Castlefield

[CDX]

From ManCon:

Castlefield: the Big Town Hall Meeting
http://www.manchesterconfidential.co...n_Hall_Meeting

After 18 months the campaign to prevent Castlefield from being an embarrassment goes to the top table

Confidential got a letter last week from Sir Howard Bernstein, chief executive of Manchester city council. There’s to be a meeting of all ‘individuals and organisations with an interest in Castlefield’ to ‘discuss and agree various environmental improvements that are needed both in the short and long term and discuss ways in which added vibrancy can be brought to the area’. Crucially this ‘will include landowners, developers, residents, key public sector bodies’.

Confidential reckons this will be the key (after all the other meetings in the last 18 months) as to whether we, as a city, really have a will to turn the area around.

With the property people present, the question is can those people who love this tired treasure trove of Manchester’s heritage really make a case for saving it from sliding further into decrepitude. As Confidential has been arguing for two years, we need to make this area work and we can’t rely on stretched council services to always underwrite the process.

With the big boys invited by the big man on gold-embossed notepaper, maybe they can be persuaded to do the right thing and make sure the areas they control are at least well maintained, if not as beautiful as possible.

The meeting takes place at the Town Hall on Tuesday 21 April at 7pm. All those with an interest or who want to attend, email Manchester Confidential at:

jonathans@planetconfidential.co.uk

[heatonparkincakes]

Its will be curious to see who will attend.

Skyscrapercitizens in the centre left, Peel on the far right and Confidential dudes either late on arrival or in the mismass centre

[spoonsbeatfish]

On the issue of improvement of Castlefield, does anyone have any ideas about how Castlefield could be improved and maybe move closer to being awarded the title of a a world heritage site?

The paint job that was done one of the bridges was done well and could be expanded to the others as could other minor paint/fox up jobs. The extention of Deansgate Locks into Castfield with Pioneer/Castlefield Quay being finally redeveloped would definitely improve the area. Maybe something could be done to the Roman fort (no idea what though - maybe linked to a new section in the MOSI showing how industrial and pioneering the culture was, as MOSI are planning to expand). Somehow improving the appeal of Castlefield Arena so it is used more frequently could be a priority?

Any comments on any of those ideas/ further ideas?

[GShutty]

Couldn't they open a Tesco Metro in that derelict pub, or better still a huge one were they used to pile coal? That would be popular. Probably have to knock one of the old warehouses down for car parking, but needs must.

[CDX]

Originally Posted by GShutty

Couldn't they open a Tesco Metro in that derelict pub, or better still a huge one were they used to pile coal? That would be popular. Probably have to knock one of the old warehouses down for car parking, but needs must.

Don't get me angry

[CDX]

The World Heritage Site proposal actually covers parts of Worsley & Ancoats together with Castlefield, anyone wanting to read the tentative listing:
http://whc.unesco.org/en/tentativelists/1316/

I know little about the nomination process however, how often new sites get a full listing etc.

The main short term solutions are giving the area a general tidy/update, repainting here & there, giving Merchants bridge & the arena a clean.

image hosted on flickr


The signage needs a complete overhaul, its a complete disgrace at the moment, faded & out of date, there is no clear visitor trail.



image hosted on flickr


image hosted on flickr


The footpaths also need sorting out, a couple of the footbridges need resurfacing.

With the perceived lack of green space in the city centre, Castlefield really is overlooked as a resource at the moment.

image hosted on flickr

(try & find these trees, they seem to have disappeared!)

It needs a few more of these about the place to brighten it up, rather than just grass.

image hosted on flickr


The under use of the arena space is ridiculous, those apartments surrounding it have unfortunately put an end to too many nocturnal events, complaints & all that

image hosted on flickr


Look at it in a yesteryear, with the bank holiday market...



...and when Jacksons Wharf had some life to it.



We will certainly see some improvements this year, with the Congregational Chapel refurb & Amaze moving in. Look at it years back:

image hosted on flickr


It will improve the look & feel of that side of Castlefield no end.

I also hope Barca is indeed re-opening in the not too distant future. Now if only the first three floors of Merchants Warehouse could be let, it seems to have been vacant for an eternity.

image hosted on flickr


The pp on the 2-4 Chester Road site has now expired, so I guess we won't be seeing this:



What we will hopefully be seeing on that plot in the not too distant future is some sort of temporary garden, until Inacity sort their hotel project out...



In the longer term Pioneer/Castlefield Quay should be redeveloped, to integrate the area a little better. I can see the arches being developed, hopefully going in another direction than just being an extension of the Locks bars, hopefully a few creative enterprises, the rest of the ASK proposal I would guess is highly unlikely.



If/when they get funding, the MOSI Revolution project will be great for the area.


http://www.mosi.org.uk/about-us/news/revolution-mosi

Get the Castlefield centre back into use in some context, I don't know, rent it out for events, use it as a community centre, just start using it again, what a waste...

[GShutty]

Graet post. You've summed it up to a tee. All this and the increased permiability that the likes of Castlefield Quay would bring and we would have a Castlefield with life in it once again. Greater co-operation between the concerned parties can only help this.

[Comdot]

Originally Posted by CDX

How dirty has Merchant's bridge got

From Flickr:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/gobayode

Hopefully Peel has budgeted some money to get it cleaned sometime soon...

From Flickr:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/gobayode

the bridge does need a clean, and a regular cleaning schedule at that!

i don't like this bridge, i have to say. i lived nearby and the bridge is not very user-friendly. it bends away from a route which many people would like to take. a large detour becomes necessary to get on it. for those on foot a step bridge would be preferable and infact i'd prefer to carry my bike over one. i would put this bridge down as one of the reasons i moved out of the area and one of the reasons i didn't go to the pubs down there when i lived there.

and as a cycle bridge it doesn't work anyway because there's too many pedestrians on it at any one time for cycling to be safe.

novelties wear off.

castlefield looking forward- accept the mistakes made and stop making them.

[spoonsbeatfish]

Originally Posted by CDX

The World Heritage Site proposal actually covers parts of Worsley & Ancoats together with Castlefield, anyone wanting to read the tentative listing:
http://whc.unesco.org/en/tentativelists/1316/

I know little about the nomination process however, how often new sites get a full listing etc.

I had a quick look into the Nomination process and found this interesting pdf: http://www.culture.gov.uk/images/pub...engversion.pdf

In short, (partly) due to the imbalance of listings across the world the UK has a policy of nominating (or renominating) only 1 listing per year. Manchester is not to be nominated for 2009, 2010 or 2011. pg 10

The document also mentions that the tentative list may be revised (as the UK Unesco decade long policy has now concluded) which could but not necessarily include the Manchester site.
There is also consideration to stop nominating sites due to their high costs of nomination and lower enthusiasm from individual sites. This stems from control of planning lost to international authorities and general increased annual costs e.g extra management versus the relatively small effect on tourism and heritage preservation. A national list may be started up but seemed unlikely and we may join up to a new EU list.

Originally Posted by CDX

The main short term solutions are giving the area a general tidy/update, repainting here & there, giving Merchants bridge & the arena a clean.

The signage needs a complete overhaul, its a complete disgrace at the moment, faded & out of date, there is no clear visitor trail.

The footpaths also need sorting out, a couple of the footbridges need resurfacing.


With the perceived lack of green space in the city centre, Castlefield really is overlooked as a resource at the moment.

image hosted on flickr

(try & find these trees, they seem to have disappeared!)

It needs a few more of these about the place to brighten it up, rather than just grass.

Yes, yes and yes! The area needs a general clean, tidy up and maintenance. the small things add up and make a difference. A lot of this work could be done by volunteers with the resources paid for with some of the money in that heritage fund listed below. This shouldn't cost too much.

Originally Posted by CDX

The under use of the arena space is ridiculous, those apartments surrounding it have unfortunately put an end to too many nocturnal events, complaints & all that

Grrrr, if people move into an area with something like an arena on their doorstep they shouldn't be able to then turn around and complain about it being used!!!

Originally Posted by CDX

Look at it in a yesteryear, with the bank holiday market...

What happened to it? Just lack of popularity, objections to Liverpool Road being closed down?

Originally Posted by CDX

...and when Jacksons Wharf had some life to it.



We will certainly see some improvements this year, with the Congregational Chapel refurb & Amaze moving in. Look at it years back:

image hosted on flickr


It will improve the look & feel of that side of Castlefield no end.

I suppose better use could be made of the Jackson Wharf site, but looking at that photo, it seems a real shame its not still open and instead probably going to remain derelict for the next couple of years. As for the Chapel Refurb, is it getting a retail/cafe unit in the bottom, or is it just offices? If they do have a pub/cafe, it would be good to put an entrance into it both from the bottom and the Bridgewater Viaduct thereby providing another entrance to the area.

Originally Posted by CDX

The pp on the 2-4 Chester Road site has now expired, so I guess we won't be seeing this:



What we will hopefully be seeing on that plot in the not too distant future is some sort of temporary garden, until Inacity sort their hotel project out...

Seems a bit of a random addition to Castlefield but I guess we will never see it now. The garden idea sounds great, I doubt they would fund it though. Anyone remember what was there before out of curiosity (looks a bit weird on google earth)?

Originally Posted by CDX

In the longer term Pioneer/Castlefield Quay should be redeveloped, to integrate the area a little better. I can see the arches being developed, hopefully going in another direction than just being an extension of the Locks bars, hopefully a few creative enterprises, the rest of the ASK proposal I would guess is highly unlikely.

I didn't mean to suggest that the loud, club type bars get extended into Pioneer Quay, merely that arches were opened up in the same way. Currently you can walk straight past Castlefield without even realising what is there. If the arches were redone apart from adding their own offer, they also encourage you to walk down Castle Street and could offer a walkway directly into the car park just north of dukes. As for the units themselves, I think the idea was to include some local facilities e.g. doctors, cornershop etc. Unlike the Deansgate locks which only have a small boardwalk, the Castlefield locks also open up a nice bit of space for public realm.

Originally Posted by CDX

If/when they get funding, the MOSI Revolution project will be great for the area.

I think with Steve Davies ambition, it will be more a case of when not if.... hopefully anyway.

Originally Posted by CDX

Get the Castlefield centre back into use in some context, I don't know, rent it out for events, use it as a community centre, just start using it again, what a waste...

Totally agree! What facilities does it actually have? Why did it close down originally?


Oh and one idea that could potentially be implemented in the longer term (once current units are filled) is the use of canal boats as shops or bars spilling over into the patio/grassy areas. Manages to re-use a few empty canal boats and provide opportunities for enterprises where there aren't that many places for them.

[spoonsbeatfish]

Wasn't Manchester Confidential supposed to have already posted an article about the Town Hall meeting?

[Castlefield]

Yes they promised it for last Friday. I've asked where it is but not had a response yet!

[Castlefield]

Apparently there will be an update on www.manchesterconfidential.com tomorrow.

[CDX]

Originally Posted by spoonsbeatfish

I had a quick look into the Nomination process and found this interesting pdf: http://www.culture.gov.uk/images/pub...engversion.pdf

Very interesting indeed, will have to have a proper read of that.

2.17 While some of these sites are actively developing their bids, not all of the sites on the Tentative List still wish to proceed to nomination.

Would be interesting to know the current position of the nomination & whether the bid is 'actively being developed'. I guess as always it is a bit of cost/benefit analysis, cost of getting the full heritage site listing vs increased tourism/promotion etc, would the money be better off just spent on the area?

A lot of this work could be done by volunteers with the resources paid for with some of the money in that heritage fund listed below.

There are plenty of people in the area who want to get involved, its just a matter of channelling the energy into some projects. What work the trustees are involved in & how they are supporting maintenance work in the area I would like to know...

Grrrr, if people move into an area with something like an arena on their doorstep they shouldn't be able to then turn around and complain about it being used!!!

Indeed slightly ridiculous, people are well aware of the arena when they decide to move there, so why they feel the need to complain when it is used for what it was intended???

Maybe with a rise in political protest the arena will find a few new 'events'?

image hosted on flickr

http://www.flickr.com/photos/binaryape/2873657882/

There's one on Monday, bank holiday [political] fun for all the family:
http://www.rapar.org.uk/images/festival.jpg

I suppose better use could be made of the Jackson Wharf site, but looking at that photo, it seems a real shame its not still open and instead probably going to remain derelict for the next couple of years.

Jacksons Wharf really will be the one building that holds the area back for the foreseeable future...I wonder how Peel would react to suggestions of alternative uses for the building

I suggest we wrap it up like this:

Christo and Jeanne-Claude - Wrapped Reichstag, Berlin 1971-95

Try and make it less of an eyesore

As for the Chapel Refurb, is it getting a retail/cafe unit in the bottom, or is it just offices?

Amaze are taking over the entire chapel, so it will be interesting to see how the outside space around it is used. A terrace for the employees...not the best, but great to get the Chapel back into use again.

Seems a bit of a random addition to Castlefield but I guess we will never see it now. The garden idea sounds great, I doubt they would fund it though. Anyone remember what was there before out of curiosity (looks a bit weird on google earth)?

Sterling prize nominated Quay Bar(Rest in pieces) was on part of the site before:

http://www.cabe.org.uk/case-studies/quay-bar

I think also just into shot there is the victorian building that that 'burnt down' in 2001...

