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Old July 10th, 2013, 01:05 PM   #4741
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hofburg View Post
how is the junction with D8? is it grade separated?
Yes it is. Check here
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Old July 10th, 2013, 02:41 PM   #4742
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thanks. I see it's exactly in place of this former crossroad https://maps.google.si/?ll=43.34865,...,40.84,,0,3.56
must look pretty cool below those rocks.
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Old July 10th, 2013, 03:22 PM   #4743
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Considering construction machines in first picture I presume picture is not taken from finished road.

Interesting that there are four lanes from tunnel to D8 - something that Split still doesn't have.
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Old July 10th, 2013, 03:58 PM   #4744
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Original post is from June 25th, so pictures must be older than that...
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Old July 10th, 2013, 06:40 PM   #4745
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17 june 2013





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Old July 11th, 2013, 01:10 PM   #4746
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Old July 11th, 2013, 03:03 PM   #4747
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verso View Post
I don't know why they still mention the old regime with border pass and then at the end add that you don't need it any more. It looks confusing. I get it that you still need a border pass, but that you can now get it at the border? And you can only stay in the local area, so you can't go to Ljubljana or Split.
That's exactly how I understand it - those with local border passes can still use them as before, including the possibility of crossing the border at any point. The difference is that the 'local border crossings' are now opened up for citizens of the EU/EEA/CH - subject to the restrictions defined in the local border traffic agreement.

It seems absolutely bizarre that they didn't simply agree to change those crossings to intrastate crossings - but it could be that they don't want to encourage traffic at those points.

The real question is how they will enforce these passes - it seems pretty pointless to hand out a pass to an EU citizen that can go anywhere anyway.

The only other logical explanation is that it means is that EU/EEA/CH citizens can now use those crossings freely, while those who don't require a visa to enter the other state can use them too, only subject to staying in the local area. Someone needs to investigate

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How many international road border crossings are there between Romania and Hungary? I have a map of Hungary from 1994 and there were just 4 intl. road BCs on the entire RO-H border. At the same time there were already 20 intl. road BCs between Croatia and Slovenia, so the border has been quite open even after independence.
Was the Croatian/Slovenian border well guarded at any point post-independence? I've got several books that suggest that it was only when Slovenia was preparing to join the EU that they started to take the border seriously.

(for what it's worth - I spent some time exploring the border and was never questioned once, despite probably making a few accidental crossings...)
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Old July 11th, 2013, 06:22 PM   #4748
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At border crossings it was quite well guarded, but elsewhere I'm not sure. There used to be quite many illegal immigrants in Slovenia in early 2000s (I was using a bus that drove by the asylum centre and there were always some black guys on it).
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Old July 11th, 2013, 06:40 PM   #4749
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And what about guarded border crossings with Serbia. Had they existed even before Yugoslavia broke up?
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Old July 11th, 2013, 06:56 PM   #4750
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verso View Post
I was using a bus that drove by the asylum centre and there were always some black guys on it.
Why were they on the bus?
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Old July 11th, 2013, 06:58 PM   #4751
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Quote:
Originally Posted by volodaaaa View Post
And what about guarded border crossings with Serbia. Had they existed even before Yugoslavia broke up?
Obviously not, since it was the same country until 1991.
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Old July 11th, 2013, 07:11 PM   #4752
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Quote:
Originally Posted by italystf View Post
Obviously not, since it was the same country until 1991.
I'm just curious, because during Serbia-Montenegro, guarded border crossing existed.
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Old July 11th, 2013, 07:20 PM   #4753
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verso View Post
At border crossings it was quite well guarded, but elsewhere I'm not sure.
I remember first my first post-YU crossing from HR to SLO in july 1992 at Bregana (the former highway "bratstva i jedinstva"). The Croats built some containers at the former INA-gasstation and the check was easy, the Slovenes had a modern crossing and checked quite strong already. But that was not strange, considering I came from a country which was in war at that time.

