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Old May 11th, 2013, 09:38 PM   #4441
MichiH
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Puležan View Post
A1 Vrgorac-Ploče interchange, predicted opening date: June-October 2013
A1 Ploče interchange-Metković interchange (A10): October 2013
A10 BIH border-Metković interchange (A1): June-October 2013
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Originally Posted by zezi View Post
Latest news: Will be done before 01.07.2013.
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpo...ostcount=12469
Will the Bosnian section be finished or be opened in June? If it would be opened, the Croatian A10 must also be opened in June - and not in October as announced.

I guess the entire motorway from Vrgorac to Bijaca will be opened at once.
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Old May 11th, 2013, 09:40 PM   #4442
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Are my eyes deceiving me, or are they seriously building two separate border control terminals there?

I would have thought that after the success of Licko Petrovo Solo, they would stick with the modern approach of one terminal for both countries?
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Old May 11th, 2013, 09:47 PM   #4443
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When one country (Croatia, from 1.7.) is an EU member and the other is not (Bosnia & Herzegovina, and won't be for sure in next 10 years), than separate border crossings are a necessity.
There is a precedence too: in 1990s Croatia asked Slovenia to build one terminal on Obrežje/Bregana border crossing, but Slovene authorities refused with explanation that these countries won't enter the EU at the same time, so the separate terminals had to be built.
Comparison with Licko Petrovo Selo is not logical one, because this crossing will not have fitosanitary facilities.

Last edited by darko06; May 11th, 2013 at 09:55 PM.
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Old May 11th, 2013, 09:50 PM   #4444
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Puležan View Post
So, motorway to the very border line, and from the border on the southern side, would be practically useless and vaste of money.
Exactly. But my suggestion is to restart the southern motorway near Slano (25km to the border). The northern motorway is currently built up to more than 10km away from the border. So it doesn't matter where Neum will be passed! Any variant will remain possible.

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Originally Posted by Puležan View Post
Don't forget the fact that the adriatic-ionian route is not defined yet, so no one knows if the motorway further south will go through BIH (Herzegovina) or through Croatian territory to Montenegro
Well, that's absolutely insignificant. If Croatia would have a motorway up to the Montenegro border, the traffic would use that route, and no further route will be needed.
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Old May 11th, 2013, 09:50 PM   #4445
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Was an undersea tunnel considered for the Pelješac crossing? The Norwegians build these kind of tunnels at relatively low prices.
If this solution can be verified as economically better than the bridge, why not?
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Old May 11th, 2013, 09:52 PM   #4446
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
Exactly. But my suggestion is to restart the southern motorway near Slano (25km to the border). The northern motorway is currently built up to more than 10km away from the border. So it doesn't matter where Neum will be passed! Any variant will remain possible. ... If Croatia would have a motorway up to the Montenegro border, the traffic would use that route, and no further route will be needed.
I absolutely agree with this. Maybe this is a way to go...
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Old May 11th, 2013, 09:52 PM   #4447
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The problem with a motorway towards the HR/MNE border is that the terrain further into Montenegro is extremely disadvantageous to build a motorway through. That is why the northern route via Trebinje and Nikšić is proposed, it follows easier terrain.
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Old May 11th, 2013, 10:02 PM   #4448
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
The problem with a motorway towards the HR/MNE border is that the terrain further into Montenegro is extremely disadvantageous to build a motorway through. That is why the northern route via Trebinje and Nikšić is proposed, it follows easier terrain.
Ok. But building a motorway from Slano to Dubrovnik (or maybe to Cilipi) will take a long time. The stretch from Cilipi to the border is not such important and apart from that easy terrain (easy to continue in case of a southern adriatic-ionian route).

A northern route through Bosnia will surely branch east of Dubrovnik. So to build a Dubrovnik motorway bypass will not be useless.
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Old May 11th, 2013, 10:04 PM   #4449
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It's only looking easier, after Debeli Brijeg in MNE you only need a bridge crossing Boka fjord and perhaps two or three tunnels to reach southern exit of Sozina tunnel, of course under condition that this so-called parkway posess construction speed of no more than 110 kmh, which will be enough for AADTs in next 10 to 20 years. If this route shoud be a touristical connector than it's supposed location is near the coast, not some 50-100 km in the mountains, if it would be located in Trebinje-Bileća-Nikšić-Podgorica area.

