Nordic Aviation Thread

[Ringil]

Qatar airways have now started flying with A330 instead of the smaller A319 to Doha. I guess it's the same situation in Berlin as well. It's going fine for Qatar on Arn in other words

[staff]

Originally Posted by Ringil

Gardermoen is either not a very attractive market or dont try hard enough? :duno:

It's a combination of the low yielding Scandinavian market (we love low cost carriers - where do you think OSL's recent growth lies? LCCs of course!), the fact that OSL is competing with CPH and ARN, and of course that OSL is located in a region with a catchment area that isn't nearly as large as those of CPH (in particular) and ARN.
The equivalent of almost the whole population of Norway lives within an 1,5-2 hour drive from CPH for example.

[staff]

In other news; Delta Air Lines will upgrade its CPH route to a B767-400 this summer. I think it's a first for any airport in N&B to see a B764.

[Fab 5]

Originally Posted by staff

In other news; Delta Air Lines will upgrade its CPH route to a B767-400 this summer. I think it's a first for any airport in N&B to see a B764.

Good news, thanks.

[Fab 5]

FYI: http://www.business.dk/article/20080...asin/80227101/

[Blue Viking]

Originally Posted by Fab 5

FYI: http://www.business.dk/article/20080...asin/80227101/

Makes good sense. Service at CPH has deteriorated badly (but it has also improved a bit lately) and of course everyone wants to fly point to point. Why connect when you don't have to.

[IceCheese]

Originally Posted by Fab 5

FYI: http://www.business.dk/article/20080...asin/80227101/

This shows that they know they're issues, and that's good. Still CPH + management will have to be really great to reclaim the position they had those years ago. One should think that Copenhagen constantly grows closer to N/S/FI as infrastructure improves, but they really don't. They will have to grow some muscles to beat the aviation-boomers of Helsinki and Oslo. But otherwise an interesting article!

(I have to apologize, but I lack the ability to not comment on how the Danish word for "rullebane" is "runway"... Sorry!)

[staff]

As has been said; good that we're not dealing with hybris, and that the management are well aware of the competition.
That been said - the only serious competition in the foreseeable future to CPH still is - ARN. Those two are and remains the dynamic long haul business hubs in the Nordics.

[muster]

Originally Posted by staff

As has been said; good that we're not dealing with hybris, and that the management are well aware of the competition.
That been said - the only serious competition in the foreseeable future to CPH still is - ARN. Those two are and remains the dynamic long haul business hubs in the Nordics.

WOW, you clearly dont see the writing on the wall. Forseeable future, what is that? I`l be surprised if Copenhagen and SAS still are in lead after 2015.

[NorthStar77]

Btw, Norwegian announced yesterday that they will start direct flights to Dubai from Oslo and Stockholm October 26'th. 2 times a week from Oslo and 3 times a week from Stockholm. Prices will start on 999 NOK each way.

http://www.norwegian.no/sw32340.asp

[staff]

muster,
In the lead in what? Passenger numbers? Quite irrelevant - in Norway pretty much the only choice of domestic travel is by plane, while in a country like Denmark there is practically no domestic traffic. Have a look at the international passenger numbers which actually mean something. Still though, pax numbers are quite irrelevant when talking about the leading airport in a region like Scandinavia.
As I stated in my previous post, ARN is the main (and only) competitor to CPH in the foreseeable future, ie. the next 15-20 years or so. HEL has an edge with Finnair's Asian traffic, but as long as it remains half the size of CPH it isn't really a competitor for being the leading N&B airport.
As long as OSL remains mainly a domestic, low-cost, non-biz air travel center, it will not compete with neither CPH or ARN among the big boys.

Great news with Norwegians new Dubai flight! And from ARN too! I'm sure it will be very popular.
Still it's by no means a competitor to QR's DOH-ARN flight or SK's CPH-DBX flight as long at it is flown using a small narrowbody B737 jam packed with economy seats. Business travelers will stay away.

[Vermeer]

Originally Posted by staff

muster,
In the lead in what? Passenger numbers? Quite irrelevant - in Norway pretty much the only choice of domestic travel is by plane, while in a country like Denmark there is practically no domestic traffic. Have a look at the international passenger numbers which actually mean something. Still though, pax numbers are quite irrelevant when talking about the leading airport in a region like Scandinavia.
As I stated in my previous post, ARN is the main (and only) competitor to CPH in the foreseeable future, ie. the next 15-20 years or so. HEL has an edge with Finnair's Asian traffic, but as long as it remains half the size of CPH it isn't really a competitor for being the leading N&B airport.
As long as OSL remains mainly a domestic, low-cost, non-biz air travel center, it will not compete with neither CPH or ARN among the big boys.

Great news with Norwegians new Dubai flight! And from ARN too! I'm sure it will be very popular.
Still it's by no means a competitor to QR's DOH-ARN flight or SK's CPH-DBX flight as long at it is flown using a small narrowbody B737 jam packed with economy seats. Business travelers will stay away.

