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Old June 8th, 2016, 02:22 PM   #3701
berlinwroclaw
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E134 junction with E39 in Haugesund. Bottom: E134 to Haugesund, top: E139 to Oslo, left: E39 to Bergen. On satellite images you can see that there is reservation for 2x2 under the viaduct for E134. Together with the upcoming widening of the E39 it will be a motorway junction in English, the Germans will call it "Autobahndreieck". Sounds good, isn't it?
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Old June 8th, 2016, 08:18 PM   #3702
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I drove through Oslo today. The Bryn Tunnel of E6 was down to one lane for renovation, it is quite the bottleneck. I also stopped at the new E6 rest area near Espa, I really like how they built it as a park with a great view of Lake Mjsa.
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Old June 8th, 2016, 11:00 PM   #3703
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Quote:
Originally Posted by berlinwroclaw View Post
Very sad that the E134 motorway Bergen-Olso as national project is under pressure
Not even just a Bergen - Oslo project, an upgraded road over Haukeli serves the 3 most important regions in west Norway equally as well as provide Bergen with quick acces to the south-east.
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Old June 8th, 2016, 11:35 PM   #3704
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IceCheese View Post
I'm not criticising the construction of motorways on longer stretches between cities. E18 through Oslo is already at motorway standard with a few exceptions.
Here we agree with each other
For the metro answers, see SSC Oslo metro pages: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpo...&postcount=366
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Old June 9th, 2016, 08:58 AM   #3705
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Speaking of Ring 4 and other Oslo bypasses, what about an another tube across Oslofjord? And for that matter, improvement for the entire 23?
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Old June 9th, 2016, 11:51 AM   #3706
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Originally Posted by OulaL View Post
Speaking of Ring 4 and other Oslo bypasses, what about an another tube across Oslofjord? And for that matter, improvement for the entire 23?

Crossing Oslofjord on Ring 4 will be done by upgrading Rv23 with new bridge.

New Rv23 motorway bridge between E6 and E18 can be ready in 2025.




Oslo bypass plans via Oslofjord are now concentrated on Rv23. Proposal is not to build another tube, but a new bridge. The decision is to the Minister of Transport to build a new bridge via Hya and Ryken as new bypass of Oslo, or to a second tunnel. The arguments to build a new Oslofjord motorway bridge:

Oslo agglomeration will grow to 3,4 million in 2040;
Norway needs to export other products than oil in 2040, so a motorway bridge between E18 and E6 will be necessary.

Disadvantage is that the new motorway bridge will be ready not earlier than 2025 and has higher costs, while a cheaper tunnel can be ready in 2022.
National Road Administration wants the bridge instead of a second tunnel. Ministry of Transport asked second opinion from Atkins AS. The National Road Administration decision was supported. European Union requires that the old Rv23 Oslo fjord tunnel must be better secured by 2019.
http://www.bygg.no/article/1272830

Our patience will be tested again to hear the decision. The minority government doesn't make decisions easy.
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Old June 9th, 2016, 01:11 PM   #3707
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ingenioren View Post
Not even just a Bergen - Oslo project, an upgraded road over Haukeli serves the 3 most important regions in west Norway equally as well as provide Bergen with quick acces to the south-east.
True. Such an upgraded road over Haukeli and an E134 2x2 motorway, maybe with some 1+2 sections can be ready in 2025, if local and central governance have focus for the future of Norway. Some E134 motorway action groups are doing their best. But more will be needed. People in Bergen don't know what long distance travelling by car is. They think the road Bergen-Oslo is only for regional purposes, going to a second house or for tourists. When you read the newspapers in Bergen you see that there is a lot of unawareness about the possibilities of car driving on a motorway. Western Norway is a developing country on motorways, while the South East can already enjoy European motorways. Why can people in Bergen, Haugesund and Stavanger not enjoy what drivers in Lillehammer, Hamar, Kristiansand can do?


Now Bergen has to beg for a motorway connection with E134. The missing link between Odda and Bergen by Jondal bridge is still not appoved. However, cars and trucks will find their way to the shorter and faster E134 to Oslo.

What about the upgraded E134 over Haukeli?


