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Old March 5th, 2007, 07:29 AM   #1601
harlem87
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I thought the idea of building the hotel a mile away AT THAT TIME was a terrible idea... Especially since it was just an island out there for several years..

But look at how Inner Harbor East has grown around and because of that hotel, and think about how much more it will grow... can we really complain???

Besides, we are getting our west side hotel now.. sure theyre both ugly, but I think if we look at it now and in to the future.. it was a good idea to build it there... When IHE and the CBD are connected one day, we'll remember it all started with that convention center hotel built a mile away from the convention center..

Also.. at night, that hotel is lit up through the windows of paying guests.. Being a mile away didnt hurt business for it as most people thought it would. (it didnt help the convention center though. BUT, i dont know if you remember, but at the time, some people were pushing for two hotels to be built simultaneously, both on the east and the west, but naysayers were saying the city couldn't handle 2. Once again, people lacking faith in our GREAT city)
Or they just don't want Baltimore to be the Upscale Business Friendly city like most other Major cities on the East Coast and the South.
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Old March 5th, 2007, 07:39 AM   #1602
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That's true.

If it's rebuilt for freight, with more hazmats running more frequently, it would happen sooner and would serve no socio-economic benefit to the city, other than maintain the status quo and prevent more business loss to the port. Local businesses, commuters and residents would go through hell without them redeeming a benefit later on.

Eventually, if nothing is done, the HST will collapse (maybe 40 years?). We might as well do rebuild it at some point before then.

I can't quite remember how it worked years ago when trains did run through it (I wasn't around then! ). It was double tracked at the time. The freight trains are taller than most commuter trains, IIRC. (I'll check with my TRAC friends). Also, commuter runs infrequently enough so that sections of single-track may not necessarily prohibit service--like the CLR in its early years.

Nate
They need to prohibit Freight Trains from using the tunnel and have most freight trains byp-pass the city. Perform Maintanence in the tunnel and use it as a tunnel for a new Heavy Rail Subway line.

If they have to tear up Howard Street then So Be It because they can't lose that much business since 95% of the buildings along that corridor are now abandoned.
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Old March 5th, 2007, 07:45 AM   #1603
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its not a question of lacking faith. its not a question of baltimore not being a quality city. it IS a question of public funds being used to build something (or giving tax credits) that isn't what it was billed to be. i don't mind using bond isses for a convention venter hotel as long as its somewhere close to the convention center!!!!! i get pissed off when my already rediculously high tax dollars are used to build a hotel that's billed to be a convention center hotel that is a mile or so away from where it should be. the fact is that the marriott is speciffically designed to house a casino. at the time of its development, slots were a newand probable passable issue to the state. its still probable, but the idea of turning the inner harbor into atlantic city is fearsome. has anyone here been to atlantic city latley?!?!?!?!? its awful to say the least. i don't have an issue with slots at the tracks....lets leave gambling to the places that already have gambling. but expanding it to other parts of the city is NOT the way to go. shmoke allowed the marriot to be built because of the dollars patarakis threw at him. yes, it is successfull as a hotel. however it is NOT successfull as a convention center hotel. if it was, we, as a city, would not be building the hilton convention hotel. the need is still there. the hotel isn't.
So basically your saying that Downtown Baltimore is not good enough to handle more than 3 different Upscale Hotels.

If thats truee then yes that is an act of Baltimore hatred.
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Old March 5th, 2007, 07:48 AM   #1604
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I don't think anyone is questioning the social values of Columbia, most people are concerned about the aging built environment, it can definitely use some work. My biggest beef with Columbia is that it's sooo suburban, way too much residential development around just a mall, then people want to claim it's urban like Silver Spring or Bethesda, no way man. Someone mentioned that Columbia has only reached 4 million out of the planned 7 million sq/ft of office space propsed from 1960. Outside a few features I don't see how it's any different than the areas around Lakeforest. My biggest fear is that it will end up like Montgomery Village.

I've said this before, I'm not saying Columbia should have highrises all over the place but a more grid like urban design where midrises of about 5-10 stories are pushed to the street edge instead of the "tower in the park/garden style" look. I would like to see the mall demolished and turn into a mxed use community, emphasis on office space.
Reston, VA and Columbia are about the same age and Reston is attracting twice the amount of Upscale Office/Mixed Use Development than Columbia.