I read today on some Croatian newssite that waiting times for trucks from Serbia for entering Croatia was 3 days now. Does anyone know if there are any queues now on the A3 towards Serbia?
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Old July 11th, 2013, 08:27 PM   #4754
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dubart View Post
Why were they on the bus?
They were free to walk (or drive) around, they weren't locked in the asylum centre.
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Old July 11th, 2013, 10:23 PM   #4755
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Palance View Post

I read today on some Croatian newssite that waiting times for trucks from Serbia for entering Croatia was 3 days now. Does anyone know if there are any queues now on the A3 towards Serbia?
just as it happened in 2004 some 300 km to the west. it took few days for a system to start working properly. no more long waiting times now.
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Old July 11th, 2013, 10:59 PM   #4756
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Personally, I'm excited when Croatia, Bulgaria and Romania joining the EU Schengen System in the next few years.

Makes things more convenient for non-EU tourist like me
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Old July 11th, 2013, 11:53 PM   #4757
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Basically it makes things more convenient for everybody. When you look at history of Europe, especially eastern and south-eastern Europe, it's absolutely incredible how much progress has been made in a relatively short period of time and how we're basically one huge family now, something completely unimaginable 30 years ago. Croatia was a war zone only 18 years ago, and now we're sitting here discussing how inconvenient passport controls are...
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Old July 12th, 2013, 02:15 PM   #4758
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Quote:
Originally Posted by volodaaaa View Post
I'm just curious, because during Serbia-Montenegro, guarded border crossing existed.
You mean between Serbia and Montenegro, right? That were custom controls since Montenegro introduced the D-Mark in 1999 (and later the Euro).
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Old July 13th, 2013, 11:42 AM   #4759
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toonczyk View Post
Obviously it helped, but not nearly enough, even on this new toll station traffic jams form sometimes. Not to mention traffic going in the other direction, which has to pass through Lučko...
today is happening what i was talking about last week.

look at the jam at toll barrier Lučko, direction north (red frames):



and at the same time traffic at Demerje is completely fluid with no waiting times:




why aer people doing that - i really don't know. trust me, 90% of those waiting at Lučko are foreign plates. why they force to use cash is a mistery to me.
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Old July 13th, 2013, 03:28 PM   #4760
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Quote:
Originally Posted by volodaaaa View Post
And what about guarded border crossings with Serbia. Had they existed even before Yugoslavia broke up?
From what I gather, the borders between Yugoslav republics wasn't even marked on the ground in any way. It's why there are still disputes to this day, and why no border markers exist between many of the ex-Yugoslav republics.

I have a book somewhere that talks about how Croatia and Slovenia put up signs at border crossings even before independence was declared.

Quote:
Originally Posted by volodaaaa
I'm just curious, because during Serbia-Montenegro, guarded border crossing existed.
Could you explain more? I know their economies were more or less separate (which is one reason why it was easy enough to end Serbia & Montenegro in 2006) - but I thought the border was never controlled?

Quote:
Originally Posted by toonczyk
When you look at history of Europe, especially eastern and south-eastern Europe, it's absolutely incredible how much progress has been made in a relatively short period of time and how we're basically one huge family now, something completely unimaginable 30 years ago.
It is amazing. Even when you go back and read the discussions about Schengen when it was first signed, you realise that they managed to implement a plan far superior to the original idea. The original idea was to keep border crossings and for travellers who were from Schengen signatory countries could pass through without stopping. They would have had special stickers on the windscreen indicating this, and random controls would have been made. To instead manage to create a system where border checks were abolished for everyone is incredible.

But I still maintain that the best possible solution now would be to wait until the entire Balkan region can join Schengen at the same time. If they do, Europe can concentrate on guarding a mostly sea border without having to worry about lengthy land borders too in that part of the world.

Quote:
Originally Posted by x-type
why aer people doing that - i really don't know. trust me, 90% of those waiting at Lučko are foreign plates. why they force to use cash is a mistery to me.
Beats me. I used Demerje when I was there for that exact reason.
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