daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > World Development News Forums > General Urban Developments > DN Archives



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old September 18th, 2014, 04:59 PM   #10341
rlw777
Registered User
 
rlw777's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 300
Likes (Received): 469

Quote:
Originally Posted by citybooster View Post
My bad, I'm fixated for some reason on screwdriver but looks like a corkscrew or drill bit...it still looks like it belongs in Dubai than Chicago. And I hope that Calatrava travesty doesn't get built as the showcase tower of Chicago. There are a lot of ways to get creative and compelling without it just looking like it's trying too hard to stand out ..and it would like a sore thumb.
It doesn't have enough Disney World kitsch to be a Dubai design.
rlw777 no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old September 18th, 2014, 05:58 PM   #10342
rauthier
BANNED
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 28
Likes (Received): 14

this is what it most reminds me of

__________________

j-biz, iamtheSTIG liked this post
rauthier no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 18th, 2014, 07:34 PM   #10343
ThatOneGuy
Psst! Check my signature!
 
ThatOneGuy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Toronto - Bucharest - Freeport
Posts: 21,489

But those look like ugly drills, right?
ThatOneGuy no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 18th, 2014, 07:59 PM   #10344
MarshallKnight
Registered User
 
MarshallKnight's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: From the Bay to L.A.
Posts: 2,342
Likes (Received): 3588

Alright, we can keep boiling it down to object comparisons, or we can just recognize that some of us simply don't like twisty designs and find them silly. Whimsical skyscrapers are fine for some -- that's what we have opinions for -- and all Dubai-aspersions aside, something like this Spire would probably fit the in a lot of European cities...

But for me, what makes Chicago's skyline so great is that its aesthetic is so "no nonsense." There's a utilitarian toughness to Sears, John Hancock and Aon that reflects the culture of the Great Lakes. This frilly, fancy, extremely European tower, does not fit that sensibility. That's all.
__________________

Middle-Island liked this post
MarshallKnight no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 18th, 2014, 08:05 PM   #10345
Hemeroscopium
BANNED
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: MALIBU
Posts: 110
Likes (Received): 404

Quote:
Originally Posted by citybooster View Post
My bad, I'm fixated for some reason on screwdriver but looks like a corkscrew or drill bit...it still looks like it belongs in Dubai than Chicago. And I hope that Calatrava travesty doesn't get built as the showcase tower of Chicago. There are a lot of ways to get creative and compelling without it just looking like it's trying too hard to stand out ..and it would like a sore thumb.
No way!...have you ever been to Chicago budy??no other design could enhance the skyline better than this truly gorgeous building.Your poor and desperate statement makes me think about some red neck visiting the guggenheim who would state his opinion about a Kandinsky.
What the hell!!!why so much hate about Calatrava?????
I guess most of the people who denigrate the Spire do not even realize they would LOVE it....in black!
As a reminder for those who have a lack of imagination, the design evokes an indian campfire(the smoke) and is related to Chicago(indian name)history.

Last edited by Hemeroscopium; September 18th, 2014 at 08:36 PM.
Hemeroscopium no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 19th, 2014, 05:12 AM   #10346
Ivan the Immigrant
Ex user
 
Ivan the Immigrant's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 1,351
Likes (Received): 2469

Well, i'm not too much of expert, but in my opinion this so called "screwdriver" building would maybe fit much better in New York and it's neogothic architecture. Chicago maybe deserves much more "classical" lines....Maybe we should build something more rectangular here, with two antennas....
But as i said, i'm not much of expert...
Ivan the Immigrant no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 19th, 2014, 06:14 AM   #10347
(:
Registered User
 
(:'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Posts: 318
Likes (Received): 229

I have to disagree with everything you said! This wouldn't fit well in NY but would fit better than a two antennae tower in Chicago. Chicago needs something new and bold! Just look at how trump has enhanced the skyline! Though the spire would be the skylines most dramatic change since Sears.
__________________

Chicity747, ExCaliBourBG, Hot Rod liked this post
(: no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 19th, 2014, 06:48 AM   #10348
Ivan the Immigrant
Ex user
 
Ivan the Immigrant's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 1,351
Likes (Received): 2469

