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Old February 18th, 2015, 11:29 AM   #3201
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Drawing maps is easier than about anything, especially when the others are expected to pay the cost.
I though the previous one was a real government plan.
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In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.
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Old February 18th, 2015, 12:14 PM   #3202
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I though the previous one was a real government plan.
It was not.

I do not know exactly which kind of an association that ABV is. It is a association to push politicians to invest more in the road network. A personal membership may be applied, the membership fee is NOK 200 (about EUR 24) per annum.
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Old February 18th, 2015, 12:58 PM   #3203
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Ryfylke Tunnel progress:
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Old February 18th, 2015, 09:10 PM   #3204
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I think some people are way too ambitious. Don't forget Norway only has a little over 5 million inhabitants, has very long distances between its bigger cities, and a very challenging topography. Traffic levels are very low on most of these national roads.

I agree better road networks around and close to the bigger cities, should be a minimum demand though. And then straighter regional/national roads, 1+1 (With "midtrabatt" and plenty of good passing opportunities, ala Frya-Sjoa) should be well sufficent.
This is a long term (20 year) plan, but IMO the links between Oslo and Trondheim/Bergen/Stavanger should have been built long ago. The distances are not particularly long. If you include sections for which there are detailed plans or have already been built, only 316 km remains on Trondheim-Oslo via Østerdalen (which for most part is not very hilly) and 500-600 km Oslo-Bergen/Stavanger via Haukeli, altogether 800-900 km.

Traffic numbers on the loneliest places of the current trunk roads are not very relevant, the numbers are suppressed because the traffic is distributed between many different routes with similar (low) standard and because driving distances currently makes almost all people travel by air. With our rapid population growth, traffic will still probably (continue to) increase dramatically in the years ahead. As an example, according to a recent study by Statens vegvesen, the traffic across Haukeli (E134) could increase to an AADT of 8250 in 2050 if the road was improved, including some new tunnels and bridge across the Hardanger fjord, but a general speed limit of 80 km/h. With a motorway, meaning a travel time of 3.5 hours Bergen-Oslo with 120 km/h, the traffic will of course be much higher, and we all know how the government has dramatically underestimated traffic growth for decades. Now, that does not mean that we could expect to see regular traffic jams across the mountains with the current two-lane roads, but a motorway network certainly will make sense from an economical perspective due to dramatically decreased transport times, lower accident rates, and less dependence on air travel.

Norway has currently one of the lowest motorway lengths per capita in the developed world. According to this source 42 mm, which is approximately 1/5 of what they have in our neighboring countries Denmark and Sweden. Now, that statistics seem outdated, and the current Norwegian number should be closer to 432/5.2=83 mm which still means that we are far down on the list even if we do not update the other countries similarly (Eg. Sweden is currently adding kms to their motorway network much faster than us). By adding ~900 kms and the 1 M additional people expected according to SSB in 20 years, we will be at the level Sweden / Denmark used to be some years back. The ABV network is of course longer than this, but still we will be far from the top of the list in 20 years assuming that also other countries develop, so it is not really an extreme case except compared with historic Norwegian highway construction rates.....

Extensive motorway construction should IMO not be a top priority in urban areas, where other means of transport will be a more rational choice.

For reference, the official Norwegian population prognosis from Statistics Norway is provided below. Each alternative is described by four letters in the following order: fertility, life expectancy, internal migration and immigration. M = medium, L = low and H = high
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Old February 19th, 2015, 12:32 PM   #3205
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I think some people are way too ambitious. Don't forget Norway only has a little over 5 million inhabitants, has very long distances between its bigger cities, and a very challenging topography. Traffic levels are very low on most of these national roads.

I agree better road networks around and close to the bigger cities, should be a minimum demand though. And then straighter regional/national roads, 1+1 (With "midtrabatt" and plenty of good passing opportunities, ala Frya-Sjoa) should be well sufficent.
Exactly!
Population wise we are a small country, but distance wise we are quite the opposite.
The distance from Oslo to to most northern point equals the distance from Oslo to Rome, Italy... Of course we can't afford to build 6 or even 4 lane roads "everywhere".

The four most northern counties (Nord-Trøndelag, Nordland, Troms and Finnmark) are in total populated by less than Oslo city alone. A road distance of 2000 km from Stjørdal to Kirkenes.
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Old February 20th, 2015, 03:27 AM   #3206
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E39 Volleberg-Døle bru



Here's a visualization of the alternative of this strech in Vest-Agder fylke that Statens Vegvesen is proposing. From what I've gathered from the documents the width of this motorway will be 23m and 20m. Building is planned to start in 2018.



Statens vegvesen - E39 Volleberg-Døle bru
by Vegvesenet
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Old February 20th, 2015, 03:33 AM   #3207
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Exactly!
Population wise we are a small country, but distance wise we are quite the opposite.
The distance from Oslo to to most northern point equals the distance from Oslo to Rome, Italy... Of course we can't afford to build 6 or even 4 lane roads "everywhere".

The four most northern counties (Nord-Trøndelag, Nordland, Troms and Finnmark) are in total populated by less than Oslo city alone. A road distance of 2000 km from Stjørdal to Kirkenes.
In case you didn't notice, nobody is suggesting constructing a motorway to Kirkenes. The fact that the distances are large up north is irrelevant when discussing motorways in the south.
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Old February 20th, 2015, 03:29 PM   #3208
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In case you didn't notice, nobody is suggesting constructing a motorway to Kirkenes. The fact that the distances are large up north is irrelevant when discussing motorways in the south.
Oh, really! Seen the post by MattiG above?
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Old February 20th, 2015, 07:59 PM   #3209
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What about beginning with a decent 1+1 on all E routes?
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Old February 20th, 2015, 10:09 PM   #3210
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IMO that is not needed, it will not solve our problems, and it will probably be more expensive. There are 6 000 km of E-roads in Norway.

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Oh, really! Seen the post by MattiG above?
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Old February 20th, 2015, 10:17 PM   #3211
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Realistically, linking Trondheim, Bergen and Stavenger to Oslo with highways will be an accomplishment, I'd think?
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Old February 20th, 2015, 10:30 PM   #3212
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IMO that is not needed, it will not solve our problems, and it will probably be more expensive. There are 6 000 km of E-roads in Norway.
And most of them are at the standard pushed for. Widening 2000km of narrow two-lane road to proper two-lane road sounds a lot cheaper than the masses of motorway-grade road proposed by the build lots plan seen above. Sure, a motorway to Bergen/Haugesund and Trondheim, as well as a Bergen-Stavanger-Kristiansand-Oslo coast motorway are worthy aims, but that Oslo network is overkill, as is an having parallel motorways on what is now E6 and Rv3 (and does Alesund and surrounding area really warrant a full motorway?)
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Old February 21st, 2015, 12:35 PM   #3213
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IMO that is not needed, it will not solve our problems, and it will probably be more expensive. There are 6 000 km of E-roads in Norway.
Of course it's expensive. I guess Finnish 4/E75 beyond Kaamanen/Inari was expensive as well. We didn't need a road that wide (even though it's just 1+1, but a good one at that), less than a 1000 people in Finland live there; the road is there for Norway

Compare that to E6 in Tana valley (west of its merging with E75), which presumably serves roughly the same areas: this makes Norway look like a developing 3rd world country, which I know it is not.
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Old February 21st, 2015, 12:52 PM   #3214
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The E18 Skjeggestad Bridge will be blasted at 2 p.m.

NRK will broadcast it live.

http://www.nrk.no/vestfold/her-ser-d...fta-1.12220076
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Old February 21st, 2015, 03:14 PM   #3215
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And it blew up at 14:10 hrs exactly.

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Old February 21st, 2015, 03:36 PM   #3216
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Will the bridge reconstructed? It will look like the parallel one?
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Old February 21st, 2015, 06:06 PM   #3217
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Will the bridge reconstructed? It will look like the parallel one?
It will without a doubt be rebuilt. If it will look like the other one, I don`t know. Propaply it will be the same concept, but there are other requirements for dimentioning a bridges today than in 1998, which may give a new bridge some cosmetic terms. But I`m not sure it the whole bridge will be reconstructed, or only parts of it. Parts of it is still standing, but that does`nt mean the rest will be standing. Reuse of parts of the bridge means that the reinforcement was`nt continous over the pillars, as the reinforcement in the collapset part must have been beyond the yield point. It was important tho to demolish the collapsed part controlled, before it collapsed even more
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Old February 21st, 2015, 09:17 PM   #3218
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Another angle (first 15 seconds of the video are the most interesting, unless you like to see dust for a long time).

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Old February 22nd, 2015, 06:26 PM   #3219
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A drone video:

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Old February 22nd, 2015, 07:02 PM   #3220
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And most of them are at the standard pushed for. Widening 2000km of narrow two-lane road to proper two-lane road sounds a lot cheaper than the masses of motorway-grade road proposed by the build lots plan seen above. Sure, a motorway to Bergen/Haugesund and Trondheim, as well as a Bergen-Stavanger-Kristiansand-Oslo coast motorway are worthy aims, but that Oslo network is overkill, as is an having parallel motorways on what is now E6 and Rv3 (and does Alesund and surrounding area really warrant a full motorway?)
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Of course it's expensive. I guess Finnish 4/E75 beyond Kaamanen/Inari was expensive as well. We didn't need a road that wide (even though it's just 1+1, but a good one at that), less than a 1000 people in Finland live there; the road is there for Norway

Compare that to E6 in Tana valley (west of its merging with E75), which presumably serves roughly the same areas: this makes Norway look like a developing 3rd world country, which I know it is not.
Just to be clear on this, what I interpret as a decent 1+1 is a 12.5 m wide road with barriers separating the lanes following standards of curvature etc. which is often far from what current Norwegian highways have. Hence, bringing the entire E-network (6000 km) up to this standard would be very expensive.

With regards to E6 and Rv 3 (renamed E136 and E6, respectively, in the map), they are not really paralelle as they serve different purposes, and this will always be the case regardless of what is constructed. This has been discussed over and over again in this forum, but the short story is that when it comes to long distance traffic, this part of E6 serves north-western Norway, whereas rv3 serves mid-Norway (ie Trondheim area) and beyond. Current E6 alignment is simply too long and too steep to serve as a route between Trondheim and the southern and eastern parts of southern Norway. In addition it passes through a national partk which will make motorway construction very difficult politically.
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