wait for Naing to get started on the Brexton; you don't know how many times I looked out my 8th story window of 611 Park Ave expecting to see a roofless hulk after a rain or snow storm. Naing does sound pretty no nonsense and little bit less business speak than other developers. I love the fact that thought that the parking put in at Saratoga Ct was detrimental and conceded that there was plenty of parking elsewhere--you usually don't get that from a developer! He sensibly is putting retail in there to liven up that dead section.

As a soon to be Mt. Vernon resident again, I can't help but get excited about the Brexton and the Waxter proposals. The Waxter idea is great, add lots of density, limit parking (but still add), create "affordable" units, solidify a huge block.

Don't get down everybody. Just think, soon the new additions to IHE will open and we'll really have that robust urban dream of commerce/retail/movies. The Water condos will open adding more people and streetlife and inducing more retail, same with Zenith. The delivery of these products will be more substantial in their urban effects than the groundbreaking....

Nate
Go Mt. Vee! Btw, I was at 1209 for the courtyard party the other day and I saw one of the model units! they're amazing. Is it wrong for me to be counting the days until the Starbucks opens there? Dunkin donuts just doesn't cut it for me.....God, I'm turning into such a yuppie...

Anyway, Nate is right a ton of things are about to open up in the next six months. Things are looking good. Everyone always likes to jump on the extreme bandwagons. whether it be doom-and-gloom or the blue-skies-no-en-in-sight one. You just gotta learn to not be overly swayed by either.
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Old May 13th, 2007, 04:42 AM   #3543
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Downtown Baltimore remains hot commodity

by Rita Chappelle, The Examiner

The World Trade Center recently gained two new tenants.

BALTIMORE (Map, News) - The recent sale of the 21-story Mercantile Bank and Trust Building and the 16-story W.R. Grace Building to USA Realty Fund for $78.9 million reinforces that despite national market declines, downtown Baltimore real estate is still a hot market for investors.

“I think, pure and simple, the value [of Baltimore real estate] has risen, and the fact that buyers are willing to come into the market is definitely a promising trend,” said Robert Aydukovic, vice president for economic development for the Downtown Partnership, a nonprofit business group. “It shows that institutions and publicly traded money are discovering non-Pratt Street office buildings, and for well-tenanted office buildings, they are going to trade well.”

Aydukovic said Baltimore City has not seen institutional buyers for a long time, but they are beginning to recognize the tremendous value of many of the older buildings in the city.

Continued interest in existing downtown real estate seems to be improving the prospects for the state’s World Trade Center. Since announcing that the 31-story, 330,000- square-foot office tower would be retained in the Maryland Department of Transportation’s real estate portfolio, inquiries into the site have increased. “The World Trade Center is more than 50 percent leased and interest in the site is high,” said MDOT spokesman Richard Scher. “Since Secretary [John] Porcari made the announcement back in February, we have signed several new tenants and are in negotiations with other prospects.”

Scher said a real estate group signed a three-year lease and a venture capital company a one-year lease.

“We are in the midst of a full-scale effort to reinvest in and aggressively marketing the building. Real estate professionals within MDOT, working in conjunction with our consultant, ZHA Consulting, are making recommendations on improvements and developing a strategic marketing campaign,” Scher said.

Scher says MDOT plans to emerge with a sound blueprint to keep the momentum going. This is good news to Baltimore City officials.

“The best validation of the city’s long-term prospects comes from the marketplace,” said Andrew Frank, Baltimore City deputy mayor for neighborhood and economic development. “And the market is telling us that the office market is strong and is likely to remain so.”
This article is SO true. My firm is moving downtown and we're having a hard time finding good vacant space. Did anybody else know that 750 E. Pratt was TOTALLY full? Last I heard they were 50% vacant. In any case, I'm all set to move downtown. Now I can finally walk or bike to work like a decent urban dweller. My iPod is totally ready....

