daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Highways & Autobahns

Highways & Autobahns All about automobility



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old July 27th, 2013, 03:49 PM   #10321
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,607
Likes (Received): 19391

Quote:
Originally Posted by toonczyk View Post
Which is a horrible practice, roads should be opened when they're ready, not when some VIP finds time for an opening ceremony. Current government pledged to put this tradition of "official openings" to rest, now they seem to have resurrected it.

Do politicians in other countries do that too?
I don't have a big problem with politicians opening new infrastructure. It's tradition, although it's shifted down in many countries. In the 1950s and 1960s the queen often came to open new motorways or bridges in the Netherlands. That downshifted to prime ministers, then to infrastructure ministers and nowadays often only local officials attend ceremonies. Widening projects are often opened without ceremony.

An alternative are off-road opening ceremonies. Opening it to traffic and hold an official ceremony nearby. They do that often in the Netherlands where it is unpractical to hold a ceremony on the road itself. Another possibility I like is to hold a ceremony and open day on a new motorway. For example being able to bike or walk across a new bridge, tunnel or motorway.

Inaugurating new infrastructure is a good way to get some positive media attention for politicans, even though projects are usually not initiated / funded by the politician in charge at the moment of opening.
ChrisZwolle no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old July 27th, 2013, 10:19 PM   #10322
rakcancer
Registered User
 
rakcancer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: XYZ
Posts: 1,198
Likes (Received): 1170

Hey, this is Poland not Netherlands. People over here don't like politicians. In many cases I agree with them. Politicians don't make people's live easier here. On the other hand everyone has to admit that we have never had so many new roads, bridges built in such a short period of time like we have now in last few years. So, I don't mind Prime Minister shows up from time to time at opening ceremonies just to make some ever-complaining citizens understand that we are still on the top of construction works among european countries.
__________________

Kuras77 liked this post

Last edited by rakcancer; July 27th, 2013 at 11:44 PM.
rakcancer no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 29th, 2013, 12:08 AM   #10323
MaciejN
Registered User
 
MaciejN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Trojmiasto
Posts: 611
Likes (Received): 404

And here we go! There is new road bridge over Vistula River near Kwidzyn. View form carcab Enjoy and read captions.
__________________
Przeglądaj nowości w infrastrukturze i nie tylko. A może macie ochotę na strogonow wołowy, albo zobaczcie jak powstaje nowojorska kanapka. Albo po prostu zobaczcie jak gotuję.

WB2010, kapturek liked this post
MaciejN no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 29th, 2013, 04:09 PM   #10324
Niemiec w Polsce
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 41
Likes (Received): 12

There is a huge problem in Poland with toll gates. Now during the vacation and summer time, traffic jams in front of the toll gates up to 2 hours are quiet frequently. This is against any sense of having a highway, if you pay and in the end you are standing in a traffic jam that long, that taking the free local roads would be even faster.

I don't understand the planning. You have a major highway (A1) and at the current end at Torun you have only 6 gates for paying. Just theoretical. 40 000 cars per day on summer time peak days is normal, of which you can expect that at least 30 000 run between 6 am and midnight, making it 18 hours. This means you have approx. 28 cars per minute arriving at the gate. 6 gates are serving, so there are 4,7 cars per gate and minute. But one gate needs a least 30 sec for one car. So instead of having 6 gates, there should be at least 14 to cover such peaks.

Additionally the payment system completely sucks. Paying cash takes long, paying with the credit card even longer since the card approval by the gate servant is somehow forever taking. There should be automatic terminals as it is in Italy. You arrive, put your ticket and your credit card inside, 2 seconds later you get your card and your receipt back and you drive off. Takes around 10 sec/car.

Does anyone know if the government can't sue fines on the private owners of highways due to lack of service or provision of proper payment systems. Or somehow push them to change it. For instance also to introduce electronic payment systems.
__________________

Deadeye Reloaded liked this post
Niemiec w Polsce no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 29th, 2013, 05:47 PM   #10325
asahi
Registered User
 
asahi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 584
Likes (Received): 189

Quote:
Originally Posted by Niemiec w Polsce View Post
Does anyone know if the government can't sue fines on the private owners of highways due to lack of service or provision of proper payment systems. Or somehow push them to change it. For instance also to introduce electronic payment systems.
It is the same, or even worse, on the government run motorways. As you said, it simply sucks. And it's not only the case during summer months. It happened to me numerous times between Warsaw and Poznań and it's starting to piss me off more and more. Once, there was only 1 (ONE!!) booth open and when I finally got there I complained about it. The woman in the booth told me in a very rude way that they are also allowed to have a break. Well, sure, but I don't pay the toll to wait for ages at the toll booth. :/

There have been talks with the private operators on installing the viatoll/viaAuto system, but as usually in Poland - it takes forever. But even if they do, it won't help that much imho. Most private car owners will not use the viaAuto, 'cause the viabox costs waaay too much for someone who doesn't drive on a tollway that often.

