daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Highways & Autobahns

Highways & Autobahns All about automobility



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old June 8th, 2011, 12:52 AM   #1421
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,572
Likes (Received): 19366

Nice reasoning

Usually road traffic projections are underestimates, i.e. the final traffic usage is higher than projected. However, traffic growth is not infinite, for instance I sometimes have my doubts at traffic projections in the Netherlands. They seem somewhat high, based on earlier growth we had in the 1990's, but that may not necessarily continue in the future at the same rate. Demographics change. Car usage and ownership is still increasing, but the population is also aging, i.e. the workforce declines (commuters).
ChrisZwolle no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old June 8th, 2011, 09:58 AM   #1422
54°26′S 3°24′E
Registered User
 
54°26′S 3°24′E's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 811
Likes (Received): 155

True, and 20 years is a long time. However, it should be noted that Norway still experience a solid population growth, among the highest in Europe, due to high immigration rates and fertility rate close to 2. The urban areas, like Trondheim and surrounding area, experience particular high growth.
__________________
Norway needs a new transport infrastructure network, let's start now!
54°26′S 3°24′E no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 9th, 2011, 10:17 AM   #1423
Ingenioren
Registered User
 
Ingenioren's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Oslo
Posts: 5,605
Likes (Received): 584

Vegvesenet is reconsidering the ban on wire-barriers. It's been 5 years since they were banned due to pressure from motorcyclists. Wires are cheaper than alternative rails-barrier, requires less space and safer even for motorcyclists according to Vegvesenet.

http://www.tu.no/bygg/article287492.ece
http://www.tu.no/bygg/article287737.ece
__________________
I want to see some construction!
Ingenioren no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 9th, 2011, 05:57 PM   #1424
Kjello0
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Trondheim
Posts: 394
Likes (Received): 70

So much for barriers...

http://www.nrk.no/nyheter/distrikt/n...elag/1.7667051
A wheel on the trailer punctured and the trailer went right through the barrier who is supposed to withstand cars hitting it in 150 km/h.
Kjello0 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 9th, 2011, 09:51 PM   #1425
IceCheese
Scandi-friendly
 
IceCheese's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Canada is my city
Posts: 7,226
Likes (Received): 919

Well, if you look at AADT for veicles that heavy, I don't think it's high enough to defend such a big barrier. Does motorway barriers stop trailers running wild?
__________________
Oslo/Copenhagen - The True Capital of Scandinavia.


Take a look at my Photo Mess!
IceCheese no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 9th, 2011, 11:03 PM   #1426
Kjello0
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Trondheim
Posts: 394
Likes (Received): 70

A motorway is twice as wide. And trailers tends to drive on the very right. Hence trailers hitting the barrier at all don't happen that often on motorways.
Kjello0 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 10th, 2011, 12:28 AM   #1427
54°26′S 3°24′E
Registered User
 
54°26′S 3°24′E's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 811
Likes (Received): 155

I guess what you guys mean is a "semi-trailer truck" or just "semi". This is an example of a trailer



Otherwise I fully agree with KjelloO. Wirefences (or fences like the one shown here) are probably cheaper by a factor 10 than concrete / Jersey barrier, but in Norway you in most cases must widen the road anyway, so relatively speaking, the savings won't be that large.
__________________
Norway needs a new transport infrastructure network, let's start now!
54°26′S 3°24′E no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 10th, 2011, 10:24 AM   #1428
Ingenioren
Registered User
 
Ingenioren's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Oslo
Posts: 5,605
Likes (Received): 584

Heavy rain causing troubles on highways:

Rv 7
Eidfjord - Brimnes, ved Eidfjord
Hordaland - Midlertidig stengt

Stengt på grunn av steinras. Ingen omkjøringsmuligheter. Blir ikke åpnet i dag.

Rv 3
Elverum - Tynset, (Rena - Koppang)
Hedmark - Midlertidig stengt

Stengt på grunn av flom.

Ev 16
Filefjell (Honnung bru)
Sogn og Fjordane - Midlertidig stengt

Stengt på grunn av steinras. Anbefalt omkjøring via Rv 52.