hmm...yeah, once again that was a total yuppie thing to say

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Old May 13th, 2007, 07:33 AM   #3544
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My bet is he builds some more condo's and apartments in Harbor East/Point in the next 2 years. I think with his success with Spinaker Bay and Vue that other builders gained confidence.
I can see that. Harbor East/Point has taken off so quickly that I think it's as close as you can get to a sure bet. The other where I think that would work is the Rotunda project. The Roland Park/University Parkway area has been so steady over the years that I can't imagine that the Rotunda won't be successful.
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Old May 13th, 2007, 07:37 AM   #3545
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Despite what you want to believe, the truth of the matter is that there are more people leaving the District more than ever because it costs so much to live there. I went to Georgetown University and Howard University for undergrad and George Washington University for post grad, so trust me. I know. It's just so expensive to live there. Ridiculously high.
DC is rediculously high but almost recession proof. No matter what, there are always enough careerist people willing to do anything to be there that, even when things slow down, DC is OK.
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Old May 13th, 2007, 07:39 AM   #3546
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Old May 13th, 2007, 07:45 AM   #3547
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Old May 13th, 2007, 07:48 AM   #3548
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Go Mt. Vee! Btw, I was at 1209 for the courtyard party the other day and I saw one of the model units! they're amazing. Is it wrong for me to be counting the days until the Starbucks opens there? Dunkin donuts just doesn't cut it for me.....God, I'm turning into such a yuppie...

Anyway, Nate is right a ton of things are about to open up in the next six months. Things are looking good. Everyone always likes to jump on the extreme bandwagons. whether it be doom-and-gloom or the blue-skies-no-en-in-sight one. You just gotta learn to not be overly swayed by either.
I've been through enough of these boom and bust cycles to see that this one is somewhat different from others for the city. In past ones, the question was one of survival for the city. This time the question seems to be the crane count or which big project will be canceled. That's a much healthier place to be. All I have to do is pass through Charles St at night and see people out and doing things to realize that a fundamental change has happened.
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Old May 13th, 2007, 07:59 AM   #3549
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DC is rediculously high but almost recession proof. No matter what, there are always enough careerist people willing to do anything to be there that, even when things slow down, DC is OK.
Completely agree. DC is a government town. In addition, it's full of enough parasite professions (i.e. lawyers, lobbyists, non-profiteers, and trust-fund wanna-be's) to keep it recession proof as long as the U.S. governement is willing to shell out the cash.

This is why it's unfair to do the whole Baltimore-DC comparison in the first place. Baltimore is a market-driven town fueled by industry and commerce. It got here by it's own accord and I truly respect it for that. DC sometimes seems like a theme park to me. I like the fact that this city was founded on it's geographical viablity. I mean sure it nearly died 40 years ago based upon it's industrial dependency on recently expired technologies but it's back again....somewhat frozen in time. I say thank god we weathered the "urban renewal" era fairly intact because now we have amazing historic neighborhoods that the rest of the country would kill for. Many other cities weren't so lucky. Once again, our geographic location is working in our favor and we ended up with one of the most beautiful cities in the country. It's only a matter of time before the rest of the world finds out.

Call me an optimist, but in my opinion, we'll be FINE. Whether we get 5 60 story buildings or 10 30 story buildings. We're maturing into our well-deserved world-class city status. Next thing you know people will be complaining about how expensive this place has become.

Last edited by MountVEE; May 13th, 2007 at 10:31 AM.
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Old May 13th, 2007, 10:17 AM   #3550
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Completely agree. DC is a government town. In addition, it's full of enough parasite professions (i.e. lawyers, lobbyists, non-profiteers, and trust-fund wanna-be's) to keep it recession proof as long as the U.S. governement is willing to shell out the cash.

This is why it's unfair to do the whole Baltimore-DC comparison in the first place. Baltimore is a market-driven town fueled by industry and commerce. It got here by it's accord and I truly respect it for that. DC sometimes seems like a theme park to me. I like the fact that this city was founded on it's geographical viablity. I mean sure it nearly died 40 years ago based upon it's industrial dependency on recently expired technologies but it's back again....somewhat frozen in time. I say thank god we weathered the "urban renewal" era fairly intact because now we have amazing historic neighborhoods that the rest of the country would kill for. Many other cities weren't so lucky. Once again, our geographic location is working in our favor and we ended up with one of the most beautiful cities in the country. It's only a matter of time before the rest of the world finds out.

