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Old August 15th, 2011, 12:24 PM   #2281
alserrod
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I know that law... but as you can see, I found and posted one motorway opened just three years ago and with an "autovia" signal instead of Autopista...


This was why I wanted to increase information about differences that have had those type of roads.
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Old August 16th, 2011, 11:27 AM   #2282
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alserrod View Post
I know that law... but as you can see, I found and posted one motorway opened just three years ago and with an "autovia" signal instead of Autopista...


This was why I wanted to increase information about differences that have had those type of roads.

the difference is that an autovia may fit all the premises and an autopista must..
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Old August 16th, 2011, 12:08 PM   #2283
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The reconstruction of E90 motorway between Calatayud and Alfajarin will be ready in september. This is only an example of what they have done:


And here is the new where is the image: http://www.heraldo.es/noticias/arago...tayud_mes.html (In Spanish).

Works continue on parts of E05, E90 and A-31. They haven't begun yet on E901 and most of A-31 and E05.
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Old August 16th, 2011, 02:54 PM   #2284
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
A new section of A-334 in Andalucía (Almería province) opened today. Approximately 14 kilometers between Albox and Zurgena. The section west to Fines already opened in 2009.

http://www.canalsur.es/portal_rtva/w..._del_almanzora
If you look closely, you can see that autovias such as this are low quality. For example, here you can see that there is no alternative non-motorway route. Therefore this cannot truly be a motorway since it violates the principal that there must be a route for non-motorway traffic to take.
I know we have argued over and over about whether Autovias are real motorways, but clearly some of them are not. The mileage of motorways in Spain (14,600km) hides the fact that many of them are just good dual carriageways.
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Old August 16th, 2011, 07:12 PM   #2285
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What do you exactly mean with alternative non-motorway route? These paths next to the fences on both sides is what we call "caminos de servicio", they are used by tractors, mopeds, bicycles, etc.

Or do you mean a proper well-paved road?
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Old August 16th, 2011, 08:54 PM   #2286
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How many motorways/stretches u/c in Spain? In 2008 year Spain was in first position in Europe by u/c motorways but now Poland in first position.
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Old August 16th, 2011, 09:17 PM   #2287
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I guess the E20 in Denmark is not a motorway either at its 20 kilometer route across the Great Belt Bridge. No alternate route available... I've never heard this is a requirement to be considered a motorway. A motorway is usually defined as a road with at least 2 lanes in each direction, separated by a median or barrier, including a mostly continuous shoulder and be completely grade-separated and a ban on slow traffic. All Spanish Autovías are conform this standard, only a few older ones have a substandard alignment, yet this doesn't mean it's not a motorway.
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Old August 16th, 2011, 10:12 PM   #2288
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Not always. In Norway and Switzerland there are roads considered motorways, even though it has one lane in each direction.
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Old August 16th, 2011, 10:15 PM   #2289
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Road_UK View Post
Not always. In Norway and Switzerland there are roads considered motorways, even though it has one lane in each direction.
In Italian the Swiss ones are called "semi-autostrada", meaning "half-motorway".
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Old August 16th, 2011, 10:17 PM   #2290
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You mean like A8 and A13? As far as I know they are expressways, but do have the same road numbers.

image hosted on flickr

IMG_5669 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr
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Old August 16th, 2011, 10:24 PM   #2291
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Yes, I did mean the A13, and also the one at Schaffhausen, which is being upgraded now. Perhaps it's finished, I don't know, haven't been there for a while.