Not to mention the card payment system. In Poland, you can use the touchless payment (like paypass) practically everywhere, even in very small shops. Having such terminals at the toll booth would make it so much quicker. And it doesn't even cost much to install it anyway. I can't think of any reason why toll booths are one of the last places without the touchlees terminals.
__________________

Indyk liked this post
asahi no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 29th, 2013, 06:02 PM   #10326
rakcancer
Registered User
 
rakcancer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: XYZ
Posts: 1,198
Likes (Received): 1170

True and simple: paypass would speed up the whole process without big investments in infrastructure. Why they didn't come up with such an simple yet brilliant idea? Looks like asahi said: everything in Poland takes forever and before is good must be a period of time of chaos and disorganization....
rakcancer no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 29th, 2013, 06:58 PM   #10327
asahi
Registered User
 
asahi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 584
Likes (Received): 189

I will try to email the operators about installing paypass finally. I wonder what they'll say.
__________________

Deadeye Reloaded, DiggerD21 liked this post
asahi no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 29th, 2013, 07:17 PM   #10328
rakcancer
Registered User
 
rakcancer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: XYZ
Posts: 1,198
Likes (Received): 1170

You have got my full support. Or maybe all forum guys should put together signatures under your email and maybe we will be more successful with our petition.
rakcancer no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 29th, 2013, 08:39 PM   #10329
asahi
Registered User
 
asahi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 584
Likes (Received): 189

I already sent emails to all motorway operators in Poland, let's wait 'till they reply. I don't expect much, but I think if more Polish or Polish-speaking forumers informed them what a pain in the arse it is to wait ages at the toll plazas, they'd be more willing to change the system.
asahi no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 29th, 2013, 08:55 PM   #10330
Janek0
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 3,292
Likes (Received): 450

Quote:
Originally Posted by Niemiec w Polsce View Post
I don't understand the planning. You have a major highway (A1) and at the current end at Torun you have only 6 gates for paying.
Because it was planned as temporary, to be liquidated after opening and introducing tolls on the next section of the road. Unfortunately, these plans were not implemented and for now it is possible that next toll booth would be installed several kilometers to the south.

Quote:
Originally Posted by klosek View Post

Last edited by Janek0; July 30th, 2013 at 11:20 PM.
Janek0 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2013, 01:32 AM   #10331
I-275westcoastfl
Registered User
 
I-275westcoastfl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Bellevue, WA
Posts: 6,148
Likes (Received): 790

I ended up renting a car to drive from Gdansk to Kolobrzeg and some places in between, drive wasn't as bad as I thought it was. GPS took me on some road in the woods that damaged the exhaust though lol. After I stopped listening to the gps everything was great, I even found an awesome curvy road outside of Gdynia that was fun to drive even in my crappy rental. I do have a question though, I was driving at this intersection in Gdansk at night and saw a flash but I wasn't speeding. I was turning left from Targ Drzewny onto 91. Is there any type of camera here? Could have been someone taking pictures but I am not sure.

I-275westcoastfl no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2013, 01:52 AM   #10332
Dantiscum
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Gdańsk
Posts: 1,688
Likes (Received): 383

there is no speed camera, don't worry Might be some intrusive outdoor advertisment perhaps?
Dantiscum no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2013, 03:07 AM   #10333
I-275westcoastfl
Registered User
 
I-275westcoastfl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Bellevue, WA
Posts: 6,148
Likes (Received): 790

Not sure, that intersection is a mess and I was in my relatives car. I was thinking a red light camera but I had the green to turn left so I wasn't sure what it could be. Good to know though. Dzieki.
I-275westcoastfl no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2013, 11:11 AM   #10334
toonczyk
autostradożerca
 
toonczyk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Warszawa
Posts: 5,787

Maybe those were sparks from tram traction, sometimes it happens to look like a camera flash.
__________________
████████████████████
toonczyk no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2013, 11:43 AM   #10335
MaciejN
Registered User
 
MaciejN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Trojmiasto
Posts: 611
Likes (Received): 404

I put another video from Kwidzyn, where new bridge cross Vistula River.
__________________
Przeglądaj nowości w infrastrukturze i nie tylko. A może macie ochotę na strogonow wołowy, albo zobaczcie jak powstaje nowojorska kanapka. Albo po prostu zobaczcie jak gotuję.

Rombi, Deadeye Reloaded, kapturek liked this post
MaciejN no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2013, 01:17 PM   #10336
Andrzej_Kubica
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Okolice Bielska-Białej, Polska.
Posts: 265
Likes (Received): 93

All those colors and noise barriers looks so terrible. This could be real nice piece of ifranstructure architecture. However it turned out to be classic, tasteless polish crap.
Andrzej_Kubica no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2013, 01:58 PM   #10337
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,607
Likes (Received): 19391

It's a nice bridge though. It's sleek and fits well within the landscape. Bravo.
ChrisZwolle no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2013, 02:13 PM   #10338
cinxxx
I ♥ Timişoara
 
cinxxx's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: München
Posts: 22,236
Likes (Received): 18302

I like the many colors on Polish roads, not so dull
cinxxx no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2013, 02:17 PM   #10339
Niemiec w Polsce
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 41
Likes (Received): 12

Quote:
I already sent emails to all motorway operators in Poland, let's wait 'till they reply. I don't expect much, but I think if more Polish or Polish-speaking forumers informed them what a pain in the arse it is to wait ages at the toll plazas, they'd be more willing to change the system.
Yes, the paypass system would be great. And since none of the fees is exceeding the 50 zł limit it’s fitting prefect. Thank you for your initiative. Maybe it would be good to announce that as well on the Polish speaking area of the forum.
Quote:
There have been talks with the private operators on installing the viatoll/viaAuto system, but as usually in Poland - it takes forever. But even if they do, it won't help that much imho. Most private car owners will not use the viaAuto, 'cause the viabox costs waaay too much for someone who doesn't drive on a tollway that often.
About the via toll I thought the same. In the end nobody will have it and the queue will be that long so that if you even have the toll box installed you’re stuck up at the end of the traffic jam.
Quote:
Because it was planned as temporary, to be liquidated after opening and introducing tolls on the next section of the road. Unfortunately, these plans were not implemented and for now it is possible that next tool booth would be installed several kilometers to the south.
I don’t know if those two booths in the middle of Nowa Wieś are for reserve or emergency. If they are for reserve I don’t get it why it has not put yet into operation. Further on, if it’s temporary (as far as I know there’s no decision yet, how it will be organized in that area in the future) they could have it done as it was done in Stryków where it is temporary as well. If I am not mistaken they have 10 gates for paying there. So much better. And never experienced a traffic jam there or heard of one.
But if it’s going to be two toll gates within a few kilometers, that is the worst situation ever
Quote:
Once, there was only 1 (ONE!!) booth open and when I finally got there I complained about it.

Yes, I know this. Coming there in the middle of night. No traffic, but a 10min queue because only one booth is open. Unfortunately saying something to the person doesn’t really help as they are not the decision makers.
Quote:
It happened to me numerous times between Warsaw and Poznań
At which gates are you stuck? Those where you have to pay 15 zł? Those ones are private as well. Only Konin-Strykow is non-private and never saw traffic jams there.

All in all the situation is unsatisfying, worse one the private ones, but also not that great on the governmental ones. Anyway it is also a safety issue. Ok, you have speed limits approx. 1 km before the gate. But if the queue is 2-5km long this is causing a dangerous situation on the highway and I am waiting till it ends up in a bad way (hopefully never). And not talking about economic damages due to these permanent traffic jams.
Niemiec w Polsce no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2013, 02:43 PM   #10340
asahi
Registered User
 
asahi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 584
Likes (Received): 189

Quote:
Originally Posted by Niemiec w Polsce View Post
At which gates are you stuck? Those where you have to pay 15 zł? Those ones are private as well. Only Konin-Strykow is non-private and never saw traffic jams there.
Well, it happened at both: the private and GDDKiA-run stretches, the situation with only one booth open was on the public one though.

I will let people know what the operators replied once they do, both here and in the Polish section.

I remember taking the A-2 like ten years ago - not that much traffic back then, but now it seems to me it has increased a lot, despite the high tolls. (private stretch)
asahi no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
autostrady, expressways, highway, motorways, polish motorways, polish roads, polskie drogi, road

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 04:04 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium