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Old December 27th, 2008, 09:28 PM   #1681
LtBk
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No offense, but you guys sound like you prefer the whole world to be auto dependent as the US.
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Old December 28th, 2008, 10:26 AM   #1682
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nope.

not we, but the WHOLE WORLD is auto dependent...

not necessarily direct way (car fetishism), but indirect way... (welfare fetishism...)

martial PT fans badly need the car fans:

without the enormous tax paid by the latter ones the expensive toy of the former ones can't be bought...

auto dependency will only cease, when the overwhelming majority of the worlds population will become a buddhist monk...
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Old December 28th, 2008, 04:04 PM   #1683
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LtBk View Post
No offense, but you guys sound like you prefer the whole world to be auto dependent as the US.
......maybe not entirely but some way yes.
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Old December 28th, 2008, 04:06 PM   #1684
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Quote:
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......maybe not entirely but some way yes.
....still, I´m very impressed of those TGV trains and Maglev too. Though this is an other story.
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Old December 28th, 2008, 04:15 PM   #1685
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I don't mind a country being car-dependent once there are electrical cars that do not pollute. But it must be in balance, it's rediculous everybody has to take the car for 2 - 3km drives. Those are excellent cycling distances for small groceries, social visits etc.

With all the money brought in by drivers, the (local) government can easily construct things to make the car less prominent in cities, like underground parking garages, depressed freeways/expressways etc. Though they wish to spend the money otherwise.
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Old December 28th, 2008, 05:01 PM   #1686
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H123Laci View Post
you dont need to be a hardcore driver to think this, only be informed about the economy...

how many tax do you think a citizen having no car pays?

overwhelming percent of taxes are paid by car owners because overwhelming majority of people who has no car has NO, or has little salary hence pays no tax...

just think about it, its really simple...

The car industry is the engine of the world economy!

NO CAR = NO INDUSTRY = NO WELFARE

or can you say a counterexample?

You are pathetic. I showed you many proofs that car owners barely pay enough to maintain the infrastructure needed for the fuel-driven vehicles,yet you insist on that I'm wrong. The country is run by the taxes of the factories,of which even in the most car-dependent countries auto-industries only produce a few % of the income. Just read the recent "collapse of the US auto industry would result in 1% drop in GDP" titled articles.

The engine of the world is telecommunication and electronic industry. (hint:almost everyone has a mobile phone,but a car is still rare in the world per capita). The age of the car in this part of the world was over before it started.

But before claiming again that I'm a railfan or something here,I've posted more pics of roads in this country than probably anybody else. So currently,I think I can safely claim that I'm the least biased from the 2 of us.
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Old December 28th, 2008, 08:23 PM   #1687
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you showed not proof only your dark in this topic...

(hint:almost everyone has a mobile phone,but a car is still rare in the world per capita)

really?
and how many average mophone can you buy on the price of an average car?
100? 200?

what are you talking about?

BTW: dont you think the match industry is even more significant?
(hint: there are MUCH MORE matches per capita as mophones per capita... )

Last edited by H123Laci; December 28th, 2008 at 08:53 PM.
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Old December 28th, 2008, 08:35 PM   #1688
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I personally find the idea of being forced to drive to do anything undemocratic.
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Old December 28th, 2008, 08:46 PM   #1689
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I think you mistake the compulsion for the deficit of possibilities...

if you dont want to drive but want to work, shop, and disport near your home than move to a downtown of a large city... it's up to you...

Last edited by H123Laci; December 28th, 2008 at 08:53 PM.
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Old December 29th, 2008, 03:41 PM   #1690
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Quote:
Originally Posted by H123Laci View Post
you showed not proof only your dark in this topic...

(hint:almost everyone has a mobile phone,but a car is still rare in the world per capita)

really?
and how many average mophone can you buy on the price of an average car?
100? 200?

what are you talking about?

BTW: dont you think the match industry is even more significant?
(hint: there are MUCH MORE matches per capita as mophones per capita... )
So I am dark because I dont take your word granted,or I dont believe you without doubt? Yes,I am dark,because I actually looked after the topic,and you arent,because you even quoted articles that back my point(even Wiki proves me,as it says "considered a user fee",not "it is a user fee")...
Everyone who reads our discussion will think I'm right,because I provided sources that support my claim,while,as I already said,you just said what was on your mind. You can try to ridicule me,but it doesnt matter what you think,I have the higher ground,until you actually can support your claims.
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Old January 4th, 2009, 05:37 PM   #1691
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M6-M9 junction,pic posted by Aladar:

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Old January 4th, 2009, 05:40 PM   #1692
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RawLee View Post
M6-M9 junction,pic posted by Aladar:

http://kep.ivpicture.hu/33578.N.jpg
Cloverleaf with collector lanes at its best! Really nice photo...
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Old January 4th, 2009, 08:09 PM   #1693
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RawLee View Post
M6-M9 junction,pic posted by Aladar:
waste of money...

giganto-saurus IC for an AADT of 5,000...

we should build the M4 instead of that where the traffic is over 20,000...
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Old January 4th, 2009, 08:24 PM   #1694
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Or complete Budpaest Ring Road !
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Old January 4th, 2009, 08:39 PM   #1695
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In 30 years, you'll be happy they've decided to construct a fullsize cloverleaf
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Old January 4th, 2009, 09:04 PM   #1696
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
In 30 years, you'll be happy they've decided to construct a fullsize cloverleaf
we have TOO many more important things to do...

and cloverleaves w/o CD lanes can be upgraded easily later when traffic volumes recquires it...

maybe a half cloverleaf would be enough: M9 is a normal main road with roundabouts and VERY low traffic...

Last edited by H123Laci; January 4th, 2009 at 09:09 PM.
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Old January 4th, 2009, 09:09 PM   #1697
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mateusz View Post
Or complete Budpaest Ring Road !
yeah, that is really an important task...

to draw out an AADT of 20-30,000 from a congested metropolis is MUCH MORE important than to build a full profile motorway for an AADT of 5,000 where the parallel main road is even not congested...
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Old January 4th, 2009, 09:28 PM   #1698
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Site with some useful pieces of information on Budapest Ring Road and lots of other road procjects

road-traffic technology
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Old January 6th, 2009, 12:29 AM   #1699
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
In 30 years, you'll be happy they've decided to construct a fullsize cloverleaf
....Make it 15 years.
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Old January 6th, 2009, 12:42 PM   #1700
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Majestic View Post
Site with some useful pieces of information on Budapest Ring Road and lots of other road procjects
road-traffic technology
this is a bullshit... full of mistakes, deceit and falsehood...


Quote:
According to independent experts it is not necessary to construct the northern part of the M0 as its effect on traffic pattern changes will not be substantial.
yeah... drawing AADT of 20-30,000 out of the city is not substantial...

maybe these experts are not only independent but selp-appointed too...


Quote:
The southern section of the M0 has already stimulated the development of over 50,000m˛ of new car-dependent shopping centres, with a further 80,000m˛ planned. This has created a much more serious traffic problem than the ringroad was supposed to solve. For these reasons, the economic importance of the northern and western sections of the M0 is marginal. The primary beneficiary of the completion of the northern section will be land speculators in the north of Budapest.
yeah.
in hungary people spend their days shuttling between "car-dependent shopping centres"...

so besides of credit we are in heavy need of nice roads to do this hobbi...

Last edited by H123Laci; January 6th, 2009 at 12:48 PM.
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