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Old January 17th, 2012, 11:39 PM   #7561
ChrisZwolle
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Are there already preliminary traffic counts of the new A2?
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Old January 18th, 2012, 01:02 AM   #7562
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Info from web portal biznes.onet.pl

December:
18000 per day from interchange Świecko to interchange Rzepin, from int. Rzepin 5000 less, mostly because interchange Jordanowo with S3 is closed.

This is the most reliable source I find.
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Old January 18th, 2012, 11:05 AM   #7563
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Which means almost 90% of the traffic on DK2 has switched to the new A2. Hopefully it stays that way when tolling begins.
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Old January 18th, 2012, 12:00 PM   #7564
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Which means almost 90% of the traffic on DK2 has switched to the new A2. Hopefully it stays that way when tolling begins.
If Autostrada Wielkopolska will not lower their tolls for trucks - forget it. Last time I checked, tolls for trucks on the strech Nowy Tomysl - Konin were 5x higher than they would be on national motorway (e.g. Konin - Strykow).
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Old January 18th, 2012, 12:41 PM   #7565
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They can prohibit heavy trucks on the DK2.
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Old January 18th, 2012, 01:29 PM   #7566
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Quote:
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They can prohibit heavy trucks on the DK2.
And FORCE trucks to use PRIVATE road? Sweet...
Part of national retirement plan in Poland is like this - you are forced by law to invest some of your money into special private funds. Needless to say that they are not performing very well, but hey - you can't run away from them anyway. Those who came up with such idea and everyone who approves this scheme should be prosecuted...

Last edited by rav00; January 18th, 2012 at 01:41 PM.
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Old January 18th, 2012, 01:52 PM   #7567
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rav00 View Post
Part of national retirement plan in Poland is like this - you are forced by law to invest some of your money into special private funds. Needless to say that they are not performing very well, but hey - you can't run away from them anyway. Those who came up with such idea and everyone who approves this scheme should be prosecuted...
This has nothing to do with -- and is not analogous to -- roads. People should have complete control over their own retirement accounts and be free to invest them any way they want (maybe not derivatives). People should generally not be building their own intercity roads.

No one said anything about forcing anyone to use a private road. There are always many routes, though most will be strictly dominated by better choices. Anyway, there are good reasons for keeping large trucks off minor roads.
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Old January 18th, 2012, 02:06 PM   #7568
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Quote:
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They can prohibit heavy trucks on the DK2.
In this scenario I believe.
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Old January 18th, 2012, 02:11 PM   #7569
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I also think they should prohibit trucks on DK2/92 and enforce police controls on this road.

Nowadays, transport companies try to evade the Nowy Tomyśl - Stryków stretch via the DK92. The result ? Hundreds of lorries going through villages & small towns & destroying local roads, not talking about casualties.

Losing time and money on DK2/92 will then become regarded as a nonsense for these companies ...
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Old January 18th, 2012, 02:30 PM   #7570
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcarling View Post
People should generally not be building their own intercity roads.
but we already have a couple of these

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcarling View Post
No one said anything about forcing anyone to use a private road. There are always many routes, though most will be strictly dominated by better choices. Anyway, there are good reasons for keeping large trucks off minor roads.
I dont want trucks on the minor road either, but when A2 owner's representative says that trucks should be banned from alternative route because the company is losing its profit, my blood starts to boil...

I realise that tonnage restrictions on dk2 and 92 are inevitable... and it's going to be hell untill 2027...
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Old January 18th, 2012, 02:40 PM   #7571
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Quote:
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when A2 owner's representative says that trucks should be banned from alternative route because the company is losing its profit, my blood starts to boil...
I am not a representative of the A2's owner.

Quote:
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I realise that tonnage restrictions on dk2 and 92 are inevitable... and it's going to be hell untill 2027...
What happens in 2027? Does the state take ownership then?
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Old January 18th, 2012, 02:51 PM   #7572
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source
Quote:
The concessionaire will be remunerated with respect to the section Świecko – Nowy Tomysl according to the availability system. This means that , according to the Construction and Operation Agreement, the State Treasury leases the land where the motorway must be built to AWSA II, commissioning the construction of the road within 2.5 years and the operation for another 25 years, in return of which the company will be paid a monthly fee specified in the agreement for making the motorway fully available to the users. The major duties of AWSA II include the procurement of the financing, the construction of the motorway using such funds and subsequently the maintenance of the road in compliance with the relevant high standards, as well as the toll collection on behalf of the State Treasury. In return, AWSA II will be remunerated by the public partner , in the amount securing the repayment of the loans and the fair return on the sponsors’ equity invested in the project.
On section Świecko - Nowy Tomyśl toll rates are determine by ministry of infrastructure. And there will be rates like on the other highways managed by the General Directorate of National Roads and Motorways.
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Old January 18th, 2012, 06:53 PM   #7573
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Quote:
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On section Świecko - Nowy Tomyśl toll rates are determine by ministry of infrastructure. And there will be rates like on the other highways managed by the General Directorate of National Roads and Motorways.
Ok, that's better. Like 1pln/km better.

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What happens in 2027? Does the state take ownership then?
Yup, concession was given in 1997 for 30 years.
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Old January 18th, 2012, 08:16 PM   #7574
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Could someone remind me when the tolls on the Western section of the A2 will start functioning ?
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"Richtgeschwindigkeit" should be the default system in all EU motorways & expressways & lane indiscipline should be harshly fought! Down with radars on motorways!
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Old January 18th, 2012, 08:27 PM   #7575
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GROBIN View Post
Could someone remind me when the tolls on the Western section of the A2 will start functioning ?
• Until 21 May 2012 the trip in A2 Świecko – Nowy Tomyśl section will be untolled.

source
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Old January 19th, 2012, 02:24 AM   #7576
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rav00 View Post
Last time I checked, tolls for trucks on the strech Nowy Tomysl - Konin were 5x higher than they would be on national motorway (e.g. Konin - Strykow).
Good, so people in an actual hurry can drive fast and not worry that much about 2 trucks overtaking each other.


Nothing more annoying than Cruising at 150-160 kph at cruise control and then having to slam the brake for someone overtaking someone going 80 km/h with 81 km/h. And let's be honest, if you don't have the truck problem (yes it's not allowed but meh) you can pretty much go 180+ kph all the time aside from the toll booths.

The A2 is a lovely place to drive if you don't come across overtaking trucks, mainly because its low traffic.
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Old January 19th, 2012, 11:47 PM   #7577
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This is also true, although with some cars, you can get asleep at 150-160 km/h on this motorway !
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A AND AUS B BIH BY CZ D E EST ET F FIN GB H HR I IL L LT LV MAL MC PL RI SGP SK SLO T TN USA UA YV

"Richtgeschwindigkeit" should be the default system in all EU motorways & expressways & lane indiscipline should be harshly fought! Down with radars on motorways!
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Old January 22nd, 2012, 12:59 AM   #7578
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Quote:
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Yup, concession was given in 1997 for 30 years.
And in the same year the concession time was extended to 2037.
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Old January 22nd, 2012, 12:13 PM   #7579
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So they got a concession that was completely worthless the first half of its lifespan?
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Old January 22nd, 2012, 01:08 PM   #7580
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So they got a concession that was completely worthless the first half of its lifespan?
Indeed. But now they gain quite nice profits.
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