BTW- You are what you are accusing people of Columbia to be the only difference is your anti-Business views against Building Upscale Shopping Malls in Maryland.

So basically your saying that you want most if not all of the Indoor Malls in Maryland to be demolished to only be replaced by mixed use development which in the outcome more people in Maryland will continue to travel outside of the state towards Northern Virginia to spend their Retail Dollars at Tysons Corner, Pentagon City, etc.

You say that you support Office Development in Maryland but why the Hell should Marylanders be force to leave the state to spend their Retail Money because anti-Growth people like you don't want Maryland to have Multi-Level Indoor Upscale Retail Shopping Malls.

What needs to happen is KEEP THE MALL, and build a Mixed Use Development around tHe Mall JUST LIKE WHAT IS NOW BEING PROPOSED AT TYSONS CORNER MALL IN VIRGINIA.

Last edited by harlem87; March 5th, 2007 at 07:59 AM.
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Old March 5th, 2007, 08:14 AM   #1605
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Originally Posted by harlem87 View Post
They need to prohibit Freight Trains from using the tunnel and have most freight trains byp-pass the city. Perform Maintanence in the tunnel and use it as a tunnel for a new Heavy Rail Subway line.

If they have to tear up Howard Street then So Be It because they can't lose that much business since 95% of the buildings along that corridor are now abandoned.
Well, help get the $3 billion to $6 billion, then.
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Old March 5th, 2007, 09:14 AM   #1606
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quabex View Post
its not a question of lacking faith. its not a question of baltimore not being a quality city. it IS a question of public funds being used to build something (or giving tax credits) that isn't what it was billed to be. i don't mind using bond isses for a convention venter hotel as long as its somewhere close to the convention center!!!!! i get pissed off when my already rediculously high tax dollars are used to build a hotel that's billed to be a convention center hotel that is a mile or so away from where it should be. the fact is that the marriott is speciffically designed to house a casino. at the time of its development, slots were a newand probable passable issue to the state. its still probable, but the idea of turning the inner harbor into atlantic city is fearsome. has anyone here been to atlantic city latley?!?!?!?!? its awful to say the least. i don't have an issue with slots at the tracks....lets leave gambling to the places that already have gambling. but expanding it to other parts of the city is NOT the way to go. shmoke allowed the marriot to be built because of the dollars patarakis threw at him. yes, it is successfull as a hotel. however it is NOT successfull as a convention center hotel. if it was, we, as a city, would not be building the hilton convention hotel. the need is still there. the hotel isn't.
It might even be fair to say that the Marriott has taken some business away from the convention center. It has sufficent facilities on site to host small to mid-size groups. I've been to several conferences in other cities with 300-500 attendees where all the activities took place at the hotel property.
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Old March 5th, 2007, 11:44 AM   #1607
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City office space, for under $10
Baltimore Business Journal - March 2, 2007

It doesn't go a long way these days, but $9 a square foot can put your company into the Cordish Co.'s Power Plant Live.

