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Old February 27th, 2010, 11:45 PM   #4321
ChrisZwolle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jakub Warszauer View Post
Blue - Environmental Impact Assesment accepted
The famous DSU. Is this similar to the German Planfeststellungsbeschluss or the American Record of Decision (final go-ahead for the project)?
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Old February 28th, 2010, 12:20 AM   #4322
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
The famous DSU. Is this similar to the German Planfeststellungsbeschluss or the American Record of Decision (final go-ahead for the project)?
Not exactly - DŚU focuses only on environmental impact of the project, e.g. noise levels, drainage, passages for animals etc. Polish equivalent of Planfeststellungsbeschluss would be ZnRID (Zezwolenie na Realizację Inwestycji Drogowej, loose translation: authorization for execution of road investment).
Quote:
Originally Posted by aswnl View Post
I only miss other planned roads. Time for grey color lines ?
In many cases we still don't know how planned roads will look like, since many variants are considered.
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Old February 28th, 2010, 12:30 AM   #4323
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aswnl View Post
Time for grey color lines ?
Authors of the map decide that there will be no "planned" roads. Because map is very precise. If you like to see planned road check out this:



black - completed
orange - u/c
green - tender
yellow - tender planned in 2010
white - planned
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Old February 28th, 2010, 12:44 AM   #4324
Jakub Warszauer
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aswnl View Post
Thank you.
I only miss other planned roads.
Time for grey color lines ?
Ask the authors.
Firstly, they didn't want it, so that the map will be clear.
Secondly, without the DŚU, we don't know what and where we should draw (see the answer for ChrisZwolle below).

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
The famous DSU. Is this similar to the German Planfeststellungsbeschluss or the American Record of Decision (final go-ahead for the project)?
Not exactly.

ROŚ (Raport o Oddziaływaniu na Środowisko - Environmental Impact Assesment) is core official document requested to apply for the DŚU (Decyzja o Środowiskowych Uwarunkowaniach inwestycji - Decision [?] on Environmental Factors [?] of the investment).

The DSU is a document in which the best option for the project is chosen, from those presented and analysed in ROŚ.

Even though ROŚ as well as DŚU have "environmental" in their names, they take equally (more or less) environmental, social, technical and economical fators into account.

Although most expressways and motorways have fixed corridors since '70, the DŚU sometimes favours other solutions, because of changed factors (new quater of flats) or purely new factors (who cared much about the environment before 1989?)

The DŚU is valid for 4 years, whith possible extension for 2 years.

The DŚU and construction project (which should be done according to the DŚU) is attached to application for ZRID (Zezwolenie na Realizację Inwestycji Drogowej - Permission to Execute Road Investment). In theory, ZRID should be granted (or not) within 3 months, but life is sometimes harder...

ZRID is the final document, it accepts the construction project. Sometimes the investor opens the first phase of bid without it.

Please don't tell me it's complicated, because I cut it short by 1/2...

Regards,

Last edited by Jakub Warszauer; February 28th, 2010 at 12:23 PM. Reason: Grammar
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Old February 28th, 2010, 12:48 AM   #4325
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Thanks a lot Jakub.
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Old February 28th, 2010, 12:52 AM   #4326
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Something like that:



And maybe Express Road between Tarnów and Kielce and rest of S8 to Czech Republic.

Last edited by Blaskovitz; February 28th, 2010 at 12:57 AM.
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Old February 28th, 2010, 03:06 AM   #4327
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blaskovitz View Post
Something like that:



And maybe Express Road between Tarnów and Kielce and rest of S8 to Czech Republic.
For me the biggest missing link is possible S8 from Wroclaw through Klodzko basin towards Czech border.
At the moment Klodzko Basin is only really connected with "the rest od Poland" by DK8 with quite hilly section cutting through mountains separating basin from lowlands. It is narrow, slow and dangerous road.
Klodzko basin is already an important tourist region (many famous spa towns, very interesting geology and history) with huge potential for growth. But it needs decent road connection to prosper.
It would be also quickest link from Wroclaw or Poznan (via S5) to Prague.

It would be much more used than S69 which we currently build from Zywiec to Slovakia passing through some villages.
Sometimes we get our priorities very strange indeed.
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Old February 28th, 2010, 07:28 AM   #4328
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Quote:
Originally Posted by geogregor View Post
Sometimes we get our priorities very strange indeed.
It is a priority because it is a part of TEN-T Priority Axis, Poland is forced to build that. In new proposal for TEN-T Priority Axes a connection to Lubawka is also included, so I'd say that we are cca. ten years from completion of Prague - Wroclaw "motorway" connection.
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Old February 28th, 2010, 12:10 PM   #4329
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Originally Posted by geogregor View Post
For me the biggest missing link is possible S8 from Wroclaw through Klodzko basin towards Czech border.
There are a few possible extensions possible from Kłodzko. You can make it turn west towards Hradec Králové OR let it continue south and make it connect to the planned Czech R43 to Brno. That way you have an awesome north-south connection from Poznań to Wien.
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Old February 28th, 2010, 01:37 PM   #4330
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I've driven the DK8 from Klodzko to Wroclaw once. I remember it took about 2,5 hours
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Old February 28th, 2010, 02:13 PM   #4331
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Photos from future DK70/A2 intersection. Ongoing preparation of corridor.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Qracz3k View Post
Zapraszam na krótką wycieczkę:

Wyruszamy ze Skierniewic DK70 w kierunku Łowicza. W listopadzie zakończył się generalny remont odcinka od Nieborowa do DK8.