Ev 8
Slettnes
Troms - Redusert framkommelighet

Ett felt stengt på grunn av jordras.

http://www.vegvesen.no/Trafikkinform...afikkmeldinger

Rv3 have been worked on all night to keep from collapsing:

Foto: Turid Oddløkken, Arbeidets rett.

E16 partly eroded:

Foto: Øystein Tombre Larsen, Bergens Tidende
__________________
I want to see some construction!
Ingenioren no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 10th, 2011, 10:27 AM   #1429
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,572
Likes (Received): 19366

Quote:
Stengt på grunn av steinras. Ingen omkjøringsmuligheter. Blir ikke åpnet i dag.
Closed on grounds of rock slides. No turnaround possibilities. Won't open today

How's my Norwegian?
ChrisZwolle no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 10th, 2011, 10:35 AM   #1430
Ingenioren
Registered User
 
Ingenioren's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Oslo
Posts: 5,605
Likes (Received): 584

Spot on!
__________________
I want to see some construction!
Ingenioren no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 11th, 2011, 03:18 PM   #1431
54°26′S 3°24′E
Registered User
 
54°26′S 3°24′E's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 811
Likes (Received): 155

Yeah, the flooding has seriously affected the traffic in southern Norway. Currently, the two main roads between Trondheim and Oslo (E6 and Rv3), as well as the main roads between Oslo and Bergen (Rv 7 and E16) are closed. There are detours available, but they are not very good for trucks.

The problems have been particularly serious in Gudbrandsdalen (E6), with closures on several places:

On Rv 3, a bridge has collapsed, and this will take some time to repair:


In the mean time, the weather has been hot and splendid around Trondheim, so the largest traffic problem around here is as usual the Trondheimsfjord ferry....
http://www.adressa.no/tv/?id=16808&autoplay=0&ref=



__________________
Norway needs a new transport infrastructure network, let's start now!
54°26′S 3°24′E no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 11th, 2011, 05:58 PM   #1432
ElviS77
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 564
Likes (Received): 54

Quote:
Originally Posted by 54°26′S 3°24′E View Post


I feel sorry for those who needed to go to Byneset...
ElviS77 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 11th, 2011, 07:30 PM   #1433
-Pino-
Funkin' down the Track
 
-Pino-'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Amsterdam
Posts: 706
Likes (Received): 127

This ferry is not on a major through route, or am I missing something? So what creates the lengthy waiting periods? Just recreational traffic? With a waiting period like this, you may want to start considering the detour via Verdal...
__________________
http://www.brombeer.net/signs
-Pino- no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 11th, 2011, 10:53 PM   #1434
Ingenioren
Registered User
 
Ingenioren's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Oslo
Posts: 5,605
Likes (Received): 584

Norwegians love their "datcha" This happend to be a place Trondheimers go for the weekend... Clearly they need additional ferries for days like that... (While we wait for the super-awesome floating tunnel to be built.)
__________________
I want to see some construction!
Ingenioren no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 11th, 2011, 11:00 PM   #1435
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,572
Likes (Received): 19366

Ferries are pretty bad in handling peak loads, unless they have significant spare capacity or additional vessels on standby for peak days. It's not uncommon to have to wait 1, 2 or even 3 hours to get on the ferry on peak days.
ChrisZwolle no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 12th, 2011, 01:08 AM   #1436
ElviS77
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 564
Likes (Received): 54

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Ferries are pretty bad in handling peak loads, unless they have significant spare capacity or additional vessels on standby for peak days. It's not uncommon to have to wait 1, 2 or even 3 hours to get on the ferry on peak days.
Absolutely true, but the situation on the pictures above is somewhat special... The normal way of getting from Trondheim to Byneset is literally blocked. I haven't seen that before.
ElviS77 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 12th, 2011, 03:22 PM   #1437
IceCheese
Scandi-friendly
 
IceCheese's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Canada is my city
Posts: 7,226
Likes (Received): 919

May it be population growth, and Trondheim municipality's really bad way at coping with it? They seem to both plan for car-based suburbs, while at the same time restricting car traffic at strategic roads around town.
__________________
Oslo/Copenhagen - The True Capital of Scandinavia.


Take a look at my Photo Mess!
IceCheese no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 13th, 2011, 06:43 PM   #1438
Fargo Wolf
Resident Smartass.
 