Last edited by darko06; May 11th, 2013 at 10:16 PM.
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Old May 11th, 2013, 10:07 PM   #4450
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Don't forget that for Trebinje-Bileća-Nikšić-Podgorica route you will also need a minimum of three 5 km long tunnels, furthermore this route will be climbing to at least 800-1000 m above the sea level between Trebinje and Nikšić, so there will be winter conditions.
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Old May 11th, 2013, 10:11 PM   #4451
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Between Trebinje and Nikšić it's not much better, even worse because motorway would go between 800 and 1000 m asl, again with many tunnels. It would go through nothing and would be good just for transit.
It is better to go close to the coast at least it would pick tourist and local traffic.
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Old May 11th, 2013, 10:13 PM   #4452
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
Ok. But building a motorway from Slano to Dubrovnik (or maybe to Cilipi) will take a long time. The stretch from Cilipi to the border is not such important and apart from that easy terrain (easy to continue in case of a southern adriatic-ionian route).

A northern route through Bosnia will surely branch east of Dubrovnik. So to build a Dubrovnik motorway bypass will not be useless.
The real problem here is only a tunnel from Mokošica to Župa Dubrovačka and a few kilometers in Duboka Ljuta bay, where perhaps large viaducts shall be made.
However, today Dubrovnik need a beltway in an expressway/parkway profile (2x2, with or without hard shoulders); and a connection of the same type from this beltway to the Dubrovnik Airport (Ćilipi).
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Old May 11th, 2013, 10:14 PM   #4453
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keber View Post
Between Trebinje and Nikšić it's not much better, even worse because motorway would go between 800 and 1000 m asl, again with many tunnels. It would go through nothing and would be good just for transit.
It is better to go close to the coast at least it would pick tourist and local traffic.
Hallelujah!
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Old May 11th, 2013, 10:15 PM   #4454
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I agree a southern route would serve tourist traffic much better. However all coastal areas are urbanized, I think you'll end up with most of the route in tunnels anyway. A route via the Radovići peninsula would require a pretty spectacular bridge.
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Old May 11th, 2013, 10:25 PM   #4455
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Look, I can agree with your argumentation, but wasn't the coastal area from Genova to Marseille pretty well urbanised when the Ventimiglia motorway was constructed? I drove few weeks ago to Hercegnovi, to see this part of Montenegro, and they really need a parkway (2x2) from the border to Zelenika, because in this city there is speed limit of 40 kmh enforced by a patrol on every let's say 2000 m?
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Old May 11th, 2013, 10:29 PM   #4456
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And due to the fact that I drove through Big Sur twice, first from Monterey to San Luis Obispo (SLO), and in subesquent year from SLO to Monterey, I can assure all of you that a few spectacular bridges (okay, in Big Sur they are 1+1) are wonderful addition to a really fantastic natural phenomenon.
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Old May 11th, 2013, 10:31 PM   #4457
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
Will the Bosnian section be finished or be opened in June? If it would be opened, the Croatian A10 must also be opened in June - and not in October as announced.

I guess the entire motorway from Vrgorac to Bijaca will be opened at once.
On both side of border is the same situation. In July 2013 new border crossing will be finished and opened up to first exit only, with conection to local roads. And it will be used like that until motorways are finished. Croatian will be finished in October, and Bosnian next year.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Was an undersea tunnel considered for the Pelješac crossing? The Norwegians build these kind of tunnels at relatively low prices.
Although channel is not deep, botom is soft mostly mud ( River Neretva ) up to 100 meters from sea surface. That makes tunnel more expensive then bridge
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Old May 11th, 2013, 10:32 PM   #4458
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And with knowledge that the Montenegrines are people with taste in clothing, I am very sure that this few bridges would be beautifully spectacular.
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Old May 11th, 2013, 10:43 PM   #4459
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
A route via the Radovići peninsula would require a pretty spectacular bridge.
True, it has already been designed:


http://www.ponting.si/media/ebook/index.html
Most of the motorway on the coast between beginning of Pelješac peninsula to Bar would be similar to Ventimiglia - Genova motorway, running mostly between 100 and 200 m asl.
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Old May 12th, 2013, 12:26 AM   #4460
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
A northern route through Bosnia will surely branch east of Dubrovnik.
Most maps show it by Ploče.
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