Quote:
Originally Posted by (: View Post
I have to disagree with everything you said! This wouldn't fit well in NY but would fit better than a two antennae tower in Chicago. Chicago needs something new and bold! Just look at how trump has enhanced the skyline! Though the spire would be the skylines most dramatic change since Sears.
It might be as you say. However i noticed one thing. As you move inland USA, there is more and more conservative architecture represented. Coastal cities are more liberal. That is the reason why i think this kind of building would fit much more in cities like New York or Los Angeles. Maybe even San Francisco. But not in Chicago, neither in Houston...
But as i said, i'm not much of expert..
__________________

onewtclover liked this post
Ivan the Immigrant no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 19th, 2014, 04:34 PM   #10349
rauthier
BANNED
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 28
Likes (Received): 14

chicago architecture is NOT conservative.
chicago is where architects can play.
__________________

Chicity747, Hot Rod liked this post
rauthier no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 19th, 2014, 05:47 PM   #10350
Chicity747
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Posts: 10
Likes (Received): 4

While I think everyone has their right to like or dislike the Spire design, I happen to like it, I think all the talk about it not belonging in Chicago is kind of ridiculous. I think Chicago is the perfect place for something bold and different, especially with our skyscraper history. One of the great things about Chicago is the diversity of skyscrapers, from Sears, to Marina City, to the Aon Bulding, to the Aqua. If people didn't try to add something new to the Chicago skyline it would be very boring.
__________________

Hot Rod liked this post
Chicity747 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 19th, 2014, 05:59 PM   #10351
JMGA196
Registered User
 
JMGA196's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Guatemala City
Posts: 4,570
Likes (Received): 5147

If Chicago Spire is just a screwdiver, Burj Khalifa is a needle, Seagram Building is just a shoe box and Woolworth is just a pencil...
__________________
follow my new photography account on instagram @miguel_alecio

Mimar Sinan - Sebastian Treese - Sejima - Nishizawa - Pawson - Horia Creangă - McKim, Mead & White - Gord Scott - Peter Pennoyer - Charles Hilton - Annabelle Selldorf - Roman and Williams - Morris Adjmi - Diller Scofidio + Renfro

★★★ MAKE ARCHITECTURE GREAT AGAIN! ★★★

iamtheSTIG liked this post
JMGA196 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 20th, 2014, 04:28 AM   #10352
onewtclover
Registered User
 
onewtclover's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: New York, New York
Posts: 1,171
Likes (Received): 1028

I honestly do not know why, but I would love for this design to be in New York. I guess somewhere in the midst of the skyscraper plateau. If you Chicagoeans (did I say that right? Is there a term like New Yorkers for people in Chicago?) hate this design so much, give it to us. There has been some criticism of Calatrava's work with the Transportation Hub, but I don't think this is like his other works.

And I don't think another building with two antennas would be good for Chicago. Would we build a 2000-foot glass version of the Empire State Building? I think the Sears and Hancock have become "classics", just as the ESB and Chrysler have, but does One World Trade Center look like the Empire State Building?

A 2000-footer would be noticed even in China, so don't complain so much. Be happy. Be content. Chicago was made for innovative designs. Build this. Build until you can't build anymore.
__________________

citybooster, iamtheSTIG, Assemblage23 liked this post
onewtclover no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 20th, 2014, 07:38 PM   #10353
munchymunch
Minneapolis==>Chicago
 
munchymunch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Hometown of FLW
Posts: 1,415
Likes (Received): 1165

Hell I want the spire, and so do a lot of people from Chicago.
__________________

onewtclover, iamtheSTIG, Hot Rod liked this post
munchymunch no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 21st, 2014, 05:20 PM   #10354
generalscarr
Registered User
 
generalscarr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 333
Likes (Received): 425

Quote:
Originally Posted by onewtclover View Post
I honestly do not know why, but I would love for this design to be in New York. I guess somewhere in the midst of the skyscraper plateau. If you Chicagoeans (did I say that right? Is there a term like New Yorkers for people in Chicago?) hate this design so much, give it to us. There has been some criticism of Calatrava's work with the Transportation Hub, but I don't think this is like his other works. And I don't think another building with two antennas would be good for Chicago. Would we build a 2000-foot glass version of the Empire State Building? I think the Sears and Hancock have become "classics", just as the ESB and Chrysler have, but does One World Trade Center look like the Empire State Building? A 2000-footer would be noticed even in China, so don't complain so much. Be happy. Be content. Chicago was made for innovative designs. Build this. Build until you can't build anymore.
I wouldn't be a huge fan of the idea of building it in NYC. I don't think the birthday candle design would be very appropriate for New York.
Also, we already have one Calatrava project that's 2 billion dollars over budget, not sure we need one more.
__________________

onewtclover, citybooster liked this post
generalscarr no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 22nd, 2014, 05:28 PM   #10355
SomeKindOfBug
Registered User
 
