daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Highways & Autobahns

Highways & Autobahns All about automobility



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old August 18th, 2013, 06:07 PM   #2181
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,595
Likes (Received): 19389

E18 Varodd Bridge, Kristiansand

I was looking into the Varodd Bridge replacement.

The Varodd Bridge are actually two bridges, a suspension bridge built in 1956 and a concrete cantilever bridge built in 1994. They will replace the 1956 bridge with a new span identical to the 1994 bridge.

I wonder if this is the first time in modern days that a large suspension bridge will be demolished.

I also wondered about the addition of bus lanes on either side of the bridge. According to documentation, the bridge carries only 40 000 vehicles per day, which means congestion is very unlikely except for accidents. Why the separate bus lane?

ChrisZwolle no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old August 18th, 2013, 11:49 PM   #2182
devo
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 221
Likes (Received): 41

Oh hello there this is my home turf, as I live here in Kristiansand...

The bus lane is idiotic. Instead of a continuous junction lane from just to the right of the picture, over the bridge and a couple of hundred meters... Buses won't have ANY problems with traffic, and since they can run "through" the junction, they'll have this lane for them selves anyway. And as you say, 40.000 vehicles per day, no point at all. So why? Well, it looks good on the green statistics, look we have so and so many meters of bus lanes. You get the idea... (we get more money from the government if we can get car usage to decline)

Now to the fun facts: (correct me if I'm wrong)

· The old suspension bridge was northern Europe's longest suspension bridge when it opened.
· The new bridge from 1994 was also the largest (longest?) of it's kind when opened.
· Everything is prepared for a second bridge below water. Clever to avoid blasting rock underwater next to the current foundations.
· However, due to the addition of a third lane (and bike lane), it might be necessary to widen the platform for the foundations.
· The bridge from 1994 already has width for three lanes, the bike lane will be removed and moved over to the new bridge. This will create another crossing for bike traffic, which zig-zags E 18 a lot.
· There is not enough room for the new bridge now that bike and bus lane has been added, so the "edge" of the bridge will be built after the suspension bridge is demolished.
· As you can see in the picture, the old bridge has been recently repaved. This has to be done quite often, due to the fact that the asphalt layer on the bridge is very thin, and the cracks that occur in the joints of the bridge segments get deep.
· If there is an (unlikely) accident that will block both bridges, the only route around the Topdal fjord is a narrow road where two trucks cannot pass.

A photo of the suspension bridge just after it opened:
(note that pedestrians were not considered important, the narrow pavement was replaced by the current (closed) pavement on each side of the bridge.)


Video of construction:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cd0yK71c8pM
Video of opening:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ayEDUSJvPek
__________________

suburbicide liked this post
devo no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 19th, 2013, 12:03 AM   #2183
Galro
Humanity through Urbanity
 
Galro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 12,354
Likes (Received): 10047

Quote:
Originally Posted by devo View Post
You get the idea... (we get more money from the government if we can get car usage to decline)
]
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure this money depends on what kind of measurements you put in place to get a decline in car usage too. I.e. you will get less money if you have natural decline in car usage than if you have the same decline due to having put extra toll rings, congestion charge, bike lanes, bus lanes and stuff like that around the place. The politicians in Oslo have been rather angry at this as they have received less money as they have not introduced congestion charge but have still managed to get a lower increase in car usage than the population grows with.
Galro no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 19th, 2013, 02:41 AM   #2184
RV
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Porvoo
Posts: 726
Likes (Received): 275

40 000 vehicles now means probably 60 000 in 30 years, so third lanes are justified. I really hate those empty bus lanes, they should all be converted into regular ones - Finland has them everywhere, it's so dumb to see two lanes with snail-slow traffic and one empty one on the side.
RV no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 19th, 2013, 12:28 PM   #2185
devo
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 221
Likes (Received): 41

Quote:
Originally Posted by Galro View Post
Correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure this money depends on what kind of measurements you put in place to get a decline in car usage too. I.e. you will get less money if you have natural decline in car usage than if you have the same decline due to having put extra toll rings, congestion charge, bike lanes, bus lanes and stuff like that around the place. The politicians in Oslo have been rather angry at this as they have received less money as they have not introduced congestion charge but have still managed to get a lower increase in car usage than the population grows with.
You are absolutely right. Kristiansand will actually have to have zero (or less) growth in car traffic, since it has to be adjusted to population growth. And since we have toll rings with congestion charge we are in the safe box. Oslo is just an insane mess barely surviving on planning decisions made 50-60 years ago.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RV View Post
40 000 vehicles now means probably 60 000 in 30 years, so third lanes are justified. (...)
Oh yes, the traffic is actually calculated to about 70.000 vehicles in 2040. So by all means, the third lane is justified, but as a bus lane? No, thank you, there is no need for that. Or, well it might be necessary until E 18/E 39 west from Gartnerløkka is completed. The queues from the single lane bridge after the Banehei Tunnel will some day reach the Varodd Bridge and that might, perhaps, block bus traffic. Another fact is that before the two tunnels through the town (Oddernes & Banehei Tunnel) were built, this road had a bus lane and 2+ lane going westbound (into town.)
devo no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 19th, 2013, 02:29 PM   #2186
MattiG
Registered User
 
MattiG's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Espoo FI
Posts: 1,801
Likes (Received): 615

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post

I wonder if this is the first time in modern days that a large suspension bridge will be demolished.
Finland built seven rather impressive suspension steel bridges between the years 1957 and 1964. The Hännilänsalmi bridge on the current road 4/E75 was opened in 1962, and it replaced the last ferry on the Finnish primary roads.



