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Old March 5th, 2014, 02:57 PM   #4281
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Quote:
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How stupid. That viaduct was cool. Spain has also the green disease!
Bilbao was bypassed to the south ....first. Openstreetmap shows the up to date arrangement.

http://www.openstreetmap.org/#map=12/43.2705/-2.9756
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Old March 5th, 2014, 05:00 PM   #4282
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And what will be in this place in the future? A 1+1-laned street with trees? I just don't get greens. The viaduct was awesome.
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Old March 5th, 2014, 05:15 PM   #4283
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It was a major motorway through a city, it was decided to bypass the city with a new motorway and then reduce the considerable impact of the old motorway on the City...eg by demolishing flyovers in residential areas like that one. Not like Helsinki where the Greens want to demolish the existing motorway before there is a bypass of the city.

The project in question, the "Supersur", will end up costing €2bn by the time they finish it, whenever that is. Bilbao is a long thin urban strip between mountains and the sea so the full bypass will be around 40km long, mainly in tunnels or on viaducts and only the middle section of the bypass is finished so far with lots more to do at either end.
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Old March 6th, 2014, 04:58 PM   #4284
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A-3 and A-7 junction in Valencia has been totally refurbished and opened to traffic. It was part of the refurbishment project in the A-7 indeed


Press release

http://www.fomento.gob.es/MFOM/LANG_.../140306-01.htm
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Old March 6th, 2014, 05:14 PM   #4285
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Here's a Google Earth screenshot of the (nearly completed) interchange in October 2012.


Changes;

* A-7 widened to 2x3 through lanes
* flyovers to unweave traffic from a nearby exit to the industrial area

I don't understand what the little object in the northeast quadrant of the interchange is for. The loop will obviously be routed across it, but what does it cross? It's too large for drainage, but too small for an underpass. There wasn't one prior to this construction.
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Old March 6th, 2014, 05:20 PM   #4286
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I do not know it too. Maybe someone of that city could explain it
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Old March 7th, 2014, 10:25 AM   #4287
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Quote:
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It was a major motorway through a city, it was decided to bypass the city with a new motorway and then reduce the considerable impact of the old motorway on the City...eg by demolishing flyovers in residential areas like that one. Not like Helsinki where the Greens want to demolish the existing motorway before there is a bypass of the city.

The project in question, the "Supersur", will end up costing €2bn by the time they finish it, whenever that is. Bilbao is a long thin urban strip between mountains and the sea so the full bypass will be around 40km long, mainly in tunnels or on viaducts and only the middle section of the bypass is finished so far with lots more to do at either end.
Youre right about Helsinki, but why to demolish this when you have it already and pay 2 billions? Seems not smart to me. Spain is full of all kind of "Supersur's" of 5+5 lanes which by AADT could be given to the mules. They don't serve urban traffic.
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Old March 7th, 2014, 03:10 PM   #4288
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The Supersur doesn't work for two reasons; 1) tolls and 2) GPSs. It must be shorter and toll free. Currently only people who want to avoid a few congested hours on A-8 will use it, and people who enter it by accident.
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Old March 7th, 2014, 03:13 PM   #4289
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It's the problem of many new toll motorways which runs parallel to older freeways. They are only slightly usefull in peak hours on the freeway... and not always.

Exactly the same situation with the toll motorways in Madrid: longer and more expensive.
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Old March 8th, 2014, 12:27 AM   #4290
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So a total waste of money to construct a new "Hiperronda" in the middle of the hills and demolish a good viaduct to put a street that gets congested daily in it's place. Alicante new by-pass is a good example with 4000 users daily.
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Old March 8th, 2014, 12:29 AM   #4291
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
The Supersur doesn't work for two reasons; 1) tolls and 2) GPSs. It must be shorter and toll free. Currently only people who want to avoid a few congested hours on A-8 will use it, and people who enter it by accident.
In fact a much more important is 3) no direct link to AP 8 nor AP 68.
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Old March 8th, 2014, 12:32 AM   #4292
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In fact a much more important is 3) no direct link to AP 8 nor AP 68.
It's essentially this. When the next stage of Supersur is complete, all transit traffic will be able to use it. It's not the case now.
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Old March 8th, 2014, 12:39 AM   #4293
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In fact a much more important is 3) no direct link to AP 8 nor AP 68.
You can easily access the Supersur from both routes. Even if they would extend the Supersur farther east it makes very little difference in driving distance, as it will be a duplication of the existing traffic flow.
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Old March 8th, 2014, 12:41 AM   #4294
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So a total waste of money to construct a new "Hiperronda" in the middle of the hills and demolish a good viaduct to put a street that gets congested daily in it's place. Alicante new by-pass is a good example with 4000 users daily.

No, they are not related topics. On one hand you have the new Bilbao by-pass, the expensive new tolled motorway in the middle of the hills (called Hiperronda). On the other hand you have the refurbishment of the A-8 (first Bilbao southern by-pass), and as part of it, the modification of the access to San Mamés area. The demolished ramps have been replaced by a new junction further in the north supposedly less invasive into the urbanised area.

If you check out the are on Google Maps and you switch from satellite view to map view you can see the two different situations. In the satellite pics you can see the former situation with the Sabino Arana viaduct (and not the new northern access built). On the map view you can see the new northern access to San Mamés close to the Basurto Hospital.
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Old March 8th, 2014, 02:03 PM   #4295
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Due to some change in the law last year the validity of the EIS for A-22 Sietamo-Huesca has been extended, so now tenders can proceed. AFAIK there are funds allocated for this section on current year.
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Old March 8th, 2014, 04:21 PM   #4296
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Just look to it in a map. For a Barcelona-Bilbao is as fast via Zaragoza or Huesca. For a Barcelona-Pampelune/Vitoria/S.Sebastian shorter via Huesca
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Old March 8th, 2014, 07:47 PM   #4297
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I'm pretty sure this is the only sign in the country with both Madrid and Barcelona in it (And my hometown as a bonus). I don't get why they sign Barcelona there, it is closer turning around in the next exit and crossing the ARA-A1 bridge.
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Old March 8th, 2014, 07:51 PM   #4298
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I know this one, and this one.
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Old March 8th, 2014, 08:00 PM   #4299
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Damnit, I forgot about the sign at the Southern end of E07 (I have seen it several times!). Didn't knew the one in Valencia. But at least mine is a distance sign.
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Old March 9th, 2014, 07:47 PM   #4300
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
You can easily access the Supersur from both routes. Even if they would extend the Supersur farther east it makes very little difference in driving distance, as it will be a duplication of the existing traffic flow.
[]http://i.imgur.com/AyycqJO.jpg[/IMG]
Well the problem there is that main traffic is routed to A8 and if you are looking to take AP-8 you need to take one very closed curve.

Also:



When they complete Ib phase for the traffic Barcelona-Asturias the AP-8 will be better than A-8
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Si quieres compatibilidad con estandares y seguridad, ¿pq recomiendas Firefox y no Opera?
If you want compatibility with standards and security, ¿why do you recomend firefox and not Opera?

The only truly secure system is one that is powered off, cast in a block of concrete and sealed in a lead-lined room with armed guards - and even then I have my doubts. Gene Spafford.
I am Basque, not Russian, the "Siberia" thing is a joke.
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