On a general road map, they are also displayed as motorways.
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Old August 16th, 2011, 10:38 PM   #2292
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Road_UK View Post
On a general road map, they are also displayed as motorways.
Mapmakers tend to have problems with motorway-like roads. Sometimes they're shown as motorways, sometimes as expressways or even regular roads. Most maps of Spain had trouble with Autovías, some were shown as motorways, others as regular dual carriageways, it seemed randomly. Austria also has many expressways which are just as good as motorways. I'm not really a fan of all these large expressway sub-networks. They should be motorways.
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Old August 16th, 2011, 10:45 PM   #2293
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Mapmakers tend to have problems with motorway-like roads. Sometimes they're shown as motorways, sometimes as expressways or even regular roads. Most maps of Spain had trouble with Autovías, some were shown as motorways, others as regular dual carriageways, it seemed randomly. Austria also has many expressways which are just as good as motorways. I'm not really a fan of all these large expressway sub-networks. They should be motorways.
And I quote you sir.
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Old August 16th, 2011, 10:49 PM   #2294
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Me too.
A1 for example between Burgos and Madrid is not displayed as a motorway. Technically it's an Autovia - or Dual Carriageway, but it has all the features of a motorway. And for such an important road, it should be a motorway!
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Old August 17th, 2011, 05:01 AM   #2295
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Quote:
Originally Posted by g.spinoza View Post
In Italian the Swiss ones are called "semi-autostrada", meaning "half-motorway".
It is an informing term. Better than the confusion about the "strada a scorrimento veloce" in Italy.

=================

I have a question:

When could we expect to have a7 completed all the way from Malaga to Almería?
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Old August 17th, 2011, 02:09 PM   #2296
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ilyan View Post
How many motorways/stretches u/c in Spain? In 2008 year Spain was in first position in Europe by u/c motorways but now Poland in first position.
That's a difficult question, considering that there are many "little governments" in Spain that build motorways on their own.

Anyway, I'd try with the regions I know the most:

-La Rioja:
  • Junction A-12/LO-20/N-232/AP-68 east of Logroño, including a bridge over the Ebro river.
  • A-12 Logroño-Burgos, from the village of Hormilla to the village of Grañón.

The works on the A-12 Logroño-Burgos were first stopped, then slowly resumed... so slowly that the grass has grown on the flattened soil (don't know the precise word in English) that was prepared to receive the asphalt. The only works I saw were the construction of some concrete (over/under)passes.


-Navarre:
  • A-21 to the Yesa reservoir.

-Basque Country:
  • The Supersur in Bilbao (new AP-8). Part of it is finished, but they are performing some tests before the opening.
  • The AP-8 is being widened to 2x3. From Bilbao to the toll barrier in Iurreta (near Durango) it is already 2x3. From Iurreta to Gerediaga (3,5 km) it's U/C. From the French border to the AP-1 in Maltzaga (near Éibar), it is also being widened. I think the stretch from San Sebastián to Orio is already finished.

-Cantabria:
  • S-30, new Santander bypass. Part of it is already opened.
  • A-8 Solares-Torrelavega
  • A-67 from Santander to Torrelavega is progressively being transformed into 2x3. Some stretches are already finished

-Burgos province:
  • BU-30, Burgos bypass, northern stretch
  • A-73 from BU-30 to the village of Quintanaortuño.
  • The whole A-1 is being updated to modern motorway standards.
  • A-11 from Aranda de Duero to the East

-Soria province:
  • A-15, the parts missing from Soria to the A-2
  • A-11
  • A-2, also being refurbished to modern standards




Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
I have a question:

When could we expect to have a7 completed all the way from Malaga to Almería?
Uhm... 2016?

According to the Spanish Wikipedia, the works on the stretch from Carchuna to Castell de Ferro were stopped and will be resumed in 2014, while the contract for the stretch from the A-44 to Puntalón was cancelled and they are looking for a new company to finish the works. Google maps shows both stretches as finished though

The situation could change -to worse or to better- after the next elections in November. But I've heard that, if there's no money enough, only the projects whose works have not started yet will be stopped. In that case, the works on these two stretches will be resumed sooner.
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Old August 17th, 2011, 02:12 PM   #2297
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
It is an informing term. Better than the confusion about the "strada a scorrimento veloce" in Italy.
Which, by the way, is by no means an official term, while "semi-autostrada" is.
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Old August 18th, 2011, 01:02 AM   #2298
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I extend information in red and later post someones more.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Cicerón View Post
That's a difficult question, considering that there are many "little governments" in Spain that build motorways on their own.

Anyway, I'd try with the regions I know the most:

-La Rioja:
  • Junction A-12/LO-20/N-232/AP-68 east of Logroño, including a bridge over the Ebro river.
  • A-12 Logroño-Burgos, from the village of Hormilla to the village of Grañón.

The works on the A-12 Logroño-Burgos were first stopped, then slowly resumed... so slowly that the grass has grown on the flattened soil (don't know the precise word in English) that was prepared to receive the asphalt. The only works I saw were the construction of some concrete (over/under)passes.


-Navarre:
  • A-21 to the Yesa reservoir.

A-21 Pamplona-Jaca. Until Yesa reservoir (built by Navarra government) will be finished this year. In the Aragonese part there are two or three parts on works today




-Basque Country:
  • The Supersur in Bilbao (new AP-8). Part of it is finished, but they are performing some tests before the opening.
  • The AP-8 is being widened to 2x3. From Bilbao to the toll barrier in Iurreta (near Durango) it is already 2x3. From Iurreta to Gerediaga (3,5 km) it's U/C. From the French border to the AP-1 in Maltzaga (near Éibar), it is also being widened. I think the stretch from San Sebastián to Orio is already finished.

-Cantabria:
  • S-30, new Santander bypass. Part of it is already opened.
  • A-8 Solares-Torrelavega
  • A-67 from Santander to Torrelavega is progressively being transformed into 2x3. Some stretches are already finished

-Burgos province:
  • BU-30, Burgos bypass, northern stretch
  • A-73 from BU-30 to the village of Quintanaortuño.
  • The whole A-1 is being updated to modern motorway standards.
  • A-11 from Aranda de Duero to the East

-Soria province:
  • A-15, the parts missing from Soria to the A-2
  • A-11
  • A-2, also being refurbished to modern standards

A-2 reburbished is not only at Soria province but in all the way between Madrid and Alfajarin. Part from Calatayud to Alfajarin will be finished next month.




Aragon:

A-21 Jaca to Yesa reservoir. Two or three parts started on works

A-23 Huesca to Jac: First 11 km are opened since year 2001. The rest is almost all of them on works. In March 2011 they opened the first km to traffic.

A-22 Lerida (Catalonia) - Huesca. In 2008 only a little part at Monzon was opened. Today it is opened 75% of them and at the begining of next year all motorway except the last part (Sietamo-Huesca) will be opened.


ARA-A-1 Only six kilometres motorway but a new bridge over the Ebro river where there were 45 km without bridges.

A-2. Total refurbishement.

Z-40 Finishing of Zaragoza orbital motorway

A-68. Some parts of refurbishement (I remember last one opened in august 2010).




Catalonia:

C-15 Manresa-Villafranca del Penedes. Part on works and part opened to traffic

A-7 (all Mediterranean motorway). South of Tarragona, some parts opened as free-motorway
Near Barcelona will have the name of B-40. A little part opened and part on works.

A-14 Lerida - Sopeira (Aragon). First parts on works

A-27 Tarragona - Montblanch. On works

(they are some other ones... maybe another forumer will extend this information)

And they are not motorways but:

- Bracon tunnel. 4,5 km
- New Vielha tunnel. 6,1 km (ok.... it is not after 2008, it was opened in December 2007 )


- Comunitat Valenciana

CV-10. Built full the part this administration will make. Rest is projected as A-7 by Spanish government

- Castilla La Mancha

- Part of Ciudad Real-Valdepeñas

- Some parts of A-3-Puertollano (some of them were opened yet, today is full finished until Puertollano and will be the shorter way from Lisboa to Valencia)
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Old August 18th, 2011, 12:01 PM   #2299
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About A-2 refurbishment, one newspaper had some pictures this week and I wrote about one of them (one of the most "interesting") in the Spanish forum.