The garden idea wouldn't cost a lot at all, I think the plans are for more of a wild flower meadow, the seeds don't cost much & it would just be a case of scattering them & hoping for the best I think!

What facilities does it actually have? Why did it close down originally?

No idea as to the official reason behind it closing, I can only guess at funding being withdrawn by MCC, lower visitor numbers to justify it or possibly the heritage fund being depleted a little too much by the running costs? The closure is probably all linked in with the general decline of the area, less events taking place etc.

The space inside isn't massive but it must be able to be used for something productive until it is re-opened as a visitors centre, when the area is properly marketed again.

Oh and one idea that could potentially be implemented in the longer term (once current units are filled) is the use of canal boats as shops or bars spilling over into the patio/grassy areas. Manages to re-use a few empty canal boats and provide opportunities for enterprises where there aren't that many places for them.

I wonder how much extra room there is in the Canal basin for more permanent static ventures on boats alongside the touring boats that come & go? Its a good idea considering the limited number of available commercial premises in the Canal Basin.


Here's a little bit of Pioneer Quay trivia:

Pioneer Quay was named by Marie Ashworth from Bury to commemorate the Rochdale Pioneers who founded the Co-operative movement. She chose the name to win the 'Quay with No Name' competition on the Phil Sayer programme BBC Radio Manchester. April 21st 1987.

Never knew that...


p.s. Anyone have any more info on the Lammars/Barca venture???

[CDX]

Originally Posted by Castlefield

Apparently there will be an update on www.manchesterconfidential.com tomorrow.

Hopefully not just a bit of comment in the Sleuth column...the article is probably being passed round all the contributors for approval, maybe still agreeing the action points from the meeting? Making sure things are not promised that are not going to be delivered by MCC et al.

[man med]

image hosted on flickr

[Chogmook]

That's near Piccadilly MM!

[man med]

oops sorry ha ha - nat de roit tred

[spoonsbeatfish]

Originally Posted by Castlefield

Yes they promised it for last Friday. I've asked where it is but not had a response yet!

A little delayed but...

(can someone please tell me how to quote other websites?)

http://www.propertyconfidential.com/...frombounce=yes

Castlefield in motion
Jonathan Schofield reports on the latest Castlefield meeting and maybe the end of the beginning in terms of gaining widespread recognition for change


The tortoise beats the hare principle is being applied to one of the most precious urban areas in Europe. And we’re getting there.

A couple of weeks ago a meeting was held in the Town Hall chaired by yours truly and councillor Pat Karney (who wouldn’t let go of his microphone). It resulted in commitments from decision makers to form a board and timetable an agenda for change in Castlefield.

This followed a series of meetings which were the result of Phil Griffin’s Manchester Confidential article lamenting the condition of Castlefield 18 months ago. A great deal of thanks goes to Cityco, the city centre management company, Pat Karney, and the residents for organising these meetings and being innovative and supportive of change. Confidential has been at every one of these gatherings, with this writer voted to head up the residents’ and citizens’ side of the issue.



Confidential set the scene pointing out that to treat Castlefield the same as any other city centre district, not only in Manchester but in the UK and Europe, was wrong-headed. This is a place where a huge history and powerful urban landscape come together. In the true sense of the word, Castlefield is unique and should be treated as such.

At the late April meeting we had the big hitters from the public sector such as city chief executive, Sir Howard Bernstein, the deputy chief executive, Vicky Rosin, boss of Cityco, Gordon Reid, Gary Ellis from Cityco, the aforementioned Pat Karney, and various other city officers in control of various aspects of cleaning, environment and maintenance.

From the private sector we had several of the main landowners including Ed Burrows, the Peel Holdings development officer, Wayne Mellor, boss of Inacity, and Sharon Barnes and James Ramsbottom from Castlefield Estates. It was a shame that one of the other major landowners in the area, Ask, didn’t choose to attend. Nor were there any representatives from the rail authorities, which own key structures in Castlefield.

From the cultural side of thingswe had Steve Davies, the director the Museum of Science and Industry (MOSI), and Steve Smith and John Drape from Ear to the Ground, the event company which formerly ran D-Percussion in Castlefield. Representing tourism was Andrew Stokes of Marketing Manchester.

Everybody had a say, including several of the residents, the police officers in charge of the area, and people who run local businesses such as Jon Grieves from Choice restaurant in the Castlefield basin.

Confidential set the scene, pointing out that to treat Castlefield the same as any other city centre district, not only in Manchester but in the UK and Europe, was wrong-headed. This is a place where a huge history and powerful urban landscape come together. In the true sense of the word, Castlefield is unique and should be treated as such. Thus simple husbandry down here, the maintenance of a crumbling infrastructure and the mowing of grassed areas is not enough. We have to take things further.