Call me an optimist, but in my opinion, we'll be FINE. Whether we get 5 60 story buildings or 10 30 story buildings. We're maturing into our well-deserved world-class city status. Next thing you know people will be complaining about how expensive this place has become.
That was bliss.
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Old May 13th, 2007, 04:07 PM   #3551
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I already AM complaining about how expensive this place has become!

Nate
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Old May 13th, 2007, 04:28 PM   #3552
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I already AM complaining about how expensive this place has become!

Nate
It's all relative and many (some might say most) places have become more expensive to some degree in kind. DC is much more affordable than NYC. On the other hand, compared to where a friend of mine lives in Arkansas, Baltimore is far more expensive. And to a much greater extent than DC is to NYC. We make our choices -- moving somwhere cheaper, roommates, 2nd jobs, buying with a friend, being extremely frugal. I chose the last option when I bought my first house in NoVA. I save half of my Gross salary in Disposable dollars to buy it, because that is what I needed to go to closing (even with my FHA loan). Needless to say, I was determined!!
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Old May 13th, 2007, 05:26 PM   #3553
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It's all relative and many (some might say most) places have become more expensive to some degree in kind. DC is much more affordable than NYC. On the other hand, compared to where a friend of mine lives in Arkansas, Baltimore is far more expensive. And to a much greater extent than DC is to NYC. We make our choices -- moving somwhere cheaper, roommates, 2nd jobs, buying with a friend, being extremely frugal. I chose the last option when I bought my first house in NoVA. I save half of my Gross salary in Disposable dollars to buy it, because that is what I needed to go to closing (even with my FHA loan). Needless to say, I was determined!!
I understand fully what you mean, Java. My mother lives in Lake Village, Arkansas. You can get a 5-bedroom colonial house down there for 160,000. Unbelieveable.
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Old May 13th, 2007, 08:06 PM   #3554
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I understand fully what you mean, Java. My mother lives in Lake Village, Arkansas. You can get a 5-bedroom colonial house down there for 160,000. Unbelieveable.
The downside is she has to LIVE in Lake Village, Arkansas.

My parents actually live just across the river in Cleveland, MS. In my opinion, the Delta is a horrible place to live. Nobody should have to deal with that many mosquitos. It's always more expensive where the housing demand is higher. I don't see anybody clamouring to live down there.
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Old May 13th, 2007, 11:34 PM   #3555
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Conspiracy???

Hey Steven W,

Could it be possible that Arc Wheeler, Urban America and RWN are locked in
a stand off, wanting to see who will build the crown jewel of baltimore???
We have not had a new tallest in a very long time!! Could there be an EGO
trip going on here?



Hal
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Old May 13th, 2007, 11:39 PM   #3556
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Let's stop the hate

Anyone see this riding the JFX?


Splattered Rush Image Generates Loads Of Hype - 5/11 - Baltimore Mayor Sheila Dixon has apologized for a Department Of Public Works employee who expressed delight yesterday after seeing a defaced I-83 billboard (left) for WCBM's Rush Limbaugh. "His statement does not represent the position of the city government or my feelings as mayor," Dixon said. "Whether they occur on public or private property, I take all acts of vandalism seriously." In the Baltimore Sun, Laura Vozzella and Nicole Fuller look at how the story about blobs of paint on Limbaugh's face cascaded across the national media yesterday, making the Drudge Report and from Limbaugh himself, who jested about the incident. Even WCBM General Manager Bob Pettit is taking it in stride: "It was fun. I wasn't too excited when I saw (the sign). But the on-air people thought it was great. It basically says what it's all about. There's a lot of emotion associated with Rush Limbaugh, and people are very passionate about him on both sides of the fence." At Limbaugh's suggestion, Pettit is thinking of putting it up again, with a note added atop the paint splatters: "What the liberal left doesn't want you to hear." More in DCRTV's 5/10 newsblurb.....
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Old May 14th, 2007, 01:41 AM   #3557
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This article is SO true. My firm is moving downtown from Tide Point and we're having a hard time finding good vacant space. Did anybody else know that 750 E. Pratt was TOTALLY full? Last I heard they were 50% vacant. Anyway, we decide on our top picks but we might end up in a bidding war before its over. So far it's either 250 W. Pratt (awesome balcony) or 300 E. Lombard (awesome location) My vote is for the Lombard locale b/c then I can watch 300 E. Pratt rise from the ground (whenever that happens). In any case, I'm all set to move downtown. Now I can finally walk or bike to work like a decent urban dweller. My iPod is totally ready....