The bridge was replaced by a not so impressive concrete cantilever bridge in 2009, and the suspension bridge was demolished. The bridge was smaller than Varoddbrua, the main span width was 125 metres.

The remaining six bridges are still in use.
MattiG no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 19th, 2013, 03:05 PM   #2187
javimix19
Registered User
 
javimix19's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Donostia-San Sebastián
Posts: 749
Likes (Received): 1328

What is the safest and fastest way to go between Oslo and Bergen?

What is the most used system by the norways? (to go between Oslo and Bergen)

I read E-16 was improved in the last years but I don't know if the railway is best than the road. (or ferry)

Perhaps the most used way is by plane I don't know. This is only a curiosity, I won't do this trip. I am in Basque Country, but perhaps in the future...
javimix19 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 19th, 2013, 03:20 PM   #2188
Heico-M
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Flensburg, DE
Posts: 290
Likes (Received): 115

Many go by plane or by train, the Bergen railway (Bergensbanen) is very famous.

If you want to go by car, then the E16 normally is a good choice, currently, an important tunnel is closed (see above in this thread), and there is no bypass that deserves the name.

An alternative route is to take national road no. 7 and take the newly opened Hardanger bridge, making this trip ferry free, too.

The point is, going from Oslo to Bergen means, that sooner or later, you have to cross the mountains.
__________________

javimix19 liked this post
Heico-M no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 19th, 2013, 04:44 PM   #2189
Galro
Humanity through Urbanity
 
Galro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 12,354
Likes (Received): 10047

Kråkerøybrua in Fredrikstad will be closed for all traffic after it was discovered that one of the locking bolts was damaged.

http://www.bygg.no/2013/08/110929.0

Galro no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 19th, 2013, 04:55 PM   #2190
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,595
Likes (Received): 19389

Kind of convenient that the new Værstebrua was completed two years ago. Otherwise quite a large amount of people would have been unconnected from the rest of Norway.
ChrisZwolle no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 19th, 2013, 06:15 PM   #2191
Gsus
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 148
Likes (Received): 53

Quote:
Originally Posted by devo View Post
Oh yes, the traffic is actually calculated to about 70.000 vehicles in 2040. So by all means, the third lane is justified, but as a bus lane? No, thank you, there is no need for that.
There tunnel north of the bridges does'nt have more than two lanes in each directions. This means that the third lane will have to turn of at the end of the bridge. This could just make jams during rush-hour before the tunnel, as cars will have to changing lanes. There is also just two lanes in each direction further into Kristiansand.

The only thing is if there is a lot of traffic between the two intersections on each side of Varoddbrua. Then it could function as a continuous acceleration/retardation lane, but I think the buses will have more to win on it. There will also be a lot less buses that will merge to the E18 lanes before the tunnel, than the number of cars that will merge. That means less problems whit lane-changing during peak-hours.
Gsus no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 19th, 2013, 06:22 PM   #2192
ElviS77
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 564
Likes (Received): 54

Quote:
Originally Posted by javimix19 View Post
What is the safest and fastest way to go between Oslo and Bergen?

What is the most used system by the norways? (to go between Oslo and Bergen)

I read E-16 was improved in the last years but I don't know if the railway is best than the road. (or ferry)

Perhaps the most used way is by plane I don't know. This is only a curiosity, I won't do this trip. I am in Basque Country, but perhaps in the future...
Safest, fastest, most commonly used way of travel: by plane. Oslo-Bergen (and Oslo-Trondheim) are among the busiest air routes in Europe. Bergensbanen (train) is nice, but still too slow to offer any real competition to air travel. By road you have at least five reasonable alternatives - E16, rv 7, rv 52, fv 50, E134. The E16 is gradually being improved and it's the least troublesome in winter, but it's also the longest. Rv 7 is the shortest and now ferry-free, but Hardangervidda is a major obstacle during the winter months. The E134 plus connections on the western side of the mountains could potentially be made the shortest and quickest, but that's not happening anytime soon, although plans for a new and seriously improved Haukeli mountain road is at a semi-advanced stage.

The main issue is that none of these roads can get absolute priority, as all of them (with the exception of fv 50) are important local and regional east-west links whereas the amount of actual Oslo-Bergen traffic is fairly low. It is a somewhat similar situation between Oslo and Trondheim, but since there are only two reasonable options there (which both pick up a fair amount of regional traffic - the southern section of the E6 also carries Oslo-bound traffic from the north-western Sogn og Fjordane and Møre og Romsdal counties) both the rv 3 and the E6 are busier than all the east-west connections.
__________________

javimix19 liked this post
ElviS77 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 20th, 2013, 12:27 AM   #2193
devo
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 221
Likes (Received): 41

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gsus View Post
There tunnel north of the bridges does'nt have more than two lanes in each directions. This means that the third lane will have to turn of at the end of the bridge. This could just make jams during rush-hour before the tunnel, as cars will have to changing lanes. There is also just two lanes in each direction further into Kristiansand.