We pointed out that brown tourist signs on the approach to Liverpool flag up Albert Dock. Those around Manchester highlight Castlefield, which in its present state is a city embarrassment – MOSI and businesses such as Dukes 92 and Choice excepted.
Our presentation included the pictures here, a vision of the public areas of Castlefield modelled into a series of garden rooms: knot gardens, rose gardens, herb gardens, herbaceous borders.

These include a playground for the city centre. This would provide a child friendly resource in a frequently un-child friendly city centre. This would also be ground-breaking in terms of UK cities, add tourist interest in the city centre and potentially benefit the economy by prolonging family visits to the city.



After initial costs which might come from public/private partnerships, maintenance of such areas might partially come from Castlefield residents looking after parts of the gardens as people in other areas look after allotments.

Manchester’s schools could also adopt parts of the garden rooms and maintain them, thus learning gardening skills, gaining ownership of a part of the city centre, knitting suburbs and city together and building identity and pride in Manchester. Restaurateurs and chefs could use the herb garden to provide ingredients for their kitchens which would benefit the businesses and create a marketing and press opportunity in itself.

Strategically, making Castlefield a beautiful city park would boost the canal link and canalside walk from Piccadilly Basin, via the Village, through Castlefield and then Pomona, to Salford Quays and Media City.

In the subsequent discussion there was agreement that Cityco and the City Council had made progress in the basic maintenance of Castlefield in the last 12 months. The policing situation had also improved.

Ed Burrows from Peel Holdings was challenged over several issues, not least Peel’s lack of maintenance of Merchant's Bridge. This is dirty and unlit and encapsulates how the area has become sidelined. There was annoyance from residents that Mr Burrows could only propose a time frame of two years to rectify this sorry mess of what should be a high quality feature. An unanswered question was: given the amount of money and sheer dynamism Peel are pouring into Mediacity, how come they can’t manage a footbridge clean-up and repair in a key area of the city centre in less than two years?

There was much discussion about the type of events needed to populate the shamefully underused Castlefield Arena and ancillary areas. Family events such as those previously brought in by Manchester International Arts (e.g. Streets Ahead) were favoured along with second-hand book fairs. Many residents didn’t want ‘alcohol driven events’ although this was by no means unanimous.

There was recognition that Castlefield as an area, and any changes that take place within it, occur in rare circumstances. Here residents’ interests and business interests are as important as in any other city district, except here those occupy a landscape of local, national and international significance.

In the short-term, applications are being made to provide a wild-flower garden at the old Quay Bar site and for new signage to help create a sense of place in Castlefield.

But it was Sir Howard’s determination to drive the process forward, to form a board with other committees looking at things such as tourism, that was the key result of this latest meeting. That board will meet for the first time on 26 May, with a smaller number but a similar spread of residential and public and private sector representatives. A timetable for change and a discussion of what may and may not be possible will come from that.

We’ll let you know what happens because Confidential is right behind this. After all, we started the process because we want our city to be better.

We think that the city centre will improve exponentially if Castlefield's full potential is realised. It would give us a true tourism asset whilst underlining the desirability of the district as a place to live. It would give us that much sought-after green lung in the city centre – not in a typical manner, but in a distinctly Manchester way where tough architecture and engineering come together with imagination and a pioneering spirit.

Original. Modern.

It might also give us beauty, and in the hard world of property development in Manchester, in a city of robust urban landscapes, that word is not heard nearly enough.

[CDX]

Ed Burrows from Peel Holdings was challenged over several issues, not least Peel’s lack of maintenance of Merchant's Bridge. This is dirty and unlit and encapsulates how the area has become sidelined. There was annoyance from residents that Mr Burrows could only propose a time frame of two years to rectify this sorry mess of what should be a high quality feature.

But it was Sir Howard’s determination to drive the process forward, to form a board with other committees looking at things such as tourism, that was the key result of this latest meeting. That board will meet for the first time on 26 May, with a smaller number but a similar spread of residential and public and private sector representatives. A timetable for change and a discussion of what may and may not be possible will come from that.

I suppose this is the main thing that came out of it. Let's see what happens...

[CDX]

Scaffolding coming down on the Knott Mill Chapel today, looking good with new windows in...

Also the old Loves Saves The Day by Deansgate Station seems to be being refitted...anyone any ideas whether something is opening there?


EDIT: LSTD lives on in Google street view

http://www.google.com/maps