The Martin Pollack Project Inc., a foster care firm, is vacating the 14,689-square-foot office space as part of a move to another part of the city. It retained Transwestern Commercial Services to find tenants to sublease the space.
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Old March 5th, 2007, 04:03 PM   #1608
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Are you sure it wasn't because he was African American, becacuse O'Malley was FAR worst of a Mayor than Schmoke ever was.
yes...i'm quite positive that race has nothing to do with my opinion. shmoke is actually a VERY smart man. he had great ideas but didn't have the political wherewithall to get his ideas into practice. smart man/bad politician.
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Old March 5th, 2007, 04:12 PM   #1609
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God...I blocked Harlem87's posts thinking I wouldnt have to read the nonsense he/she spews.
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Old March 5th, 2007, 04:28 PM   #1610
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God...I blocked Harlem87's posts thinking I wouldnt have to read the nonsense he/she spews.
Does the block work? If it does, I'm right behind you! I guess you do it through the User CP function? So far I've been taking the Amish route - SHUNNING.
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Old March 5th, 2007, 04:35 PM   #1611
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quabex View Post
no one can 'develope' those jobs. they are market driven.
I don't understand your point, so is retail. The point is upscale retail is hinged on the quality of employment in the area, it doesn't work the other way around.
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Old March 5th, 2007, 04:35 PM   #1612
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Originally Posted by 30 Floors Up View Post
Does the block work? If it does, I'm right behind you! I guess you do it through the User CP function? So far I've been taking the Amish route - SHUNNING.
me too!
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Old March 5th, 2007, 05:08 PM   #1613
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Does the block work? If it does, I'm right behind you! I guess you do it through the User CP function? So far I've been taking the Amish route - SHUNNING.
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Old March 5th, 2007, 05:11 PM   #1614
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I second thee emotion too he's sooo annoying
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Old March 5th, 2007, 05:36 PM   #1615
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Does the block work? If it does, I'm right behind you! I guess you do it through the User CP function? So far I've been taking the Amish route - SHUNNING.
Not really. It doesnt show what he/she posts per se, but it does acknowledge the post and says that it was blocked. I'd really prefer that my time not be wasted with that type of foolishness.
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Old March 5th, 2007, 07:59 PM   #1616
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Originally Posted by harlem87 View Post
They need to prohibit Freight Trains from using the tunnel and have most freight trains byp-pass the city. Perform Maintanence in the tunnel and use it as a tunnel for a new Heavy Rail Subway line.

If they have to tear up Howard Street then So Be It because they can't lose that much business since 95% of the buildings along that corridor are now abandoned.
I'll use this idotic rambling to discuss getontrac comments about the tunnels.

1. For someone so obsessed with left wing communists, you are eager for the govermnet to take away a private companies wholey owned property? commie.

2. Right no there is now viable way for the raillines to avoid the tunnels of Baltimore. There choices are either through Hagerstown then through Pa. or the eastern Shore. These alternatives are both out-of-the-way and do not serve the port well.

3. A cross harbor freight line is the only real solution. The engineering will be difficult but it can be done. New York is studing a similer proposal for a line from staten Island to Brooklyn. Additionally the federal govt. has shown a willingness to help fund rail relocations to ease traffic and improve railservice. See the Alameda corridor or the Kansas City flyover bridge as examples. We could declair it a security risk and suck up some homeland security funds.

4. The howard street tunnel was orginally built as a double track line and LR and/or HR cars are smaller than freight, so double tracking should not be an issue. The line is currently single tracked to allow container traffic. I have not seen any reports that the Howard tunnel will collapse, do you have any sources Getontrac?
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Old March 5th, 2007, 09:01 PM   #1617
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^The HST is a 110-115 year old shallow structure built through soft earth, with brick/stone arches constructed with primitive engineering techniques compared to today. If it is abandoned, without regular maintenence, it will eventually collapse. The B&P tunnels are much worse at this moment.

Others at TRAC have had discussions with people at MDOT (often in Freight Logistiscs) over the years, who've had dealings with CSX. I think it's simply a general consensus. I will confer and find out a more solid source for my proclamation.

I believe it comes to the point at which the O&M becomes so great that it becomes necessary to reconstruct the whole thing, and that is becoming a problem for CSX. In the 2002 MAROPS I-95 Corridor Report, a reconstruction of the tunnel was estimated at $231 million with a time line of 15-20 years, IIRC.

Nate
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Old March 5th, 2007, 09:28 PM   #1618
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Well, help get the $3 billion to $6 billion, then.
Casinos, Slot Machines, Conventional Business Events, attracting Fortune 500 HQ's, attracting a New NBA/NHL Team/Franchies etc.
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Old March 5th, 2007, 09:31 PM   #1619
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God...I blocked Harlem87's posts thinking I wouldnt have to read the nonsense he/she spews.
The truth hurts in which you can't handle.
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Old March 5th, 2007, 10:03 PM   #1620
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I'll say it once again... if certain a-hole posters are treated as if they don't exist, and their comments aren't referenced or responded to by any of us, then maybe certain a-hole posters will eventually just fade into oblivion and leave us to our nice friendly forum that we all know and love.
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