Fargo Wolf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Port Kepler, Galilei Continent, Chakona
Posts: 685
Likes (Received): 17

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Ferries are pretty bad in handling peak loads, unless they have significant spare capacity or additional vessels on standby for peak days. It's not uncommon to have to wait 1, 2 or even 3 hours to get on the ferry on peak days.
The problem is twofold: First, in many cases, the ferries are too small for the routes they serve. Secondly schedules don't seem to be set up properly, such as running more often for heavier traffic periods ( morning/afternoon rush and holidays). Just my *is now broke*
__________________
Resident Rouge/Assasin who is a flag wolfess on the side and would love to live in the Netherlands.
Fargo Wolf no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 13th, 2011, 10:48 PM   #1439
54°26′S 3°24′E
Registered User
 
54°26′S 3°24′E's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 811
Likes (Received): 155


To (hopefully) clear things up a little:
Current capacity is nominally 316 car equivalents per hour. It was supposed to be a little bit higher (338), but the ferry operator had a minor accident last week so they had to substitute the smallest ferry with an even smaller one. In any case, the real capacity is lower than the nominal one because it simply would not pay off on such a short ride to spend a lot of time on optimizing the car packing factor. There is nothing to gain in optimizing the schedule, all ferries run continously in such peak hours.


Obviously the capacity is too small on big weekends like that see a lot of holiday traffic. Although the traffic increases towards summer and weekends, in particular the oval ones, it should be noted that a lot of traffic is commuter traffic. The north shore of the the fjord is relatively sparsely populated (25-30 000). However, a fairly large fraction of the workforce there are commuting to Trondheim, and some waiting time is always to be expected during rush hours. This winter, there was a change in ferry operator, and due to technical problems / delays in adapting the ferry jetty, there have been some huge delays on ordinary working days as well.

Of course, spare capacity costs, but I do not think people's time is evaluated high enough. The capacity is supposed to be upgraded somewhat in August, though.
Quote:
Originally Posted by -Pino- View Post
This ferry is not on a major through route, or am I missing something? So what creates the lengthy waiting periods? Just recreational traffic? With a waiting period like this, you may want to start considering the detour via Verdal...
I assume a lot of people used the two alternative routes to get to the northern shore:via Verdal /Inderøya (Skarnsundet bridge) far inland or the other ferry Brekstad - Valset at the mouth of the fjord.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ElviS77 View Post
Absolutely true, but the situation on the pictures above is somewhat special... The normal way of getting from Trondheim to Byneset is literally blocked. I haven't seen that before.
Note entirely blocked

It is of course also possible to reach Byneset using the southern road via Klett or Byåsen. The line on the road itself was significantly longer from the Fosen side last weekend, btw, 3.5 km was reported.
Quote:
Originally Posted by IceCheese View Post
May it be population growth, and Trondheim municipality's really bad way at coping with it? They seem to both plan for car-based suburbs, while at the same time restricting car traffic at strategic roads around town.
Neither Fosen nor Byneset are burbs of Trondheim, so in this (particular) case I would not blame the city. Trondheim has always been relatively strict when it comes to developments at Byneset.

Regarding the flooding, latest is now that Rv 3 opened, so people no longer have to drive Rendalen to get between Oslo and Trondheim. As Elvis77 pointed out, however, Rendalen, (eastern "detour" shown in the map below), is actually the shortest route, but not exactly built for heavy traffic:

Gudbrandsdalen / E6 continue to be closed, however. Here is an image from yesterday:
__________________
Norway needs a new transport infrastructure network, let's start now!

Last edited by 54°26′S 3°24′E; June 13th, 2011 at 10:59 PM.
54°26′S 3°24′E no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old June 23rd, 2011, 01:18 PM   #1440
Ingenioren
Registered User
 
Ingenioren's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Oslo
Posts: 5,605
Likes (Received): 584

Some animations of E134 Kongsberg Bypass, construction period 2013-2017:


The tollboth at Fv286, Teigen is quite controversial...




















aadt 2040.


2010.

http://laagendalsposten.no/bildegall...e134-1.6320825
__________________
I want to see some construction!
Ingenioren no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
norway

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 04:06 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium