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Old June 1st, 2009, 07:35 PM   #1301
ajch
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building of new Ap-46 (toll freeway) near total stop.

from local newspaper
http://www.diariosur.es/20090601/mal...-20090601.html

building companies without money and bank cutting the credit, from near 1000 workers one year ago to under 50 workers today.

And finish date, sure is that they are not going to finish for end 2009. So now the companies want the "state" to come to help them.

I only hope that we don't end paying for the building and after the freeway is finished, pay again for the right of use.
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Old June 13th, 2009, 02:27 AM   #1302
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Hello all!
I've been reading the forum for some months now and consider I'm now ready to post. I'm an 18-year-old spanish new driver and have taken so far some pictures of our motorway network here in Spain.

I hope you enjoy them!

A-3









AP-7





R-3



M-50









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Old June 13th, 2009, 12:04 PM   #1303
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Great pics!

I just returned from a short citytrip to Barcelona. I didn't really see many motorways, but I was able to make a few pics. I'll post them later.
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Old June 13th, 2009, 12:29 PM   #1304
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This is what I would call information overload. The signs look almost ridiculous with all the numbers and destinations in all kinds of font sizes - more like a joke than anything else.
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Old June 14th, 2009, 08:57 PM   #1305
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wyqtor View Post
This is what I would call information overload. The signs look almost ridiculous with all the numbers and destinations in all kinds of font sizes - more like a joke than anything else.
So, how would you inform people the way to take the 10 next highways (in Madrid there are lots of highways in a very small area) in places with dozens of highways it's the only way, in places with only one you only show one number (because there's no population or countries with no money).
About the font.. there's only one font, where have you seen more? the size changes because of the long names of the villages.
You don't live in Europe, do you?
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Old June 14th, 2009, 09:58 PM   #1306
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Well, I'd say wyqtor is right but just about the first picture. That picture was taken when the A-3 separates into A-3 and A-31, and the signs are quite confusing. What I understand with such a sign is: A-3 continue straight; A-31 turn right

The first picture of the M-50 has good signage. Take into account that Madrid has LOTS of motorways, and you have to sign them in some way. The logic behind the sign is quite simple:

In the first line you have the name of the motorway you are driving in: M-50
The second line shows the next exit to a motorway: A-5 which ends at Badajoz (E-90 is the european marking of the A-5)
The third and forth lines show the next exits to motorways in order, first it's R-5, then A-42 and so on.

It's quite logic
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Old June 14th, 2009, 11:09 PM   #1307
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Is that new road around north of Madrid, called R-1 ?
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Old June 14th, 2009, 11:12 PM   #1308
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There is a bit of overkill sometimes.

For instance, on the A-3, Valencia, Alicante, Albacete and Murcia are signed. For the sake of less-is-more, only Valencia and Alicante should be signed there.

Same for road numbers, why sign all radial roadnumbers in advance? This automatically leads to messy signs loaded with road numbers which are not relevant yet. I would stick to the first radial number, and if you reach that one, sign the next one, and not the next 5 radial roads.

Overkill - less is more.
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Old June 14th, 2009, 11:43 PM   #1309
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Those A-3 signals are terrible but I think that the M-50 ones are correct.

They tell you that you are driving in the correct way, it's only showing about 15 or 20 km in advance. Other motorways shows you the most important cities in your way, but M-50 is a circular motorway, so the signals tell you the most important roads in your way.
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Old June 15th, 2009, 12:24 AM   #1310
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The R-1 is in proyect, I don't think it's even under construction yet, but I'm not sure. Maybe you refer to the M-607 which is 30km long and leads to Colmenar Viejo. The M-607 cannot be called a motorway, it doesn't meet the requierements, sharp turns, short enter/exit lanes, it's a dual carriegeway i'd say (autovía).

I do certainly agree that Murcia and Albacete should appear on that sign, but not in that confusing way, I would arrange the sign this way:

[ [E-901][A-3] ] [ [A-31] ]
[ ] [ Albacete ]
[ Valencia ] [ Alicante ]
[ ] [ Murcia ]
[ ^ ^ ] [ ^ ^ ]
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Old June 15th, 2009, 12:31 AM   #1311
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The R-1 is in proyect, I don't think it's even under construction yet, but I'm not sure. Maybe you refer to the M-607 which is 30km long and leads to Colmenar Viejo. The M-607 cannot be called a motorway, it doesn't meet the requierements, sharp turns, short enter/exit lanes, it's a dual carriegeway i'd say (autovía).

I do certainly agree that Murcia and Albacete should appear on that sign, but not in that confusing way, I would arrange the sign this way:

[.....[E-901].[A-3].....]..[.......[A-31]......]
[.............................]..[.....Albacete.....]
[........Valencia..........]..[.....Alicante......]
[.............................]..[.......Murcia......]
[.......^.........^........]..[......^......^......]
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Old June 15th, 2009, 04:26 AM   #1312
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Yes I like it more than the oficial one, but you are signaling 4 lanes and there are only 3 ... :S
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Old June 15th, 2009, 05:05 PM   #1313
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Yes you're right, on that picture there are only 3 lanes, but 500m further a forth lane appears
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Old June 15th, 2009, 05:32 PM   #1314
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mateusz View Post
Is that new road around north of Madrid, called R-1 ?
Nope, the R-1 is not finished yet (in fact I think that the construction has not even started).



About the signage discussion: Yes, it sucks near big cities and junctions.

This is an example: As you can see, when there are only three lanes, the middle one can be used for any destination so the upper sign mixes both directions. 500 meters later you can see two separate signs:






And this is the proposal I made some years ago. It should say "Soria" instead of "Tarazona" though:



BTW, some pictures of the A-15/SO-20 near Soria. The oldest part of the SO-20 (Soria's ringroad) is a divided road and the newest one is an autovía. Notice the Sur 9 | Oeste 12 | Norte 14 sign.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Whitetower Soria View Post
Estado de las obras a 14 de junio de 2009


Tramo Soria - Los Rábanos (A-11). Denominado SO-20 "Circunvalación"

Las obras van a buen ritmo pero, como siempre, creo que van "pillados" de tiempo, más aún teniendo en cuenta que las previsiones meteorológicas dan lluvia para principios de semana.

Yo pienso que se cumplirá la promesa del Subdelegado del Gobierno de la apertura "antes de San Juan" pero muy pegada a ese día. Yo apuesto por el 22, 23 ó 24 de junio.

Ahora mismo, todo el lado sentido Soria tiene ya capa de rodadura (se ha echado esta semana). A lo largo de la próxima semana se echará en el lado sentido Madrid.

El fin de semana se ha estado pintando la señalización horizontal:





Además, se están terminando los detalles: colocación de hitos hectométricos, plantación de árboles en rotondas, conclusión del vallado y barreras de seguridad...

Lo que también se ha hecho es corregir la denominación "A-15" de los pórticos y banderolas sentido Madrid, poniendo encima una pegatina de vinilo con el texto "SO-20" (veáse el antes y después):



A continuación os pongo una señal curiosa en el acceso a "Soria Sur":



Se indican las salidas desde la "SO-20" hacia Soria: Sur (estación FFCC), Oeste (Avda. Valladolid) y Norte (Carretera de Logroño). De momento sólo está señalizada la 9. Supongo que el resto se señalizarán pronto para no confundir a los conductores que desconozcan la carretera.

De hecho, de momento, en la "SO-20" roja lo único que se ha hecho ha sido colocar una señal indicando la denominación de la vía (no sé como se llama técnicamente), en la "Variante de los Royales", circunvalación sur de Soria, a pesar de que los hitos kilométricos siguen indicando N-111 y N-122 en el resto de la circunvalación. Insistimos, esperamos que pronto se renombre todo como "SO-20" para evitar confusiones.

Dentro de Soria, en las antiguas travesías de la N-111 (llamada N-111a) y N-234 se han sustituido los pórticos y banderolas que ponían "N-111 Logroño resto direcciones" y "N-111 Medinaceli Madrid". Algunos databan de principios de los 80`s



Aún así, todavía quedan muuuuuuuchas señales que tardarán años en cambiarse y que tienen la denominación antigua N-111 ó N-234, pero poco a poco...
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Old June 15th, 2009, 07:53 PM   #1315
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These amounts of different roads are overkill

What, is there R1 to be planned, will it be like 25 roads coming from Madrid
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Old June 15th, 2009, 08:33 PM   #1316
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The R-1 is still in proyect as I've read from Wikipedia, it will be 25km long

And the radial freeway network from Madrid looks as follows, clockwise:

M-607___30km as autovía
A-1_____480km
R-2_____81km
A-2_____611km
R-3_____34km
A-3_____352km
A-4_____668km
R-4_____88km
A-42____78km
AP-41___72km
R-5_____28km
A-5_____408km
M-501___48km as autovía
M-503___20km as autovía
A-6_____595km

We have the 6 "A" autovías and 9 shorter autovías and autopistas. All together they are 3540km long (3114+426)

Last edited by jaimebeneyto; June 15th, 2009 at 08:52 PM.
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Old June 15th, 2009, 08:52 PM   #1317
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The number of highways is truly amazing.
How about Madrid rings M30, M40, M45 and M50, are they all autopistas and autovias?
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Old June 15th, 2009, 09:17 PM   #1318
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Madrid rings are toll-free autopistas (motorways).

From those 4 rings, the only true ring is the M-40. All others are not a complete ring, or not always up to motorway standards. The M-30 at Avenida de la Ilustración has traffic lights and speed limit is 50 km/h

M-30: 30km as motorway, speed limit is 90km/h on surface and 70km/h in tunnels. As a fact I'll say that the huge bypasses and tunnels of the M-30 are being paid through speeding tickets. A lot of controversy arose when the tunnels were limited to 70km/h, being completely new, state-of-the-art tunnels. There are 16 speed control points. The M-30 is also famous for being the only town hall-owned motorway in Spain.
The eastern side of the M-30 is the spanish most used road. It has 4 carriageways and up to 12 lanes.

M-40: 63km long, completely circular. General speed limit is 100km/h on surface and 80km/h inside tunnels

M-45: 45km, 1/4 of a circle. It fills the gap between M-40 and M-50 in the southeast of Madrid. It is also considered as the best road in Madrid regarding traffic flow and security. Speed limit is 120km/h on surface and 100km/h in tunnels.

M-50: 85km, almost a full circle. The gap missing between A-6 and A-1 will consist of a series of tolled tunnels. Speed limits are the same as in M-45
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Old June 15th, 2009, 09:48 PM   #1319
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Is the missing gap of the M-50 really necessary?
Taking the M-40 isn't a big detour (max 15km) and it woulnd't serve many additional cities. Additionally it will be very expensive with all the tunnels.
Or is it built more to relieve the M-40?
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Old June 16th, 2009, 12:25 PM   #1320
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Yup, it's more to relieve the M40. I read there was a saturation over 75% on that stretch and in the last year that part of the city has grown a lot with new developments.
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