I copy-paste here using google translator. It is a long explanation about how that ... highway?, motorway?, was built, mistakes done and how it is being updated.

It is long and I expect google translation will be not bad. Should anything be not clear either should a translation be wrong, just advice it to edit the message




A-2 (Madrid-Zaragoza-Barcelona-border with France) near La Muela









To give us an idea:

1987 (I think that stretch is opened in that year).
Carriageway to Zaragoza direction of new construction.
Carriageway to Madrid fully utilizes the N-II.

The N-II (later service road to dry although there have not been stopped or urinating in the gutter) had two consecutive curves that are seen in the photo (for orientation, Zaragoza right direction, upward direction Madrid) then a curve before the tunnel, which was limited to 80 km / h.

But I do not know when they put that limitation. What I do know is that people are "thrilled" to open the highway, there was no limitation other than 120 km / h and became a black spot in record time.
It was when they put the limitation and the problem they were opening new motorways in Spain (late 80's, early 90) and the people associated with "2 lanes = 120 km / h to stop milk).

Around 1993-94, with fully open highway, was renewed when the stretch. The section became old service road (I think since I've only been there during a crash and during the current refurbishment works).
The road towards Zaragoza (Very close the tunnel but outside) made it to Madrid
They built a new road with three lanes towards Zaragoza due to steep in there.

So far it was hard to find where the fudge and waste. Well, was as follows:

- The first new road was built with characteristics of "rise" (that area has a steep slope) and glued to the old road that was going down. I really would have cost very little but have done the road with the path that will bring now. We ... if they take one (sloppy on their part) could be, but they built new did not have to go so close, glued to the former but could go a little further apart. In this area the A-2 takes the side of a cliff and have the same difficulty of building the road built in 87 that they have done now.

- They took the road N-II, which is a traffic hazard incredibly foolhardy not to put a limit sign of 80. Do not get as sloppy Despeñaperros level but one or two levels below. Not much more to give you an idea.

- Discover the tinkering that have built (based on numbers of accidents) and decided to build a new road. To do decide to reverse the direction of the new and build another in the opposite direction but three lanes.
However, look in the photo why not have a little track curvature conditions. Just the distance from where the old road ends and connects with the straight where it does the new road.
Why?. Well ... to do so glued to the previous one. Was it really necessary that they be fully parallel?. As they had done things wrong, could not alienate both roads a little bit?.
Having done so 18 years ago, now we would save at least build a new road, alone should have been renewed the layout of the other.

- But now comes the fudge "covert" and actually create dangers. As I said, to fix the mess in the first driveway that used the tunnel on the N-II had to build another road reversing the direction of the first.
Well ... the road where the meaning was reversed was designed to be upstream in an area with slope. Cannot but I had made it with a stick because of the ice track that is generated in winter.

And it was this lack of cannot which was that although I had a radio able to go 120 km / h, was a downhill danger because you could go a little speed and the curve did not drink properly.

The new road (up), among which was a little (not much) cannot and above all that up so you do not notice the effect of the curve (with slope that is lifting the foot slows and you ipso facto), was used. .. but down, I really welcome ...

The road rise really could have gone for higher leveraging. I've made 120 not out there and always has been one of those stretches that I had on a dangerous cross. However, if the re-make the same could shit down again.
Possibility?. Or just a new road built but with two bridges (the directions would be reversed), or reformed road charging down the tunnel based on a wild and subsequent clearing bank ... or directly made two new roads which is what they have done.

The old N-II will continue as service road (as access to rural properties as you can see at the underpass).

The two roads built in the 80 and 90 ... with laughter, because this field can not be seized or for windmills (which are located a bit above)
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Old August 20th, 2011, 09:50 PM   #2300
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