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Old November 25th, 2013, 11:38 PM   #5101
sotonsi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BL2 View Post
west<>east
The map doesn't match the definition...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winston Churchill
From Stettin in the Baltic to Trieste in the Adriatic an "Iron Curtain" has descended across the continent. Behind that line lie all the capitals of the ancient states of Central and Eastern Europe. Warsaw, Berlin, Prague, Vienna, Budapest, Belgrade, Bucharest and Sofia; all these famous cities and the populations around them lie in what I must call the Soviet sphere, and all are subject, in one form or another, not only to Soviet influence but to a very high and in some cases increasing measure of control from Moscow.
OK Yugoslavia, was neutral (as was Albania after 1960) but was communist. Sure the 'curtain' can go either way around it in theory, but on the central ideological spit (capitalism/communism) it was part of the east, just as Sweden, Switzerland, Ireland were non-combative parts of the west.
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Old November 26th, 2013, 12:14 AM   #5102
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Croatia was east of the Iron Curtain when that speech was made in 1946 but Tito broke with the Warsaw Pact countries before 1950 and that meant that Yugoslavia was only behind it for a few years. Thereafter Yugoslavia ( along with India) were 2 of the leading 'Non Aligned' countries for the next 30 years until Tito died. Tito was like a president of the rest of the world at times. Tito also built the largest nuclear bunker in Europe for himself ( just outside Croatia)

Meanwhile Yugoslavia opened for transit traffic after 1950 as did Bulgaria (uniquely for an Iron Curtain country) after around 1960. It was because Croatia was such an important transit location after 1950 that it has such a well developed motorway network today, the NW-E backbone was in place by 1980.

Now can we go back to roads.

Last edited by sponge_bob; November 26th, 2013 at 12:19 AM.
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Old November 26th, 2013, 12:22 AM   #5103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sotonsi View Post
The map doesn't match the definition...
OK Yugoslavia, was neutral (as was Albania after 1960) but was communist. Sure the 'curtain' can go either way around it in theory, but on the central ideological spit (capitalism/communism) it was part of the east, just as Sweden, Switzerland, Ireland were non-combative parts of the west.
Vienna was also behind the Iron curtain longer than Croatia, but I doubt you will refer it as "east of Iran curtain"
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Old November 26th, 2013, 12:38 AM   #5104
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Yugoslavia was part of the Soviet sphere until 1948 (Tito-Stalin split), Eastern Austria (with Vienna) until 1955 (Austrian Treaty of State).
Churchill's speech was made in 1946. However he was wrong in at least one point: Eastern Germany (that became DDR in 1949) was under the Soviet sphere of influence since 1945. Thus, he was right with including Berlin (even if only half of it was) but he was wrong stating that the iron curtain starts at Stettin, that was near the Soviet-controlled Germany - P.R. of Poland border. He should rather have choosen Lubeck (Allied-controlled Germany - Soviet-controlled Germany) or, even better, Kirkeness (Norway - Soviet Union).

EDIT: And in 1946 the Venezia Giulia situation wasn't already clear because Italy ratified the peace treaty in 1947 and only in this year part of Venezia Giulia was given to Jugoslavia and the rest formed the Free Territory of Trieste that was split in 1954. So the southern end of the Iron Curtain could have been either Trieste or Fiume.
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Old November 26th, 2013, 01:02 AM   #5105
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Part of Croatia was free when the famous speech was made.

Pula was only handed over to Tito in 1947 and as Tito fell out with the Soviets soon afterwards (in 1948) Pula technically spent less time behind the Iron Curtain than anywhere else in the whole world.
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Old December 3rd, 2013, 08:24 PM   #5106
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On tonight's evening news (Nova Televizija) it was announced that further construction of highways will no longer be prioritized in funding. Priority will be given to the construction of a new railway system. Seems like this happens in every country where left-leaning governments are in power.

I think nothing will happen until this government gets replaced. Apart from that, of course, the economy needs to recover a lot before thinking about further projects. Tough times...
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Old December 7th, 2013, 12:24 AM   #5107
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What do you mean "this happens in every country where left-leaning governments are in power"? Croatian has an excellent road and motorway network, with only a few relatively minor missing links to complete. So what's so wrong with now concentrating on the railway network?
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Old December 7th, 2013, 01:31 AM   #5108
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Croatia need a railway line along the entire coast (not too close to the coast to spoil the landscape) with international connections to Trieste, Slovenia and Montenegro, Albania and Greece.
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Old December 7th, 2013, 04:01 AM   #5109
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I don't think it would be profitable, the area has a low population density. There used to be quite many narrow gauge railways there already.
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Old December 7th, 2013, 12:06 PM   #5110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smokiboy View Post
Croatian has an excellent road and motorway network, with only a few relatively minor missing links to complete.
There is a MAJOR link missing, namely the final part of A1 to Dubrovnik and, in my opinion, the planned but delayed new bridge at Gradiška (connecting A3 at Okučani directly to BiH E-661 Gradiška-Banja Luka).

I am not sure that a railway network would make a lot of sense, given the existing intercity bus system across Croatia (ticket prices would not be lower than buses, construction will cost a fortune given the terrain in most places along the Dalmatian coast etc.).
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Old December 7th, 2013, 12:29 PM   #5111
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Also the A7 south of Bakar is an important missing link.
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Old December 7th, 2013, 01:52 PM   #5112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by italystf View Post
Croatia need a railway line along the entire coast (not too close to the coast to spoil the landscape) with international connections to Trieste, Slovenia and Montenegro, Albania and Greece.
Croatia needs to refurbush current railroad network before anything.
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Old December 8th, 2013, 01:40 PM   #5113
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A11- Zagreb Velika Gorica, 10 km, finish unknown
A11- Buševec-Lekenik, 10 km, will be finished 10/2013
The latter section is apparently postponed. Any news about completion?
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Old December 10th, 2013, 12:24 PM   #5114
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No news
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Old December 10th, 2013, 07:38 PM   #5115
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Here's some breaking news from the evening news program on RTL Televizija (aired just a few minutes ago):

The Pelješač bridge was decided to be favored over the tunnel and the corridor. Works could begin as early as in 2015, as a lot of analyses and paperwork needs to be done until then. Costs are estimated at € 220 million, parts of that amount should be covered by the European Union. Croatian Prime Minister Zoran Milanović decided not to comment on the topic, claiming that other people have talked too much before and nothing has happened in the end. More information is expected to be presented within the next 2 weeks.
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Old December 12th, 2013, 10:18 PM   #5116
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According to this newspaper article:

http://dubrovacki.hr/clanak/58077/ka...-vrgorac-ploce

Vrgorac-Ploče will be opened on December 20!

There will be no opening ceremony.
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Old December 12th, 2013, 10:56 PM   #5117
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In the Nova TV Evening News today was announced that the missing link on A11 between Jakuševac interchange and Velika Gorica will be finished in 2014.
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Old December 12th, 2013, 11:20 PM   #5118
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When was the construction started?
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Old December 13th, 2013, 12:14 AM   #5119
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Why only the section Vrgorac- Ploce not Vrgorac - Metkovic?
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Old December 13th, 2013, 09:27 AM   #5120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pascal20a View Post
Why only the section Vrgorac- Ploce not Vrgorac - Metkovic?
God, please stop asking these questions!

To clarify for people who got it wrong:
The section that is under construction will be opened, that is A1 to Metković interchange, D425 to Ploče and A10 to BiH border. I thought that was clear by now after dozens of pages of discussion.

Regarding A11: That would be great news. It's a shame they don't get this done after years of doing, well, nothing really. :-/
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