SomeKindOfBug's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Manchester
Posts: 1,042
Likes (Received): 1035

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivan the Immigrant View Post
It might be as you say. However i noticed one thing. As you move inland USA, there is more and more conservative architecture represented. Coastal cities are more liberal. That is the reason why i think this kind of building would fit much more in cities like New York or Los Angeles. Maybe even San Francisco. But not in Chicago, neither in Houston...
But as i said, i'm not much of expert..
St Louis' Gateway Arch is literally a thousand miles from the ocean.

The idea that the American interior is more conservative is nonsense.

Hell, Chicago invented the skyscraper, and they've been pushing boundaries ever since.

There is no better place on Earth for this building - architecturally speaking of course. It's location makes it prominent from the shoreline, standing away from the rest of the city. It's more of a lighthouse than a drillbit, and it reflects the coastal nature of Chicago more than any building in New York or Los Angeles.

Chicago is a city of spires, or rather pinnacles. Much more than LA, San Fran or New York. NYC in particular has more of a plateau nature to its skyline - although this has been broken up a little by the new WTC - whereas Chicago has been clearly defined by pillar-like skyscrapers for decades. Each of its major spires stands alone - Sears, Hancock, Trump, Aon - and they all have that '**** this, we're going five-blades' attitude of just built it taller, deal with the consequences later.

The Chicago Spire only works when you can see the full height, base to roof, to appreciate the spiral and the curvature and the subtle tapering. If it was placed right in the heart of New York's midtown, it would just be a weird Gherkin-esque tip jutting out from the city's ceiling. A completely wasted design.

I mean, there's plenty of reasons not to build it in Chicago. But they're almost all financial or economic. The only shame is the city hasn't got the need for a Spire like this, even though it is the perfect place to build one from an aesthetic standing.
SomeKindOfBug no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 22nd, 2014, 08:21 PM   #10356
GunnerJacket
Oh look - a doughnut!
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicken City, GA
Posts: 8,126
Likes (Received): 3197

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivan the Immigrant
However i noticed one thing. As you move inland USA, there is more and more conservative architecture represented. Coastal cities are more liberal.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SomeKindOfBug View Post
St Louis' Gateway Arch is literally a thousand miles from the ocean.

The idea that the American interior is more conservative is nonsense.

Hell, Chicago invented the skyscraper, and they've been pushing boundaries ever since.
Ivan's point does have some merit. The Gateway arch is more sculptural art than true skyscraper, and as it's based on classical form it's level of daring is hardly extreme. More importantly I think the point he's trying to make is that most mid- and highrise buildings throughout the US are little more than simple ventures in cladding and crowns for conventional buildings. Much of this is rooted in the cost-efficiency factor and the lack of need for any flamboyancy. One needn't be extraordinary in Indianapolis or Denver, but some degree of whimsy is almost required now in NYC.

To wit, yes Chicago is the essential birthplace of the skyscraper, but the vast majority of its jewels are at least conservative of form, particularly the more famous ones. Much of this has to do with the relative lack of abstraction within the genre across the globe. Economics means builders rarely stray from the norm at this scale, save maybe in the details and ornamenture. Seriously, how many skyscrapers are out that that would be truly devoid of conventional boxy form? Plus Chicago is noted for the White city movement and all the classical buildings that define many of its great public spaces and views. The city is revered for the museums and the Tribune tower, not so much the latest Trump venture.

All that being said I think this is a "Chicago" skyscraper. A modern day relative of the Hancock, taking a simple convention and giving it a modest twist that remains guised in classicism. (OMO, anyway)
__________________
"How can anybody be enlightened? Truth is after all so poorly lit."

MarshallKnight liked this post
GunnerJacket no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 22nd, 2014, 09:39 PM   #10357
SomeKindOfBug
Registered User
 
SomeKindOfBug's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Manchester
Posts: 1,042
Likes (Received): 1035

Quote:
Originally Posted by GunnerJacket View Post
Ivan's point does have some merit. The Gateway arch is more sculptural art than true skyscraper, and as it's based on classical form it's level of daring is hardly extreme. More importantly I think the point he's trying to make is that most mid- and highrise buildings throughout the US are little more than simple ventures in cladding and crowns for conventional buildings. Much of this is rooted in the cost-efficiency factor and the lack of need for any flamboyancy. One needn't be extraordinary in Indianapolis or Denver, but some degree of whimsy is almost required now in NYC.