Discussion is now about 2 tunnels for snow-free traveling but costs 14 billon NOK or 4 shorter tunnels for 6 billion NOK. Minister of Transport and National Road Administration want the 4 shorter tunnels. But what is 7 billion extra, compared with the future of Norway? Did the government and National Road Administration do a good business case? I have doubts. We are talking like you said about the most important regions. Oil will be over in 2040 and Norway needs the good export facilities of the western regions, including Bergen, Haugesund and Stavanger.
Indeed quick access of the west to the south-east is a primary need for the vitality of the country.
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Old June 9th, 2016, 01:50 PM   #3708
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Good news from the minister of infrastructure Kjetil Solvik Olsen. E18 Lysaker - Drengsrud will get 3+3 lanes all the way, and the entire stretch will be built. Planning continues as before, and the recently Oslopakke 3-agreement will not change the general preconditions regarding standard and basic solutions.

http://www.tv2.no/nyheter/8370462/
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Old June 9th, 2016, 02:14 PM   #3709
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Originally Posted by Stafangr View Post
The investments in those motorways are about creating better connections to neighbouring regions and other large cities in Norway, not (mainly) for commuters. Oslo has already got a great motorway network to its regional neighbours.
Unfortunately we see the greatness of the Oslo motorway only in traffic jam and toll prices. The rapid growth of Oslo and slow construction of new motorways may result that we see the traffic jam report as below more and more. But we will have patience..... Finally there will be a change....


Quote:
Originally Posted by Stafangr View Post
Have you ever travelled by car between Kristiansand-Stavanger-Bergen? It's a very different experience than driving between Kristiansand-Oslo-Lillehammer.
I will be the first one to drive the new E39 motorway Kristiansand-Stavanger-Bergen

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stafangr View Post
I don't see what's the problem with an "oversized" metro network in Oslo. Isn't that a good thing?
See http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpo...&postcount=366
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Old June 9th, 2016, 02:40 PM   #3710
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Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
I really like how they built it as a park with a great view of Lake Mjsa.
Nice you visited Norway. Perhaps it is the most underestimated tourist country in Europe. But Norway has much more to offer to you than just a big lake. Ever been to Geiranger Fjord? One of the Seven World Wonders according to United Nations and better than the Grand Canyon in the U.S. Just take your car and drive to E6 motorway to Lillehammer (I am sure you will like that road) and follow the E6 to Otta, from there is road 15 to Geiranger. About 5,5 hours driving from where you are.

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Old June 9th, 2016, 04:02 PM   #3711
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stafangr View Post
… by car between Kristiansand-Stavanger …
It will be good for the mood of motorway enthusiasts in Norway to look at good things that already have been done on E39 Kristiansand-Stavanger. Check out that the section around Feda (18 km) has been upgraded recently to pave the way to 2x2 E39 motorway and that there are even motorway half profile sections, an interchange at Freda and an amazing underground interchange at Feda Fjord.



It is nice to drive there. Although there are two lanes, with such straight and fine stretches it encourages fast speeds. People will get used to such sections, and every year more and more motorway sections from E39 Kristiansand-Stavanger will be completed.

Last edited by Mathias Olsen; June 9th, 2016 at 04:09 PM.
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Old June 9th, 2016, 04:29 PM   #3712
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathias Olsen View Post
Nice you visited Norway. Perhaps it is the most underestimated tourist country in Europe. But Norway has much more to offer to you than just a big lake. Ever been to Geiranger Fjord? One of the Seven World Wonders according to United Nations and better than the Grand Canyon in the U.S. Just take your car and drive to E6 motorway to Lillehammer (I am sure you will like that road) and follow the E6 to Otta, from there is road 15 to Geiranger. About 5,5 hours driving from where you are.

I will visit Norway in a month.
I won't say it's underestimated, just very expensive...
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Old June 9th, 2016, 07:58 PM   #3713
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I go camping, it's not particularly expensive then. Just don't buy booze, avoid restaurants and be a little selective when shopping, I hardly spend more in Norway than the Netherlands.

They have some roadworks with periodic closures for blasting. I encountered two today, on Fv. 55 from Lom to Sognefjell, and Fv. 60 from Invik to Olden. I had to wait over an hour on 55 and 30 minutes on 60. It quite adds to your travel time. It took me almost 10 hours to drive 400 km plus photo stops, mostly on Sognefjellsvegen but also Rv. 5, what a scenic route that is from Sogndal to Skei.
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Old June 9th, 2016, 08:55 PM   #3714
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I don't do camping, I will also have to fly there and rent a car. It's much more expensive than where I've been before (maybe except Switzerland).

Anyway, question: which of the 2 routes is better to take?
I don't care about toll costs
https://goo.gl/maps/RdzZeYHjF592
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Old June 9th, 2016, 09:21 PM   #3715
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You could rent a cabin. They are much cheaper than hotels and they are all over the place, literally every 10 km you see 'hytter'. Hotels are expensive in Norway.
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Old June 9th, 2016, 10:13 PM   #3716
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cinxxx View Post
I will visit Norway in a month.
I won't say it's underestimated, just very expensive...
Very expensive: depends on your destiny. Oslo belongs to the 13 most expensive cities on earth, while Lillehammer for example has hotel rooms for just 50 euro, comparable with prices in Germany. Lillehammer has also a German supermarket (Lidl). Check an online booking service for your whishes, such as booking.com for reduced prices.
From my experience, I can say that E6 Oslo-Lillehammer-Otta and road 15 Otta-Fossbergom is like in Germany. The rest depends on how much adventure you want and your driver skills. Check out your road on the photos of maps.google.com. It can be narrow and steep. I wish you a good and safe time in Norway.
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Old June 9th, 2016, 10:18 PM   #3717
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If you have experience in the Alps then Norway is not very different in the summer. The major difference is distance and lack of high-speed roads in many places. In Sogn og Fjordane or the coastal area it takes forever to travel 150 km, compared to the Alps.

Traffic in the mountains is usually light. The lineup at Fv. 55 was maybe 50 vehicles after 90 minutes of closure.
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Old June 9th, 2016, 10:22 PM   #3718
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I kind of have a feeling that the "city-government" in Oslo may make driving by car so expensive that traffic may drop enough that further road-expanding will be unesesary. They have a goal in 15% (that includes commercial traffic) drop in traffic, and I`m not sure the newly decided toll-prices is gonna make that happen, which will result in even higher prices, and maybe more toll-gates. At some point, the common citizen is not gonna afford paying tolls on a daily basis, and public transportation is gonna be the only option, even tho it for some even in the Oslo-area may take twice the travel time comparet to driving. With this Im afraid it will make Oslo a "looser-city", with the flexibility in driving a car vanishing. In many contexts it`s gonna make Oslo unattractive for businesses compared to Copenhagen, Gothenburg and Stockholm, cities that put money on more than one card (read public transportation). There is a big psychological effect in not being able to use a car in many contexts. This determines a lot in where businesses and shops will locate. If anything like this should happen, I hope someone sees the warning signs! I really hope it`s just me who`s pessimistic

Im really disappointed of the Labour party in Oslo who seems to have gone further down than their knees in the pursuit of taking the power in Oslo last fall. The labour party has always been a party who has seen the main lines in the society, and putting vested interesest aside. But they`ve taken a large turn in Oslo, which is also a major voice for the party when it comes to national politics. Gonna be interesting to see the continuation.
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Old June 9th, 2016, 10:30 PM   #3719
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Often Labour / social democrats are afraid losing voters to green parties, so they often vote with them, ignoring their constituency who often don't work in fancy office buildings near a train station, but rely on a car to get to places in a timely manner.

Another often overlooked fact is that two-thirds of car travel is for purposes other than to and from work, these trips are less likely to be competitive with public transport, that's why it often doesn't reduce congestion - if at all.
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Old June 10th, 2016, 10:08 AM   #3720
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ingenioren View Post
Not even just a Bergen - Oslo project, an upgraded road over Haukeli serves the 3 most important regions in west Norway equally as well as provide Bergen with quick access to the south-east.
Yes, not only Bergen, but also Haugesund and Stavanger need the "Bergen arm" to E134 to be sure about maximum support for investments in Haukeli tunnels and E134 Odda-Drammen motorway sections. Without the "Bergen arm" it may be a cheap quick-and-dirty solution. The "Haugesund/Stavanger arm" is already approved by the government, but the "Bergen arm" not.
The good news is that a delegation of business men and local politicians from all over western Norway went to Oslo to ask for the "Bergen arm" to E134.
https://hnytt.no/2016/05/24/forlange...en-utredes-na/
After the meeting, the people were optimistic about the "Bergen arm". The question is now: what option for the "Bergen arm" will be chosen? Likely, the government will select the option via Norheimsund, because it is the cheapest. The business men and politicians in the west want via Strandebarm, a faster road to Bergen-South and Os, but more expensive. But has the government the right to save money to facilitate the center of oil industry, the golden egg of Norway?



This topic is a thriller. Next year we will know the decision.
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