The only thing is if there is a lot of traffic between the two intersections on each side of Varoddbrua. Then it could function as a continuous acceleration/retardation lane, but I think the buses will have more to win on it. There will also be a lot less buses that will merge to the E18 lanes before the tunnel, than the number of cars that will merge. That means less problems whit lane-changing during peak-hours.
Both tunnels should be widened to three lanes, the junction at Rona should be free-flow and the road network to Dvergsnes and Høvåg needs a re-think beyond the evolution of roundabouts. There would definitly be enough traffic to make the third lane function as a continuous acceleration/retardation lane, especially if it was continiued through the tunnel. Then, all traffic going to Hånes, Søm, Dvergsnes and Høvåg would use that lane. So almost all of East-Kristiansand. Except Sørlandsparken and everything north of Hånes (Rv 41).
devo no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 20th, 2013, 08:40 PM   #2194
Gsus
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 148
Likes (Received): 53

Quote:
Originally Posted by devo View Post
Both tunnels should be widened to three lanes, the junction at Rona should be free-flow and the road network to Dvergsnes and Høvåg needs a re-think beyond the evolution of roundabouts. There would definitly be enough traffic to make the third lane function as a continuous acceleration/retardation lane, especially if it was continiued through the tunnel. Then, all traffic going to Hånes, Søm, Dvergsnes and Høvåg would use that lane. So almost all of East-Kristiansand. Except Sørlandsparken and everything north of Hånes (Rv 41).
And the tunnels is exactly the problem, and theres no way they will be prioritized for expanding. That would make a complete traffic-chaos in the area, as the tunnels will have to be closed (even by taking one at the time) for a long time during expanding. The only possible alternative for expanding capacity through the mountain north of Varoddbrua as I see it, is by building a new tunnel with three-four lanes for one direction traffic, and use the existing tunnels as the other. And that makes a very different situation than what i planned with the new bridge.
Gsus no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 20th, 2013, 08:45 PM   #2195
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,595
Likes (Received): 19389

Where will all this traffic growth come from? Are they planning to urbanize the area east of the tunnels?

By the way the tolls in Kristiansand will be reduced to 14 NOK outside rush hour.
ChrisZwolle no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 21st, 2013, 01:05 AM   #2196
devo
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 221
Likes (Received): 41

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Where will all this traffic growth come from? Are they planning to urbanize the area east of the tunnels?
(...).
Yes.

Lauvåsen is an ongoing project, Hamrevann is in the future, also another project close to Rona (Nottangen bridge) and the junction with E 18. Then there are more projects in the Dvergsnes area (where Aker Solutions and National Oilwell have large offices and workshops).

I also guess that commute from Lillesand and other areas will contribute to the growth.

And regarding the business with closing the tunnels for widening... It's better to do it now than later, when the traffic will be even more ridiculous. Remember, it is only 4 years ago traffic was two lane from this point going eastbound. They could let some traffic run along the old E 18 outside of the tunnel, so I don't think it's completely ludacris. When done with one, they could have reversible three lanes in the other depending on rush hour traffic.

But all of this would be unnecessary if they just built a ring road from north of the zoo, just north of the airport and then down to follow the now proposed ring road from Narvika to Hellemyr.

Time Will Show.
devo no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 21st, 2013, 10:05 AM   #2197
Ingenioren
Registered User
 
Ingenioren's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Oslo
Posts: 5,605
Likes (Received): 584

9 km of new motorway is ready to start construction on Rv4 in Hadeland:



The road starts at the Lunner north municipal boundary and ends at the Fv34 intersection. Opening during 2016. This is the first part of Rv4 to be built as a full motorway. Another 4 km south to E16 junction is planned for motorway construction, but the rest of Rv4 will be upgraded with passing lanes - new intersections and barrier construction.

Parts of the new road can be seen in this animation:
__________________
I want to see some construction!
Ingenioren no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 22nd, 2013, 03:18 PM   #2198
Galro
Humanity through Urbanity
 
Galro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 12,354
Likes (Received): 10047

Various alternatives for new e-18 bridge crossing the Eidanger fjord. Number 6 is currently considered to be most realistic one.



http://www.bygg.no/2013/08/111313.0

Location: https://maps.google.com/maps?q=Eidan...erfjorden&z=13
Galro no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 22nd, 2013, 03:51 PM   #2199
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,595
Likes (Received): 19389

That will likely be a large suspension span, considering the length needed to span the fjord. Unless the fjord is shallow, which would allow the pylons to be further in the water.
ChrisZwolle no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 22nd, 2013, 04:11 PM   #2200
Galro
Humanity through Urbanity
 
Galro's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 12,354
Likes (Received): 10047

I believe the fjord is about 100m deep.



https://docs.google.com/viewer?docex...%20Beylich.pdf
Galro no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
norway

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 08:24 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium