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Old August 26th, 2015, 05:03 PM   #14561
baderman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Are they really going to construct all these motorways by 2023?
There's old polish saying:
"No one can give you that much, as we can promise to you"

and it fits this situation very well.
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Old August 26th, 2015, 05:18 PM   #14562
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but they promise a lot, so maybe still, can get pavement on A 18 finally
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Old August 26th, 2015, 06:12 PM   #14563
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanadzie View Post
can get pavement on A 18 finally
Yeah, finally the southern carriageway will gain new surface/pavement for sure, basically carriageway will be built from scratch.
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Old August 26th, 2015, 06:27 PM   #14564
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What's the meaning (translation) of the legend:

green = existing
blue = to be built 2014-2023
yellow = New invest ......????
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Which new motorways are currently under construction?
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Old August 26th, 2015, 06:42 PM   #14565
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
What's the meaning (translation) of the legend:

green = existing
blue = to be built 2014-2023
yellow = New invest ......????
green - finished or being currently constructed
blue - new investments included in "Construction program of national roads for years 2014-2023"
yellow - new investments in forumla of "special purpouse road company"
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Old August 26th, 2015, 08:40 PM   #14566
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Thanks, but what does yellow mean. To be constucted by 2023? What does "special" mean, earlier/later? What's the difference to blue?
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Which new motorways are currently under construction?
Which new motorways will be opened next?

See 'New motorway projects' thread

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Old August 26th, 2015, 09:20 PM   #14567
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yellow- different source of financing knowns as DSSP (Drogowa Spółka Specjalnego Przeznaczenia - The Special Surpose Road Company) - no any EU funding, but completion still by 2023.
DSSP is gonna be 100% State Company.

What`s more, some "blue stretches", like A2 (most eastern), S10, S11, S12, S74, S17 (most eastern) and S19 (most northern and southern) to be completed by 2027, means beginning of construction cca. 2025.
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Old August 26th, 2015, 10:02 PM   #14568
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What's about S8 south of A4, 1st c/w only? DKx/Sx south of A4 up to Nowego Sacza i Chelmca, 1st c/w only? 2-laned DKx/Sx b/n A2 and S11? I think these projects are also "new". Will there be space reservation for a 2nd c/w?
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Which new motorways are currently under construction?
Which new motorways will be opened next?

See 'New motorway projects' thread

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Old August 26th, 2015, 10:25 PM   #14569
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No any details known regarding upgrading DK8 and DK75, both south of A4. The same with Dk 25 b/n S11 and A2. Maybe something like 2+1 but still 1 c/w and grade-separated?
There are new for sure.
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Old August 27th, 2015, 11:52 AM   #14570
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I would be careful with taking these announcements too seriously.

Poland is most likely facing government change in the next few months and the new government can put more emphasis in the east of the country (for example) or on some vanity projects.

Also, nobody really knows how big financial hole we have in our mining industry. It might affect spending on anything else (including roads).

At the moment I'm only confident of those projects where contracts are signed or due to be signed in the next few months.

Everything else might well change.
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Old August 28th, 2015, 10:49 AM   #14571
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...plans or pork barrel ?







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Old August 28th, 2015, 11:13 AM   #14572
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There are fake dates! The map contains many mistakes... just remove it!
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Old August 28th, 2015, 12:05 PM   #14573
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Considering this parliamentary question (about S11) and its answer I suggest deep scepticism.

As we can see, there are no plans either general or detailed for some of the roads (at least - for S11 in most of its course), so no proper costs estimations can be done. There are no defined sources of money for those roads, and - let us remember - Poland has problems with handling of debt, with lawsuit about legality of seizing money from private pension funds rolling in the background.
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Old August 28th, 2015, 02:09 PM   #14574
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I don't see much 'pork barrel' spending. All regions profit, instead of just one or two. I think constructing the entire Polish motorway plan in 10 years is more unrealistic than pork barrel.
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Old August 28th, 2015, 03:43 PM   #14575
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On a slightly related note, I drove from Wrocław to Poznań last week, and the S5 is really starting to take shape. If there's a mild winter and work can continue, I'm quite optimistic that it will open ahead of schedule, at least on the worst section between Trzebnica and Wrocław.

On the subject of that map above - I would say that we're almost certainly heading for electronic tolling or a vignette system.
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Old August 29th, 2015, 10:17 AM   #14576
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At first glance 2023 plan seems to be completely unrealistic however when
you consider which constructions are in advance stage it looks more realistic.

Well , they announced 6 tenders for S19 Lublin - Rzeszow,
they are finishing KP for S61 from S8 to Lithuania and tenders
will be announced soon , same the rest of S6 Koszalin - Gdynia

so what is left ?
biggest task S11 , then S10
S12 and S74 are not that long (but not short as well of course)
then then a half of S19

then some short missing shorter sections of expressways
that like A1 , A2, S3 , S7 which are not in tender phase yet

not saying it`s easy , just saying if we
summarize what is ready or UC or in tender or will be tendered soon
cause KP is almost finished we have 72% of network
so 28% doesn`t look that like science fiction

so in 2023 should be 72% of complete network
we are talking what is realistic from remaining 28%

from that perspective this sounds very optimistic
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Old August 29th, 2015, 12:15 PM   #14577
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Remember that S10, S11, most of S12, less needed parts of S19 or S17 and S74 is expected to be completed around 2023-2027. I think is little optimistic challenge but feasible for sure.
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Old August 29th, 2015, 08:00 PM   #14578
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At least we can be confident that most of the planned network will be completed by about 2027 -- unless the new government makes a complete mess of it.
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Old August 29th, 2015, 08:39 PM   #14579
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I don't think either party will drastically change direction in regard of highway construction. There's too much prestige at stake and there seems to be little if any opposition to the motorway plan of Poland.

This appears similar to Spain, where both traditionally largest parties left and right of center advocated to be the one government that built as much infrastructure as possible.

The biggest threat may be the European Union, which plans to spend way too much money on rail projects compared to motorways.
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Old August 29th, 2015, 09:29 PM   #14580
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