daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Highways & Autobahns

Highways & Autobahns All about automobility



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old February 27th, 2009, 10:26 PM   #1861
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,613
Likes (Received): 19404

I also wonder how old those suburbs are. Budapest has quite a large suburban area. Did they already exist in communist times? Other cities in the region doesn't seem to have that many suburbs.
ChrisZwolle está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old February 28th, 2009, 01:05 AM   #1862
gramercy
BANNED
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,823
Likes (Received): 799

the city shown here (Érd) literally grew around the highway in the last 10-15 years, partly (i guess) because of the access

The first sections of M7 and M1 (and M3 around the F1 circuit) were build with little consideration to any sort of pollution (noise or otherwise).

The fact of the matter is, there wont be a rerouting because it would be astronomical and its not like there are no other examples in the world. The best we can hope for is that some sections (most notably the M5) will be covered completely with a park like in münchen. But thats not in the near future.

M100 will provide somewhat of an alternative route, that is alternative of the M0 not the M7 of course.
gramercy no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 28th, 2009, 01:07 AM   #1863
gramercy
BANNED
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,823
Likes (Received): 799

also the google map is late, the area around the M1-M0 crossing where the red line goes is undergoing major developments. Plus the area between the 2 highways near the lake will see over 1 bn eur investment and will be completely built up.

they hope the future high speed rail line between bp and wien will have a station there, but as for now it will only have a new station on the traditional railline
gramercy no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 28th, 2009, 01:14 AM   #1864
gramercy
BANNED
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,823
Likes (Received): 799

as for the suburbs

budapest was much smaller until the 1950s when they joined it with the adjacent villages and towns
if you look around in google earth, you will see that the city has very different texture at different places
the old town on the hill is from the 17-1800s;*then the area within the first circular road was built up during the late 1800s and early 1900s; then you can see examples of bauhaus from the 30s and 'szocreál' from the 50s; most of the communist blocks were built from 1960s to 1990s;
then you can see lots of detached houses, the remains of the villages and towns that were joined. the commie blocks were mostly put in the 'gaps'
another thing is the industrial areas, but i wont go into that

anyway, budapest has a very visible road structure of ringroads and avenues. the oldest one is from the late 1800s the newest one is the M0. there are plans to build two more (!) ringroads between the M0 and Hungária körút

as for the agglomeration, that parly grew with the population in communist times
but in the last 2 decades budapest proper lost about half a million people, some of which due to people dieing but most of it because people moved out to suburbia

budapest has a _very_ good s-bahn system (3 suburban light rail + 11 rail lines), lots of buses and actually even the traffic jams arent that bad;*so lots of people were motivated to move

i dont think this is a bad thing, downtown should become much greener and have a much less population density: small flats should be converted into big lofts and hotels, that sort of thing
gramercy no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 28th, 2009, 01:35 AM   #1865
gramercy
BANNED
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,823
Likes (Received): 799

BTW they have announced the competition for the RE-construction of the M0 SW section, between M1 and M5

today its 2x2 asphalt, after reconstruction it will be 2x(3+1) concrete
its 30 kms and it will include a new bridge on the Danube

cost estimate is half a billion EUR
gramercy no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 28th, 2009, 01:58 AM   #1866
Majestic
Systematic Chaos
 
Majestic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: POZnan* (PL)
Posts: 805
Likes (Received): 26

2x(3+1) = 3 lanes each direction plus a shoulder?

Why is the pavement being changed to concrete - too many potholes?

Are they going to renovate one carriageway at a time? Traffic is already over the capacity there, guess drivers are going to experience massive jams...
Majestic no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 28th, 2009, 02:03 AM   #1867
gramercy
BANNED
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,823
Likes (Received): 799



yes, 3 lanes plus emergency lane, both directions
as far as i know, first they will build the 'new' side, 4 lanes
then they will redirect the traffic onto the new side
then tear up the old side and completely rebuild it

then it will be 8 lanes in a 2x(3+1) configuration


there are actually no potholes on this section, the asphalt is quite good here
but the concrete will not require much work for at least 50 years, which is a huge advantage: asphalt under this kind of pressure has to be redone every 8-12 years
gramercy no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old February 28th, 2009, 02:04 AM   #1868
wdw35
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 471
Likes (Received): 0

Concrete is a much better solution for the level of traffic that the Budapest bypass will experience.
I am sure that during the widening, 2x2 profile will be provided for the entire period (albeit with no shoulder and reduced lane widths, maybe even down to 3 m). I don't think that during the widening project in the M6 area of M0 really affected traffic.

Edit: gramercy posted simultaneously :P
wdw35 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old March 3rd, 2009, 01:53 PM   #1869
SeanT
DK/H
 
SeanT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: DK-Bjćverskov
Posts: 791
Likes (Received): 63

Yes I´ve met the same enthusiasme in every statements regarding concret-motorways so let´s hope they know what they talk about
SeanT no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old March 13th, 2009, 12:39 AM   #1870
RawLee
Registered User
 
RawLee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Budapest
Posts: 9,447
Likes (Received): 1083

Update on M6 by Aladar

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aladar View Post
Fresh M6's pictures on bama.hu:

Sztráda: eljött a látványos munkák ideje

Himesháza/Székelyszabar








Viaduct Belvárdgyula




















Full gallery
RawLee no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old March 13th, 2009, 12:41 AM   #1871
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,613
Likes (Received): 19404

I sometimes wonder if it ain't cheaper to just dump a huge amount of sand instead of making those low viaducts...
ChrisZwolle está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old March 13th, 2009, 12:49 AM   #1872
RawLee
Registered User
 
RawLee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Budapest
Posts: 9,447
Likes (Received): 1083

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
I sometimes wonder if it ain't cheaper to just dump a huge amount of sand instead of making those low viaducts...
Well,thats about 10m high. I think an embankment of such height made of earth must have a year or so to consolidate. We dont have the luxury of time. And this way,the farmers still can get through.
RawLee no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old March 13th, 2009, 12:59 AM   #1873
Majestic
Systematic Chaos
 
Majestic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: POZnan* (PL)
Posts: 805
Likes (Received): 26

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
I sometimes wonder if it ain't cheaper to just dump a huge amount of sand instead of making those low viaducts...
Nah, ground works are very expensive and you would need thousands of dump trucks and millions of cubic meters to put up a dike like this.
Majestic no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old March 13th, 2009, 01:22 PM   #1874
H123Laci
BANNED
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Budapest, HUN
Posts: 1,647
Likes (Received): 3

Do you want to tell to a netherlander how expensive a dike?
H123Laci no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old March 13th, 2009, 01:33 PM   #1875
H123Laci
BANNED
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Budapest, HUN
Posts: 1,647
Likes (Received): 3

Quote:
Originally Posted by RawLee View Post
We dont have the luxury of time.
yeah.
it have to be ready in a year, so every budapester will be able to get into his car and hurry to pecs to see the next hungarian fiasco...
H123Laci no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old March 13th, 2009, 03:16 PM   #1876
gramercy
BANNED
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 4,823
Likes (Received): 799

it is indeed puzzling

the political reasons are obvious, and we will pay for it with higher maintenance costs. brilliant....
gramercy no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old March 13th, 2009, 04:38 PM   #1877
keber
Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Slovenia
Posts: 9,878
Likes (Received): 1364

Quote:
Originally Posted by RawLee View Post
Well,thats about 10m high. I think an embankment of such height made of earth must have a year or so to consolidate.
True only, if you build on difficult marchland. On normal ground you don't need much time for consolidation, if you use stony material (even viaduct needs some time to be constructed).
In normal situations it is much cheaper to build a 10 meter embankment than a viaduct (even by factor of 2). For landowners, animals and water to cross under motorway it is enough to build 10 or 20 meters long bridge.

But usually decisions are done by politicians and lobbyist, not experts.
keber no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old March 13th, 2009, 04:41 PM   #1878
keber
Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: Slovenia
Posts: 9,878
Likes (Received): 1364

Quote:
Originally Posted by Majestic View Post
Nah, ground works are very expensive and you would need thousands of dump trucks and millions of cubic meters to put up a dike like this.
Millions?
Around 50.000 cubic meters for 100 m long and 10 m high motorway embankment. Multiply that with 30-50 € per cubic m and see the price then compare it with some bridge and viaduct costs.
keber no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old March 14th, 2009, 01:53 PM   #1879
Timon91
Error
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: just outside Germany
Posts: 5,783
Likes (Received): 46

I have a question: can you drive from Zagreb to Budapest using only motorways? If not, where are the gaps? And does anyone have pictures of this stretch? Thanks
__________________
My Flickr account.
Some of my photoseries: Northern Ireland, Prague, Boston, Alaska part 1, 2, 3, Smoggy Moscow, Warsaw, Wrocław, Kiev, Donetsk, Odessa and Chişinău.
Timon91 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old March 14th, 2009, 01:54 PM   #1880
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,613
Likes (Received): 19404

Yes, the A7 was completed last year. Croatian A4 was already finished. Actually, you can drive from Miskolc or Debrecen to Rijeka or Split without exiting the motorway.
ChrisZwolle está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
budapest, highways, hungary, motorways

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 01:53 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium