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Old July 23rd, 2016, 12:27 AM   #4061
ChrisZwolle
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People don't take wear and tear and depreciation into account when considering alternatives. They generally only look at the out-of-pocket cost; i.e. tolls, ferries and fuel. The cost of driving per kilometer is much lower than € 0.50 that way.
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Old July 23rd, 2016, 02:21 AM   #4062
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How is it looks like now at the Skjeggestad Bridge?
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Old July 23rd, 2016, 02:44 AM   #4063
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How is it looks like now at the Skjeggestad Bridge?
The bridge is opened. Looks exactly like before, as the new bridge was built after the old drawings. Not really that exciting unless you are a road enthusiast
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Old July 23rd, 2016, 03:13 AM   #4064
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About investing in infrastructure for decades ahead, why not ask young people in Norway who are not retired when oil resources are over within a few decades?
Present generation from agricultural background is used to think in local issues, not in the perspective of a global society where export connections are critical. A reliable highspeed road Stavanger/Bergen < E134 > Oslo/Svinesund is an essential instrument to facilitate such connections to prevent economic weakness for the younger generation.
I'm not saying we won't or shouldn't see an improved E134. That will eventually happen. I'm only saying that it won't be a motorway, and that spending that much money on one road link is counterproductive for the national economy. We need a national infrastructure that facilitates national growth, not show-off projects which might benefit a marginal percentage of the population. More or less your point, I take it..?

In addition, there is nothing anywhere that suggests that a Haukeli motorway will ever be built, and certainly nothing that suggests such a project will be priotitized. The E18/E39 Oslo-Kristiansand-Stavanger-Bergen link is a different story, and if that is ever completed, I'm sure Oslo-Trondheim will be next...
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Old July 23rd, 2016, 03:36 AM   #4065
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Quote:
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The bridge is opened. Looks exactly like before, as the new bridge was built after the old drawings. Not really that exciting unless you are a road enthusiast

Thats nice! They rebuilt it very quickly
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Old July 23rd, 2016, 11:39 AM   #4066
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I'm not saying we won't or shouldn't see an improved E134. That will eventually happen. I'm only saying that it won't be a motorway, and that spending that much money on one road link is counterproductive for the national economy.
Spending that money on the missing motorway link Bergen-Oslo has been investigated by a very respected authority for the Norwegian government. The result is a positive impact of NOK 5 billion that is productive for the national economy of Norway. It has been discussed in many newspapers:
http://www.ba.no/nyheter/ny-vei-kan-...s/1-41-7421676
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Old July 23rd, 2016, 12:32 PM   #4067
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It has also been discussed here about 15 times in the last month
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Old July 23rd, 2016, 01:13 PM   #4068
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The Hirtshals - Kristiansand ferry is quite expensive on popular weekends, for example a one-way ticket for tomorrow is € 265 for a car and 4 persons and the ferry ride is too short to avoid an overnight stay when coming from the Benelux.
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Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
People don't take wear and tear and depreciation into account when considering alternatives. They generally only look at the out-of-pocket cost; i.e. tolls, ferries and fuel. The cost of driving per kilometer is much lower than € 0.50 that way.
But if you book ahead, though, the prices are lower than 265. Even with four adults, the price is as low as 100 € only a few days ahead. Then the out-of-pocket costs by driving will be higher. Out of the high season, with fewer passengers, or if you book earlier, the ferry prices are significantly lower. For trucks, both routes will have different budgets, but I would expect a similar result. In addition, truck drivers can use the ferry ride to get their rest required by law.
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Last edited by 54°26′S 3°24′E; July 23rd, 2016 at 01:21 PM.
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Old July 23rd, 2016, 01:25 PM   #4069
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People don't take wear and tear and depreciation into account when considering alternatives. They generally only look at the out-of-pocket cost; i.e. tolls, ferries and fuel.
Source?
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Which new motorways are currently under construction?
Which new motorways will be opened next?

See 'New motorway projects' thread

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Old July 23rd, 2016, 01:56 PM   #4070
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Ferry Kristiansand = NOK 2489
Ferry Puttgarten + Helsingborg = NOK 1221

Fuel consumption car in Europe:
Average = 1:14

Petrol prices in Europe:
Average = NOK 14 (1,49 euro)

Last edited by coolstuff; July 23rd, 2016 at 05:23 PM.
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Old July 23rd, 2016, 08:56 PM   #4071
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Originally Posted by berlinwroclaw View Post
Spending that money on the missing motorway link Bergen-Oslo has been investigated by a very respected authority for the Norwegian government. The result is a positive impact of NOK 5 billion that is productive for the national economy of Norway. It has been discussed in many newspapers:
http://www.ba.no/nyheter/ny-vei-kan-...s/1-41-7421676
Should we put this guy and RV together to make a plan for the trunk road network of the Nordic countries for the next 25 years? That would be fascinating.
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Old July 23rd, 2016, 09:50 PM   #4072
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More hydrogen cars in Norway



Because all new vehicles sold in Norway in 2025, shall be zero-emission vehicles, they must be either electricity or hydrogen. One tank is good for 700 km, a superior range and loading over all electric cars. Today there are in Norway: Toyota Mirai (10), Honda Clarity (20) and Hyundai ix35 (16+) hydrogen cars. Soon there will be 10 Mercedes-Benz GLC cars in Norway and more companies will follow.
The environmental movement is investing heavily in hydrogen as one of the best alternatives for fossil transport and industry. The new hydrogen station in Lillestrom generates hydrogen made from food waste from Oslo urban. It is one of the 5 operational hydrogen stations in Norway, all around Oslo. Bergen, Stavanger, Trondheim, Hamar and Kristiansand will get such a station in 2017. In 2020 it is expected that there will be 10 000 hydrogen cars and there will come at least 20 more new hydrogen filling stations. https://unox.no/hydrogen.
Norway’s cheap electricity production is not only a blessing for electric cars, but opens also chances for hydrogen technology. A company in Notodden, NEL (Norwegian electrolysis), designs and supplies technology and production equipment to make hydrogen from electricity and water. Pure hydrogen can be a new Norwegian export product.
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Old July 23rd, 2016, 11:13 PM   #4073
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Fv. 55 Sognefjellet

I filmed the road across Sognefjellet last month. Very scenic.

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Old July 24th, 2016, 02:08 AM   #4074
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That is a lot of snow to have at just 1100m in June!
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Old July 24th, 2016, 10:01 AM   #4075
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Quote:
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More hydrogen cars in Norway



Because all new vehicles sold in Norway in 2025, shall be zero-emission vehicles, they must be either electricity or hydrogen.
This isn't correct, it was a proposal and nothing more. And the rest of the bs published saying 20-25% of Norways cars were already fully electric is also not true, it's around 50,000 vehicles at the moment and with the tax advantage being removed the average tesla will be a million nok vehicle fairly soon, the leaf will be 500,000, the fleet isn't going to get much bigger.
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Old July 24th, 2016, 10:46 AM   #4076
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This isn't correct, it was a proposal and nothing more.
Norway's Parliament met its target of 50 000 zero-emission vehicles on the road three years early, in April 2015, and there were 70 000 vehicles on the road by the end of 2015. Official goal is 100 000 electric cars by 2020. It is still not impossible that most new cars will be electric and hydrogen cars in 2025.
http://www.cnbc.com/2016/05/24/this-...heres-how.html
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Old July 24th, 2016, 03:27 PM   #4077
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Progress motorway E39 Bergen-Os

The new motorway E39 Bergen-Os (16 km) will have 4 tunnels. Speed limit will be 110 km/h. The new motorway will cost 6.5 billion. Completion is planned in 2022.



It is expected that Skogafjellstunnel will be finished at the end of 2016. According to schedule, Lyshorntunnel will be finished autumn 2018.

Fresh asphalt on section Svegatjørn-Rådal



Progress July 2016 - Lyshorntunnel: blasted tunnel 9.8%



Progress July 2016 -Skogafjellstunnel: blasted tunnel 20.4%




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Last edited by Mathias Olsen; July 24th, 2016 at 04:48 PM.
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Old July 25th, 2016, 12:24 AM   #4078
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Quote:
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That is a lot of snow to have at just 1100m in June!
The Sognefjellet road actually go above 1400 m, which corresponds to about 2 important degrees C compared with 1100 on average. The western side also receives a decent amount of precipitation. The area is actually quite popular for cross country skiing in June among professionals and enthusiasts. Later in the summer skiing takes place on glaciers only

Petter and Thomas Northug summer skiing at Sognefjellet.


BTW, both I and probably the E134 guys think that blasting a tunnel through Sognefjellet /Jotunheimen would be a cool project. The current shortest route Bergen - Trondheim (via Dovrefjell / Sognefjellet /Tindevegen/Sognefjorden) is a beautiful road, it is also slow, no-go for larger vehicles, and closed during winter. As it looks now, even a ferry free E39 won't be a very good alternative as the route is ****ed up by local politics.

This tunnel probably won't happen any time soon, though...
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpo...&postcount=823
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Last edited by 54°26′S 3°24′E; July 25th, 2016 at 01:20 AM.
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Old July 25th, 2016, 01:14 AM   #4079
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Some videos from me...



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Old July 25th, 2016, 09:41 AM   #4080
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Norway's Parliament met its target of 50 000 zero-emission vehicles on the road three years early, in April 2015, and there were 70 000 vehicles on the road by the end of 2015. Official goal is 100 000 electric cars by 2020. It is still not impossible that most new cars will be electric and hydrogen cars in 2025.
http://www.cnbc.com/2016/05/24/this-...heres-how.html
As soon as the incentives are removed the market in Norway for electric vehicle will tank. It's what Tesla is afraid of, nobody is going to pay 1 million plus NOK for a Model S and more for an X when they can have a decent German executive vehicle for 700,000. I would not pay 500,000 NOK for Leaf or i3 either, better cars can be had for less. The public should not have to subsidise electric vehicles, they use the same roads and should have to pay for them.

I believe electric vehicles are an automotive dead end, like the steam cars of early last century, they will be replaced by better technology. IMO hydrogen will eventually win out, simply because a 5 minute refill is much more palatable to the average motorist than the 60 minutes it takes to part charge a Tesla and significantly longer for other makes.

If you've ever seen the tesla supercharger stations at Dombas and Lilliehamar you'll understand why I think it's a sidetrack, it might take 60 minutes to part charge a Tesla but you could be waiting several hours to get to a charger.
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