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Old February 5th, 2013, 03:24 AM   #3521
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
I assume this happened because there is a perfectly adequate non-toll road going in the same direction or another more convenient motorway. Correct?
Unclogged as well.

During the boom years (2002-2007) many companies made unrealistic bids for Autopistas with a close parallel good autovía.

They predicted things like traffic increase on the 400% territory.

The upside is that, the way contracts were organized, there was an incentive to build fast. So even if they are bankrupt, there is still a (relatively) new, well maintained state-of-the-art highway that can be re-sold at a very low price or put under a shadow toll mode.
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Old February 5th, 2013, 10:24 AM   #3522
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That motorway depended greatly on huge real estate development projects in the region. None of them were realized. So there's no need for a motorway there, tolled or not, because there's no actual people or businesses there. The only road that goes parallel to AP-7 is N-332, which is not exactly a good road. It's narrow and winding. You can check it out in Street View. But it has no traffic because there is no traffic.

AP-7 Cartagena-Vera should be regarded as one of the biggest and most expensive infrastructure/urban planning mistakes in Spain.
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Old February 5th, 2013, 10:33 AM   #3523
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if only they had built untolled.... because paralel road is dangerous
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Old February 9th, 2013, 01:46 PM   #3524
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Hmmm..

http://www.fomento.gob.es/MFOM/LANG_.../130208-03.htm

The eastbound A-3 is closed at the Viaducto del Embalse de Contreras at the border of Castilla-La Mancha and Valenciana due to some kind of deterioration in its condition.

This is unsettling because the bridge is less than 11 years old, in fact it was the last part of A-3 to be completed in 2002.

Traffic is being detoured via N-III which runs across the dam.
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Old February 9th, 2013, 02:46 PM   #3525
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Westbound A-2 between Montmaneu and Santa Maria del Camí was closed a long time (As of mid 2010 it was reopened, though), and Eastbound traffic was detoured via the old N-II. And it's even newer (opened in 2005)!

But I think they made it too fast. In fact the current alignement is not what was originally planned. It was intended for what is now A-2 (Then N-II) from Cervera to follow the first few km of C-25, and then split off and head Southeast to rejoin N-II at Santa Maria del Camí. But this project generated a big controversy, and works were stopped. Finally they built the A-2, but on the current alignement following closely N-II.
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Old February 9th, 2013, 09:18 PM   #3526
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Hmmm..

http://www.fomento.gob.es/MFOM/LANG_.../130208-03.htm

The eastbound A-3 is closed at the Viaducto del Embalse de Contreras at the border of Castilla-La Mancha and Valenciana due to some kind of deterioration in its condition.

This is unsettling because the bridge is less than 11 years old, in fact it was the last part of A-3 to be completed in 2002.

Traffic is being detoured via N-III which runs across the dam.
It seems there is a crack on the deck arch due to corrosion according to this newspaper: http://www.levante-emv.com/comunitat...co/973067.html
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Old February 10th, 2013, 08:22 PM   #3527
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
The AP-7 Cartagena - Vera entered bankruptcy with a liability of € 550 million. The 115 kilometer toll road opened in 2007 but traffic volumes were way below expectations. The first 8 months of 2012 recorded a daily average volume of 3100 vehicles per day.

http://noticias.lainformacion.com/ec...UfuUNXqPVyob1/
Kind of interesting that AP-36 went bust a few months ago with a similar debt of around 500 million

Maybe we should make a list of motorways that went bust, it should be more than a handful by now

AP-41, AP-71, AP...

...and soon to go bust AP-46
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Old February 10th, 2013, 09:45 PM   #3528
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But AP-46 is recording volumes of up to 25 000 AADT! AP-41 is less than 1000, and A-40 near it has an AADT of less than 200.

The new by-pass of Malaga is 2x4 almost all its lenght, but AADT is less than 50 000 on its maximum...
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Old February 10th, 2013, 10:02 PM   #3529
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RV View Post
But AP-46 is recording volumes of up to 25 000 AADT! AP-41 is less than 1000, and A-40 near it has an AADT of less than 200.

The new by-pass of Malaga is 2x4 almost all its lenght, but AADT is less than 50 000 on its maximum...
where have you get those numbers, i'm very interested in the AP46 data

My own experience is that is not affordable to use it to go to Malaga (more time, more gas, more kms) but that it could be used to go to the coast (Fuengirola/Marbella....) because you save time.
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Old February 11th, 2013, 11:59 AM   #3530
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That is correct: AP-46 is not a good option to reach Malaga center.

You can see both options here: untolled route by A-45 (32,4km) and tolled route by AP-46 (39,8km).
http://goo.gl/maps/CBFpx

That difference could have been less if after taking A-7 eastbound, you could take MA-20 southbound to reach city center. But as you can see here, that movement between A-7 and MA-20 is not possible!
http://goo.gl/maps/Qx1Rx

Nevertheless, AP-46 is a very good option to continue westbound by A-7 to reach Costa del Sol. This new route saves 3km compared to A-45+MA-20 option (or 8km compared to A-45+A-7 option) and is much faster.
AP-46 + A-7: http://goo.gl/maps/Ffv4f
A-45 + MA-20: http://goo.gl/maps/4Itk0
A-45 + A-7: http://goo.gl/maps/Fd8k0
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Last edited by Carretero; February 11th, 2013 at 12:05 PM.
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Old February 12th, 2013, 07:25 AM   #3531
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What happens when a toll road concession goes bust in Spain? Does the region or the "Ministerio del Fomento" take over it automatically? Is there some special bankruptcy procedures defined?
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Old February 12th, 2013, 01:33 PM   #3532
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No news yet
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Old February 13th, 2013, 04:57 AM   #3533
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ajch View Post
where have you get those numbers, i'm very interested in the AP46 data

My own experience is that is not affordable to use it to go to Malaga (more time, more gas, more kms) but that it could be used to go to the coast (Fuengirola/Marbella....) because you save time.

http://www.fomento.gob.es/MFOM/LANG_...11/PROVINCIAL/
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Old February 13th, 2013, 11:38 AM   #3534
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Note there are only two months in 2011 that AP-46 was open to traffic. It opened 28 October 2011.

The 189 vehicles per day on the eastern part of A-40 west of AP-41 is quite remarkable. Maybe nobody takes that route yet because you cannot get on N-400 towards Aranjuez (east-west traffic avoids it). It only gives access to AP-41 towards Madrid, but coming from Toledo or points west makes very little sense to take that route. I assume most of that traffic originates from the town Olías del Rey, the only town served on that part of A-40.
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Old February 13th, 2013, 11:56 AM   #3535
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I agree with you and the A-40. When the gap between the AP-41 and R-4 gets filled (And that won't happen anytime soon...) traffic will increasy dramatically.

And another one that drives me crazy: The Z-40/E90 superhighway. Is now mostly 2+3+3+2, but with an AADT of 50-55,000 vehicles per day I think the previous 2x3 motorway was enough.
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Old February 13th, 2013, 12:01 PM   #3536
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N-400 carries 60 000 vehicles per day east of Toledo on that industrial area. It may be the busiest non-autovía in Spain.
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Old February 13th, 2013, 12:07 PM   #3537
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It really is a freeway mecca between Madrid and Toledo, despite the ultra low traffic volumes.

Here's a new autovía under construction from CM-41 to R-4 around Borox. Which number does this route have?
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Old February 13th, 2013, 12:14 PM   #3538
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CM-41, as the other motorway to A-5. But I believe works are stopped. The branch currently open is actually CM-43.
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Old February 13th, 2013, 12:31 PM   #3539
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Are there still plans to construct A-40 from Toledo to Ocaña? That seems like the only viable link in terms of traffic volume.
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Old February 13th, 2013, 12:52 PM   #3540
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If I believe correctly there are still plans to build it. AP-41 was supossed to continue South of Toledo to E05 somewhere near Montoro, and it was planned a (toll free) concurrency of A-40 and AP-41 for some distance. But then AP-41 got an negative enviromental report and was cancelled, leaving that useless motorway between Arroyomolinos and Mocejón. As a side result, they had to restart planning on that A-40 section. But soon or later, it will get built, it is part of the Madrid superbypass.
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