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Old August 27th, 2016, 09:19 PM   #6241
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D10: Gradec – Krizevci 11.5km (? to 2016)

Construction started in 2011 to 2nd Sep 2016

D12: Vrbovec (A12) – Farkasevac 10.5km (? to >= 2016)

Construction started in 2011 to 2017

Source: http://www.icv.hr/2016/07/60-minuta-...do-virovitice/
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Old August 28th, 2016, 11:21 PM   #6242
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The A3 section from Jankomir to Lučko (cca 5 km) is planned to be upgraded to 2x3 among first sections (as well as A1 from Lučko to Karlovac, cca 40 km), so it will be more comfortable to drive. It's the section most congested during summer weekends.
I don't think making the A1 to 2x3 from Lučko to Karlovac will change much on those crazy summer weekends. I was thinking about it a while ago, and perhaps one option would be to make the 3rd lane from Jastrebarsko a "A2 only" lane. It would need some clever design to integrate it all, but if it could be kept as a separate lane all the way to the toll station on the A2 at Zaprešić, then at least it would reduce some of the pressure as traffic wouldn't have to stop twice.

Another idea - wouldn't it make sense to introduce some sort of pre-paid tolling system? I can imagine turning up at... I dunno, Zadar, entering the motorway, and instead of taking a ticket, you select your destination on a touchscreen and pre-pay the toll. Then you replace the card-only toll booths with pre-paid booths, with automatic numberplate readers being used.

No matter what, the chaos is only on a handful of weekends every year. It's hard to justify spending millions of Kuna on something that will be barely used.
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Old August 28th, 2016, 11:37 PM   #6243
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I drove Karlovac-Zagreb on Thursday and 2x2 wasn't enough. However, Lučko toll gate was suprisingly fast, I used Demerje as usual, but cash gates were also without congestion
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Old August 28th, 2016, 11:59 PM   #6244
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eulanthe View Post
I don't think making the A1 to 2x3 from Lučko to Karlovac will change much on those crazy summer weekends. I was thinking about it a while ago, and perhaps one option would be to make the 3rd lane from Jastrebarsko a "A2 only" lane. It would need some clever design to integrate it all, but if it could be kept as a separate lane all the way to the toll station on the A2 at Zaprešić, then at least it would reduce some of the pressure as traffic wouldn't have to stop twice.

Another idea - wouldn't it make sense to introduce some sort of pre-paid tolling system? I can imagine turning up at... I dunno, Zadar, entering the motorway, and instead of taking a ticket, you select your destination on a touchscreen and pre-pay the toll. Then you replace the card-only toll booths with pre-paid booths, with automatic numberplate readers being used.

No matter what, the chaos is only on a handful of weekends every year. It's hard to justify spending millions of Kuna on something that will be barely used.
or you take/buy entrance ticket to A1 at gas station / some other toll station, and use express lane without stopping at Lučko
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Old August 29th, 2016, 02:22 AM   #6245
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or you take/buy entrance ticket to A1 at gas station / some other toll station, and use express lane without stopping at Lučko
Could actually make a lot of sense - you stop at Trakošćan, tell them your destination, pay the toll and you have a clear run from there. No need to stop at Lučko and Zadar-2, it's good for 24 hours, and with a bit of common sense, could be available online before you even leave so you can avoid queuing completely.

Move the Croatian border controls to Gruškovje, use the old Croatian controls to separate traffic before the Trakošćan toll station, and you've cleared up at least the southbound mess.

Was Croatia always a disaster on summer weekends, or did the A1/A2 make things much worse as traffic concentrated on that route?
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Old August 29th, 2016, 03:56 PM   #6246
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In past times the nightmare was on the coastal road (D8), the D1 and D3 towards the coast. It was not better, just different.

You had dense traffic over the whole distances and not just before some toll stations. Drive from Ploce to Herceg Novi on a Saturday afternoon and you get the idea...
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Old August 30th, 2016, 11:22 AM   #6247
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Was Croatia always a disaster on summer weekends, or did the A1/A2 make things much worse as traffic concentrated on that route?
Karlovac was incredible bottleneck. I don't know how people were surviving it. All traffic from motorway Zagreb - Karlovac would stuck first at toll in Karlovac, and after that at city avenue, which cut the city in 2 halfs and was impossible to cross it.

Ali da D1 and D3 there was high volumed traffic, but I don't remember some incredible jams. Everything was just about Karlovac and Split ferry port.
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Old August 30th, 2016, 09:58 PM   #6248
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Ahhh, motorway all the way to Karlovac. Good old times.
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Old August 30th, 2016, 10:17 PM   #6249
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Ahhh, motorway all the way to Karlovac. Good old times.
i actually never experienced extreme jam in those times. we mostly went to seaside in early season, early July, or even late June. and we left Bjelovar at 3 AM so at 6 we were already somewhere at D3 after Karlovac, and crowds start at 6-7 AM.
but the traffic volumes in those times were definitely much lower than today. i think that today we would have 80 km jams if everything went only on old D1 and D3.
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Old August 31st, 2016, 12:30 AM   #6250
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I don't think so, because there is more traffic because of the longer motorway. Anyway, I've driven on the Zagreb-Karlovac motorway only once, and that was in 2005. I hardly ever drove on Croatian motorways before 2000, because they were quite useless for us unless you went east of Zagreb. I only drove on the Čakovec-Goričan motorway (A4) when I went to Budapest in 1998. It was so new that they didn't even collect tolls yet.
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Old August 31st, 2016, 11:26 AM   #6251
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I don't think so, because there is more traffic because of the longer motorway.
but there is still quite some traffic at D1 too. On D3 not, it is empty because there everyone uses A6.

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Anyway, I've driven on the Zagreb-Karlovac motorway only once, and that was in 2005. I hardly ever drove on Croatian motorways before 2000, because they were quite useless for us unless you went east of Zagreb. I only drove on the Čakovec-Goričan motorway (A4) when I went to Budapest in 1998. It was so new that they didn't even collect tolls yet.
The same as your A1 LJ-MB for us I am about to clinch it for few years already just to say that I was there, but still never caught time to do it.

In 1998 you could drive only on Zagreb - Sveta Helena and Čakovec - Goričan (as you said it was opened that year) of A4, and 6km near Zagreb (Ivanja Reka - Popovec) was 2 Lane expressway.

Now you reminded me - that part of D3 between Hungary and Zagreb was road of death for H, SK, PL tourists. It was really not nearly adequate for those amounts of traffic and nasty accidents happened there.
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Old August 31st, 2016, 04:56 PM   #6252
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Oh, I forgot that we took the A3 to Bosnia in 1986. I don't remember it though.
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Old August 31st, 2016, 07:58 PM   #6253
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It's interesting to revoke memories from only 10 years ago:
- from Pula to Zagreb (~260 km) we had only 50 km of full profile motorways (A6 Orehovica-Grobnik /~10km/ and A1 Karlovac-Zagreb /~40 km/)
- in 2008 the whole A6 (~80 km) and A1 Bosiljevo-Zagreb (~70 km) were in full profile
- in 2009 the Rijeka bypass (A7) was completed in full profile
- in 2010 the A9 from Pula to Kanfanar was completed in full profile (~30 km)
- in 2011 the A8 from Kanfanar to Pazin (Rogovići) (~18 km) was completed in full profile.

I remember going to Zagreb in my first few years of college using different roads and sections of A/B6, A/B9 and D3 each time, depending on the roadworks being conducted at the moment.

Today on the same route (~260 km) we have 5 motorways (A9, A8, A7, A6, A1), of which "only" 47 km is half profile (B8)
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Old August 31st, 2016, 09:47 PM   #6254
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Cheers. What about the railways?? Lmao.
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Old August 31st, 2016, 10:25 PM   #6255
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Cheers. What about the railways?? Lmao.
We have them, too
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Old August 31st, 2016, 10:52 PM   #6256
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Pula-Zagreb via Slovenia.
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Old August 31st, 2016, 11:46 PM   #6257
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Haha. No but seriously, high-speed trains are really the thing that croatia needs to connect major cities. Not everyone can afford a car.
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Old September 1st, 2016, 04:27 PM   #6258
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Haha. No but seriously, high-speed trains are really the thing that croatia needs to connect major cities. Not everyone can afford a car.
We can not afford high speed trains also.

So best solution - take a bus.
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Old September 1st, 2016, 05:16 PM   #6259
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Maybe Slovenia and Croatia could afford a high-speed rail together? Eastern European countries are too small and/or sparsely populated that only one country could build such a rail, but it could work for 2-3-4 countries in a row.
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Old September 1st, 2016, 05:44 PM   #6260
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Maybe Slovenia and Croatia could afford a high-speed rail together? Eastern European countries are too small and/or sparsely populated that only one country could build such a rail, but it could work for 2-3-4 countries in a row.
It's not realistic, there isn't nearly enough demand. Sharing a network with another country would only really alleviate overhead costs, the underlying structural issues that make HSR infeasible would remain. In fact, it would probably make them even worse, as there isn't nearly as much demand for cross-border services as there is for domestic services, so those lines would almost certainly rack up a large loss. Bringing the existing railways up to conventional rail standards (160 km/h) and eliminating some missing links would probably suffice for many years to come.
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