I love reading this thread. As a Dutch I am really impressed. For me CPN is a small airport. Less than half the size of the big airports in Europe. You say that number of passengers are uninteresting when it comes to the size of an airport? Is it length of the runway or the numbers of runways that count or is it the numbers of McDonalds? I am naive enough to think that a passenger is a passenger and it doesn’t matter whether the passenger is travelling from Luleå to Stockholm or from Copenhagen to Oslo. The result must be that Hartsfield-Jackson, Atlanta or O’Hare, Chicago are small airports are small, because most of their passengers are domestic.

Why do you have this crush on CPN? Gardermoen is a much more beautiful and modern airport. You have the position you have because SAS is still the biggest airline operating in Scandinavia (strange when we know it is one of the most unreliable in Europe), not because Danes are flying more then Swedes and Norwegians. In the moment SAS is history your beloved CPN will maybe be able to compare with Rotterdam Airport.

[Joka]

Finnair to acquire three additional Embraer aircraft

Finnair has ordered three more Embraer 190 aircraft. The aircraft will be delivered in 2010-2011. The Embraer 190 is a 100-seat jet aircraft, which Finnair uses in its domestic and European traffic.

"Through the order we have ensured the availability of capacity under present conditions. The airline manufacturers' order books are full for years ahead and we forecast that our European traffic will grow in the wake of Asian traffic," says SVP, Finnair Scheduled Passenger Traffic Henrik Arle.

Source

[Fab 5]

Originally Posted by Vermeer

1: For me CPN is a small airport. Less than half the size of the big airports in Europe.

2: Gardermoen is a much more beautiful and modern airport.

3: You have the position you have because SAS is still the biggest airline operating in Scandinavia (strange when we know it is one of the most unreliable in Europe), not because Danes are flying more then Swedes and Norwegians.

4: In the moment SAS is history your beloved CPN will maybe be able to compare with Rotterdam Airport.

Here we go again... Why always this aversion towards CPH? You almost have to be from Norway to think like that – are you working undercover?

Ad 1: Where is your cut? You say you are Dutch so Schiphol must be one of your points of reference. OK. Your "big airports of Europe" can only, following your logic, be the top-5 then (passenger-wise). Currently CPH is number 17, however, the airports lie very close ranking-wise all the way up to and including no. 10, which is Orly. In Europe, CPH is a big airport.

Ad 2: You are talking about an airport, CPH, which was, in 1999 and 2001, celebrated as the world's best airport by respected ASQ. Wallpaper chose CPH as the world’s best airport in 1998, 1999, 2000 and 2001. In 2001, 2002, 2003, 2004, 2005 and 2006 it was chosen as the best airport in Europe by Business Traveller and ASQ. Not any other airport, including Schiphol, has ever achieved this before. OSL is a brand-new airport - have you ever been to CPH? In 2006 and 2007 the airport began experiencing some difficulties, however, they are handling these issues investing more than 200 millions dollars a year improving PAX experience etc. (that's even more than Avinor is planning on spending at OSL before 2015 in their respective strategy).

Ad 3: Do you know something about airport pick-up areas? CPH's sheer size is not just because of SAS using it as their main hub. The whole "Øresundsregionen" includes almost 4 million people within short distance of the airport making the region, by far, the largest pick-up area for a Scandinavian airport (Norway has 4,7 million inhabitants in total).

Ad 4: So following your logic again, CPH will be reduced to around a million PAX P.A. if SAS goes out of business. Controlling for my previous statement on pick-up area, do you know something about economics and market mechanisms?

[Dan]

Norwegian to Dubai? Is this the first real long-distance flight for them? Not many budget airlines fly that far...can't be too comfortable for so many hours!

[Yellowinc]

Originally Posted by Dan1113

Norwegian to Dubai? Is this the first real long-distance flight for them? Not many budget airlines fly that far...can't be too comfortable for so many hours!

Its amazing what people will put up with when it comes to good offers, at least in the beginning, before the novelty wears off!! Think I might pay a bit extra for the comfort on that distance

[muster]

Originally Posted by Yellowinc

Its amazing what people will put up with when it comes to good offers, at least in the beginning, before the novelty wears off!! Think I might pay a bit extra for the comfort on that distance

Well, if you can afford 25 kr you`ll get the extra comfort.



article

900 kr to Dubai aint much. Why not use the saved money on a better hotel?

[Fab 5]

Billund up 22,2 % (17,7 %) in February.

[Ringil]

Originally Posted by NorthStar77

Btw, Norwegian announced yesterday that they will start direct flights to Dubai from Oslo and Stockholm October 26'th. 2 times a week from Oslo and 3 times a week from Stockholm. Prices will start on 999 NOK each way.

http://www.norwegian.no/sw32340.asp

Interesting that a norwegian airline will fly more frequant from Arlanda, than Gardermoen to Dubai, even though Arlanda is smaller and not even the hub for Norwegian but hey, I don't complain!

[Yellowinc]

Originally Posted by muster

Well, if you can afford 25 kr you`ll get the extra comfort.



article

900 kr to Dubai aint much. Why not use the saved money on a better hotel?

You are right, and it don't look to bad actually. It is a new aircraft as well isn't it? And it is good Norwegian challenging SAS, making travelling more accessible for a wider audience, in price and departing airport.