hmm...yeah, once again that was a total yuppie thing to say
we had a heck of a time finding space, but ended up with a great spot at 400 east pratt. the building is old, but the space and the view is amazing!

250 west pratt is a nice spot. we checked that out as well. good luck in the search!
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Old May 14th, 2007, 03:50 AM   #3558
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Anyone see this riding the JFX?


Splattered Rush Image Generates Loads Of Hype - 5/11 - Baltimore Mayor Sheila Dixon has apologized for a Department Of Public Works employee who expressed delight yesterday after seeing a defaced I-83 billboard (left) for WCBM's Rush Limbaugh. ....... More in DCRTV's 5/10 newsblurb.....
Tee-Hee. I posted that story on another site, with the headline "Rush defaced, perhaps should of used Moving Pictures" I'm embarrassed at my own bad puns. DCRTV is a great site for any local media news.


In development news, Southern Management has proposed a 15 story luxury apartment building in Towson at Susquehanna and Washington Ave. The building would have 4 stories of parking and ground level shops. I can't find it online but it was the cover storey on this weeks Jeffersonian.
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Old May 14th, 2007, 05:28 AM   #3559
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.....Call me an optimist, but in my opinion, we'll be FINE. Whether we get 5 60 story buildings or 10 30 story buildings. We're maturing into our well-deserved world-class city status. Next thing you know people will be complaining about how expensive this place has become.
In general, I'm very optimistic about this town. We had to make it to where we are without the built-in economy of DC AND with the DC economy sucking energy from us like a dual star system. Having grown in recent years in spite of DC getting most of the big stuff, Baltimore's growth is very real. I don't think very much will change if we do or don't get a 60 story building actually. It will be a relatively small piece of a picture that includes all of the neighborhoods like Canton, Fells Point Federal Hill, Mt Vernon, Charles Village, etc. That's were I see feet on the street, people in restaurants, shopping and that's the draw that might make somebody decide to drop a tall one somewhere around here. Do 250 condos make more of an impact when they are stacked up high? Maybe some additional impact, but it's not the thing that makes this city work, it's just a small part. In a day-to-day sense, I think having 2 good new supermarkets downtown is more telling and important than one big building.
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Old May 14th, 2007, 06:22 AM   #3560
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In general, I'm very optimistic about this town. We had to make it to where we are without the built-in economy of DC AND with the DC economy sucking energy from us like a dual star system. Having grown in recent years in spite of DC getting most of the big stuff, Baltimore's growth is very real. I don't think very much will change if we do or don't get a 60 story building actually. It will be a relatively small piece of a picture that includes all of the neighborhoods like Canton, Fells Point Federal Hill, Mt Vernon, Charles Village, etc. That's were I see feet on the street, people in restaurants, shopping and that's the draw that might make somebody decide to drop a tall one somewhere around here. Do 250 condos make more of an impact when they are stacked up high? Maybe some additional impact, but it's not the thing that makes this city work, it's just a small part. In a day-to-day sense, I think having 2 good new supermarkets downtown is more telling and important than one big building.
i agree with both you and MtV. in terms of this city's growth, we're moving in the right direction if we get a 60-story tower or not. but i must admit that seeing one of those monsters in the skyline would be (sorry, WILL be) great.
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