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Old April 8th, 2009, 01:12 PM   #2021
H123Laci
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wdw35 View Post
And, yeah, H123Laci, wth? What's up with you?
You don't seem to like any proposed or ongoing motorway project in .hu at the moment! Should all the money go to education and health? Or beggar's protection maybe, :P?
maybe you should read my posts more carefully...

whats your country? or is it a secret?

I didnt tell the road budget is too high...

I just told: we shouldnt build motorways for low traffic volumes while we are in lack of bypass roads and while our main road network is a crap.

with the money we waste to ghost motorways we could solve many traffic problems...

just a little example:
we are building the 5-10km long bypass roads in 2-3 stages in a 5-10 years interval (cause NO money), and we are building the M6 motorway in ONE 150km long stage...

thats ridiculous...
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Old April 8th, 2009, 03:14 PM   #2022
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Exactly. Classic case in point: M3 east of Nyíregyháza.

We wil build 40-50whateverish kms of full profile highway for what will be main road levels of traffic. Both northern-romania and ukraine are very poor. There is no need for a motorway NOW east of Nyíregyháza.

From the money it will take to construct M3 + 2 half profile sections east of Mátészalka, it would be possible to upgrade ALL the main roads in Szabolcs-Szatmár-Bereg county PLUS build a new bridge round Tokaj.


But no, we will have a motorway for people to speed on and police to fine people for speeding on an EMPTY motorway.


MEANWHILE over on the 'western front' we cant afford to build a PROPER HIGHWAY, instead M85/86 will be express roads with narrow shoulders for 110 kph. GIVE ME A BREAK.
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Old April 8th, 2009, 03:15 PM   #2023
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A motorway is so much more than only traffic volumes...

traffic safety
economic development
employment
mobility of the workforce
etc.
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Old April 8th, 2009, 03:20 PM   #2024
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
A motorway is so much more than only traffic volumes...

traffic safety
economic development
employment
mobility of the workforce
etc.
YES YES YES

BUT if you have LIMITED RESOURCES and a CHART with traffic volumes _MAYBE_ build the motorway where the volume DEMANDS it

because if you DONT, then the overwhealming traffic on the overcrowded sections (road 85, 86, 4, 10) will mean
less safety
less output
less employment
less mobility

see?
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Old April 8th, 2009, 03:22 PM   #2025
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No need to shout. I think the busier areas should get a higher priority, just pointing out that a motorway is more than just traffic volumes, where politicians usually look at.

But why build it now if you can build it over 10 years for twice the price?
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Old April 8th, 2009, 05:53 PM   #2026
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
A motorway is so much more than only traffic volumes...

traffic safety
economic development
employment
mobility of the workforce
etc.
Slovenians don't think so
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Old April 8th, 2009, 06:18 PM   #2027
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Oh stfu already, you're obsessed with us. No one cares what Slovenians think in a Hungarian thread.
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Old April 8th, 2009, 09:01 PM   #2028
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Originally Posted by Verso View Post
Oh stfu already, you're obsessed with us. No one cares what Slovenians think in a Hungarian thread.
thats right
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Old April 8th, 2009, 09:53 PM   #2029
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uf, i just wanted to warn chris that he was not right because i guess slovenians are wise enough and they know what they're doing (and it is opposite from chris's claims). i'm sorry if i was misunderstood
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Old April 8th, 2009, 10:18 PM   #2030
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And in what point Slovenia differs? We will not build motorways on sections where there are not enough traffic.
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Old April 8th, 2009, 11:05 PM   #2031
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pijanec View Post
And in what point Slovenia differs? We will not build motorways on sections where there are not enough traffic.
well, ask chris (and whole world except slovenia), he said that traffic volume is not the only parameter for motorway construction
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Old April 9th, 2009, 01:16 AM   #2032
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H123Laci View Post
maybe you should read my posts more carefully...

whats your country? or is it a secret?

I didnt tell the road budget is too high...

I just told: we shouldnt build motorways for low traffic volumes while we are in lack of bypass roads and while our main road network is a crap.

with the money we waste to ghost motorways we could solve many traffic problems...

just a little example:
we are building the 5-10km long bypass roads in 2-3 stages in a 5-10 years interval (cause NO money), and we are building the M6 motorway in ONE 150km long stage...
My country is Romania, you could've obviously figured it out by now.
Well if what you say is right, then I agree... Indeed, in Hungary I've driven 95% on motorways and only 5% on national roads. Which were in outstanding condition, by the way!

So I assumed that national (and regional / local) roads in .hu were in great shape. Sorry about my mistake.

But still...
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Old April 9th, 2009, 01:34 AM   #2033
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Quote:
Originally Posted by x-type View Post
well, ask chris (and whole world except slovenia), he said that traffic volume is not the only parameter for motorway construction
On the sections where we are not building motorways current roads are enough to support economic development, transit trafic, workforce mobility etc.

For example, let's take section Ptuj-Gruškovje. 9 months of the year this road is virtually empty even during morning rush. Speed limit is 90 km/h and you can easily drive at least 120 km/h all the way. When you come over to Croatia and their new motorway, speed limit is 80-100-110 km/h. That is almost the same as in Slovenia. I use Slovenian main road daily and I am almost always alone on the road. Currently, there is no need for motorway.
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Old April 9th, 2009, 09:04 AM   #2034
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
A motorway is so much more than only traffic volumes...

traffic safety
economic development
employment
mobility of the workforce
etc.

you are right.

in a situation where every road is perfect quality and has enough capacity I would say: lets build some motorway to boost the economy, increase safety, ect...

but our current situation is not that nice:

most of our main roads are crap and lacks of bypasses, and some of them are heavily congested... (eg. MR4, MR10) and the road budget is very imited...

IMO in this situation the best way of spending the limited money is to build as many bypasses as possible, to renew the crap roads, to build many roundabouts, and to build motorways ONLY where the traffic volume is high enough...
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Old April 9th, 2009, 03:35 PM   #2035
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2009.04.10.

turning off of nr. 8119 towards tatabánya industrail estate


the ass of bridgestone


industrial estate backroads w/ factories





typical 'upgraded' arterial road in a village-like section






main road nr. 1 and M1 .. busy as always


ok heres the real deal


tatabánya from above


railroad station (left) and mall (right)


M1


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Old April 9th, 2009, 08:18 PM   #2036
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pijanec View Post
For example, let's take section Ptuj-Gruškovje. 9 months of the year this road is virtually empty even during morning rush. Speed limit is 90 km/h and you can easily drive at least 120 km/h all the way. When you come over to Croatia and their new motorway, speed limit is 80-100-110 km/h. That is almost the same as in Slovenia. I use Slovenian main road daily and I am almost always alone on the road. Currently, there is no need for motorway.
empty all those trucks must be teleported and why the hell they dont' put 120 speed limit? and safety must be just the same as at HR side :bang:
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Old April 9th, 2009, 11:03 PM   #2037
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Thx Chris for the correction of the title
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Old April 12th, 2009, 04:28 PM   #2038
H123Laci
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
No need to shout.
He was jus emphasizing his words... (we sometimes use caps instead of bold)

Quote:
But why build it now if you can build it over 10 years for twice the price?
the question was NOT "to build or not to build", but it was "what to build"...
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Old April 19th, 2009, 06:44 PM   #2039
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Ongoing and starting road and motorway projects:

http://www.nif.hu/multimedia/gallery/759
(sorry for the large size,its readable only this way)

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Old April 19th, 2009, 07:12 PM   #2040
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pfúj

irtó szar grafika

és még a címben is egy akkora [email protected] nagy typo van hogy aki ezt így kiengedte az....
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