To wit, yes Chicago is the essential birthplace of the skyscraper, but the vast majority of its jewels are at least conservative of form, particularly the more famous ones. Much of this has to do with the relative lack of abstraction within the genre across the globe. Economics means builders rarely stray from the norm at this scale, save maybe in the details and ornamenture. Seriously, how many skyscrapers are out that that would be truly devoid of conventional boxy form? Plus Chicago is noted for the White city movement and all the classical buildings that define many of its great public spaces and views. The city is revered for the museums and the Tribune tower, not so much the latest Trump venture.

All that being said I think this is a "Chicago" skyscraper. A modern day relative of the Hancock, taking a simple convention and giving it a modest twist that remains guised in classicism. (OMO, anyway)
Well it's the old 'Seinfeld isn't funny' argument, isn't it?

The reason a lot of Chicago's skyscrapers look so plain and generic today is because they were so revolutionary when they were built that everyone else has since copied them, making the style ubiquitous and overplayed.

Back in 1973, the Sears Tower, despite being quite boxy, was as daring and strange as the worst oddities of modern-day Dubai. Particularly in construction and engineering. I mean, there aren't many +300m skyscrapers in the world that are jet black and have their framework on the outside, yet Chicago has two of them.

I kinda feel that if two of the most popular and defining architectural styles of the 20th century are named after your city, it's disingenuous to say that middle America is conservative with skyscraper design. Especially when the flipside of the argument was that coastal American cities are some kind of liberal hotbed for architecture. Los Angeles hasn't built a truly exciting skyscraper for fifty years.
SomeKindOfBug no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 22nd, 2014, 10:56 PM   #10358
GunnerJacket
Oh look - a doughnut!
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Chicken City, GA
Posts: 8,126
Likes (Received): 3197

Point taken, though I would argue we're quibbling over what constitutes conservative skyscraper design, something which will arguably mean different things to different people. Most laymen wouldn't regard the construction methodology when considering whether or not a building is conservative, but rather what's foremost consideration is the degree to which the building is either showy or exhibiting a truly unique form. To wit, I'd contend the Sears Tower was indeed avante garde but hardly pursuing the gaudiness of Dubai's feaux-Vegas veneer due to the old form-follows-function principle.

Like many things architecture, common visitors and viewers are often unaware of the art and engineering that contribute to a building's lore and appeal. They'll view structures with a less refined eye, and thus their brand of "conservative" design will be decidedly different than someone within the craft. Maybe the term we should be applying here is reserved rather than conservative, as well as recognizing Chicago is an outlier to the rest of America's heartland? (Think Houston or Denver.) A thought to consider, anyway.

Cheers.
__________________
"How can anybody be enlightened? Truth is after all so poorly lit."

MarshallKnight liked this post
GunnerJacket no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 24th, 2014, 11:51 PM   #10359
munchymunch
Minneapolis==>Chicago
 
munchymunch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Hometown of FLW
Posts: 1,415
Likes (Received): 1165

Better by the Day

http://www.law360.com/articles/580346

Mystery Lender May Help Chicago Spire Avoid Bankruptcy


Quote:
Illinois-based real estate developer Atlas Apartment Holdings LLC may have found a lender to help with its $135 million plan to save the on-hold Chicago Spire from bankruptcy, according to court documents.

According to a confidential letter sent to Atlas in late August that was made publicly available Friday, the undisclosed party feels "highly confident" that it could arrange the loan needed for the $135 million plan.

“[Redacted] is highly confident that as sole lead arranger and sole bookrunner, underwriter or placement agent it could structure,...
__________________

j-biz, iamtheSTIG, desertpunk liked this post
munchymunch no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old September 26th, 2014, 03:20 AM   #10360
Lezuck
Registered User
 
Lezuck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Bilbao City
Posts: 3,735
Likes (Received): 405

Scenes from the next movie of the Wachowski brothers, Jupiter Ascending. They film some cuts in Bilbao. Is that the spire tower?





And this is the original view
__________________

thepiterwayne, Victhor liked this post
Lezuck no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
chicago, santiago calatrava, spire, tallest, tower

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 01:44 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

Hosted by Blacksun, dedicated to this site too!
Forum server management by DaiTengu