Wchodzi w zakręt, który ma być docelowo inaczej wyprofilowany, trochę mnie dziwi. że nie weszło to w zakres modernizacji.


I jesteśmy na ostatniej prostej do przyszłego węzła.


Widzimy już pierwsze wycięte drzewa, nie pod A2, a pod docelowy przebieg 70. Będzie ona odbijać w tym miejscu w lewo.


O właśnie tutaj. Docelowo robiąc to zdjęcie celowałem prosto w węzeł.


Kierunek Łódź


I Warszawa


Łódź


Warszawa


Teraz cztery strony świat stojąc w centrum węzła.
Warszawa

Łowicz (docelowy przebieg DK70).

Łódź

Skierniewice


Mam nadzieję, że się podoba.
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Old February 28th, 2010, 02:21 PM   #4332
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bebe.2006 View Post
Any highway/motorway here?
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Old February 28th, 2010, 02:27 PM   #4333
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Yeah S79 is being constructed along the east side of the airport.
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Old February 28th, 2010, 02:49 PM   #4334
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crcorp View Post
Hello,

After visiting the Highways forum for quite a while, I finally decided to register in order to be able to participate in some debates. [...]
Anyway, I just would like to emphasize what has already been reported by some:

1) It is very strange that when driving towards Germany, not a single large German city is signed... especially for people who don't know the names of the little towns at the border (Jedrychowice if I recall it right), it must be difficult to choose at the intersection near Boleslawiec. You would expect something like the highway to Berlin or the highway to Dresden.
Yes, that has been reported, talked about, and conclusion has been reached that it's stupid.

The reason for this situation is that in Polish law a road starts in point A and ends in point B, but I personally think there's some political thought behind it. Why it is like that you answer yourself below:

Quote:
Originally Posted by crcorp View Post
2) Concerning the translation of city names...[...] hope was already shattered when seing a sign "Breslau" in Germany. I can fully understand that 99% of the Germans will never use the word "Wroclaw" to designate the city, but I don't think they will be shocked (nor disoriented) by seeing a sign that says "Wroclaw".
Maybe not 99%. but you probably know how Germans are statistically: conservative, socially backwards, and always correct. If German way is not correct, goto 3. Of course I've met some "non-statistical" Germans, but how are they to give an example of modern thinking if they are in such environment? It would take half of the gays of Cologne to change Lüttich to Liége. There's simply no environment for Wrocław or Szczecin in Germany. Not yet, I guess.

On the other hand, in my previous place of residence, Poznań, there was no such sentiment when labelling Berlin. It was simply fitted under the infamous "Świecko" (the equivalent of A4's Jędrzychowice). Sadly, some strings must have been pulled, because at next update (opening of A2 in 2003) it disappeared.
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Old February 28th, 2010, 04:06 PM   #4335
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mapman:cz View Post
In new proposal for TEN-T Priority Axes a connection to Lubawka is also included, so I'd say that we are cca. ten years from completion of Prague - Wroclaw "motorway" connection.
10 years?
You are an optimist

And connection through Lubawka means Klodzko basin, which as I wrote above is an important tourist region, unconnected to the rest of Poland.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Timon91
I've driven the DK8 from Klodzko to Wroclaw once. I remember it took about 2,5 hours
And it is only 88km. Now you can work out your average speed.
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Old February 28th, 2010, 04:31 PM   #4336
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68, in fact, since I started in Bardo and ended on the A4. There was a lot of traffic and there were some traffic lights due to road works. A couple of hours later we drove on the DK4 between Krzywa and Zgorzelec, which took us 3,5 hours, also due to heavy traffic and road works.
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Old February 28th, 2010, 06:14 PM   #4337
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Have the works on A1 Świerklany – Gorzyczki resumed already?
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Old February 28th, 2010, 07:34 PM   #4338
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Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Have the works on A1 Świerklany – Gorzyczki resumed already?
No, and there are no chances of that happening any time soon.
They have to catalog what was done, what still has to be done then prepare new new tender process, find new contractor etc.
If all goes well they might start late summer / autumn. If there is problem with one of the bridges (as previous contractor claims) it might take way, way longer.
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Old February 28th, 2010, 10:32 PM   #4339
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Originally Posted by geogregor View Post
And connection through Lubawka means Klodzko basin, which as I wrote above is an important tourist region, unconnected to the rest of Poland.
No, Lubawka is S3, resp. S8 (Lubawka - Swidnica - Wroclaw), the proposed priority axis goes way off the Klodzko basin unfortunately. The north-south connection along Klodzko with border crossing near Medzylesie to R43 in CZ is a very distatnt future, altough it's included in Lower-Silesian Voivodship's land planing documents.
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Old March 1st, 2010, 03:20 PM   #4340
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S-7 and DK7 near Warsaw:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qmB5hv5S1oE
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