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Old July 12th, 2010, 05:36 PM   #81
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Estimated services and travel times



Column keys, in order:
- service
- origin
- destination
- calling also at
- travel time
- average speed
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Old July 12th, 2010, 06:07 PM   #82
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Technical documentation

Those who want to get to the details of the project can now do so. The related govt. agency published detailed studies online. English technical documentation can be accesses at http://www.tavbrasil.gov.br/DocumentacaoIngles.asp . You will find everything from CAD models to financial modelling to demand forecast assessment.

Have fun
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Old July 12th, 2010, 07:55 PM   #83
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democracy or what chinese call "burocracy" is intended to control the spend by being critical with every project, leaving it open to debate in order to make the most of the public funds spending and impacting positively on most the population.

Totalitarism plus unlimited access to credits and corruption on top of that usually speeds up things, specially infrastructure... but there is a thread open for China, and sorry for the off topic I just can´t stand people distorting the truth just for propaganda.

Fortunately Brazil is a free country, and it seems that will become the first country in America to get a proper HSR!

Last edited by Andres_Low; July 12th, 2010 at 08:04 PM.
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Old July 13th, 2010, 12:36 AM   #84
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When the HST will be opened ?

For WC 2014 it seems impossible. But for OG 2016 is it possible ?
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Old July 14th, 2010, 08:04 PM   #85
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Brazil's President Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva attends the launching ceremony for the tender of a high speed train project that will link the cities of Rio de Janeiro, Sao Paulo and Campinas, in Brasilia July 13, 2010.

High-speed Brazil train could be ready for Olympics

BRASILIA - A high-speed train between Brazil’s largest cities, Rio de Janeiro and Sao Paulo, should be ready in time for the 2016 Olympics, President Luiz Inacio Lula da Silva said on Tuesday.

"I think that it’s completely feasible that we’ll inaugurate the project by 2016," Lula said during an event in Brasilia.

"We want the project to be ready for the 2016 Olympic Games," Lula added.

The Brazilian government on Tuesday published the specifications of the project, which has an estimated cost of 33 billion reals ($19.4 billion) and has attracted interest from companies from Europe to Asia.

Companies have until November 29 to present their bids, before a decision is made on December 16.

Lula also announced plans to create a public company to manage the railway line and guarantee the transfer of technology to Brazil which, despite its enormous size, has few railways.

The new train is set to travel some 500 kilometers between Rio and Sao Paulo in around one hour and a half, for a cost of 200 reals ($117) in economy class.

Agence France-Presse
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Old July 15th, 2010, 11:49 PM   #86
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Edital:

http://www.tavbrasil.gov.br/EditaldeLicitacao.asp
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Old July 15th, 2010, 11:50 PM   #87
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Edital:

http://www.tavbrasil.gov.br/EditaldeLicitacao.asp
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Old July 17th, 2010, 05:42 PM   #88
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Any news on who will be the foreign partner?
If the plan is to ready for the Olympic games, the final decision is close, right?
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Old July 17th, 2010, 07:17 PM   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Locust View Post
Any news on who will be the foreign partner?
If the plan is to ready for the Olympic games, the final decision is close, right?
The plans for it to be ready for the Olympics are sort of wishful-thinking. Bids can be submitted till November 30th, decision will be made on December 16th.

As the project was designed, the financial private partners will be responsible to choose their technical partners and so. The government will only certify that the technical partners have expertise in building HSL and give the rights to construct and explore the concession for the consortium that offers the lowest controlled-fare (2nd class, Rio de Janeiro-Sao Paulo; minimum 60% of seats on each train to be 2nd class; every other combination of city pairs and service classes fares are non-regulated).

There was some pressure to keep AnsaldoBreda out of any consortium due to its recent lackluster delivery performance in recent projects (in Denmark, Netherlands, US, Italy etc.), but the government position is that it is in the very interest of the financial partners to choose wisely the train manufacturer.
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Old July 17th, 2010, 10:50 PM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post

I preffer more expensive and slow-going projects than a brutal, dictatorial one-party government ruling my country.
Except if the government wants to build a 50-lane freeway or a massive parking lot and strip mall.
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Old July 17th, 2010, 11:18 PM   #91
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Except if the government wants to build a 50-lane freeway or a massive parking lot and strip mall.
What an exaggeration. I've never seen any freeway wider than 26 lanes. Rail junctions with flyovers occupy greater area than equivalent road junctions due to curve radius constraints.

Governments building strip malls and associated parking lots? There is plenty of private money waiting to build them because they are profitable. I don't know of governments building shopping malls at all - they are the ubiquity of self-sustainable (financially) estate projects, for the huge demand they attract in almost every Western country. They are a magnet of costumers willing to spend
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Old July 17th, 2010, 11:31 PM   #92
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i hate this brasil high speed , first veryvery expensive to only 500 km , second with this money could duplicate 4000 km of highways
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Old July 18th, 2010, 12:16 AM   #93
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i hate this brasil high speed , first veryvery expensive to only 500 km , second with this money could duplicate 4000 km of highways
If you look into specifics of this project, it was designed as a self-contained (for 74% of its costs and any overrun) project-finance PPP. In these schemes, money is allocated specifically to the project.

It is not coming, save for a mere € 3 bln., from the general budget or any existing transportation appropriation.

Hence, there is no reason to hate the project - not that I think that duplicating 4.000 km of highways (indeed, € 23 bln. could easily duplicate more than 4.000 km of highways) is not needed or more urgent, though.
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Old July 18th, 2010, 01:00 AM   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
If you look into specifics of this project, it was designed as a self-contained (for 74% of its costs and any overrun) project-finance PPP. In these schemes, money is allocated specifically to the project.

It is not coming, save for a mere € 3 bln., from the general budget or any existing transportation appropriation.

Hence, there is no reason to hate the project - not that I think that duplicating 4.000 km of highways (indeed, € 23 bln. could easily duplicate more than 4.000 km of highways) is not needed or more urgent, though.
sorry , but you are wrong , first you are brazilian ???
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Old July 18th, 2010, 01:58 AM   #95
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sorry , but you are wrong , first you are brazilian ???
I'd welcome you to point out what I said wrong above the figures I presented here, as they come from the simple accounting jiggling of the official studies presented to the public and released in full couple weeks ago.

As a side note, I don't think nationality is relevant to discuss a technical issue of any given country. In any case, yes, I'm half-Brazilian and I speak Portuguese fluently (although all studies were also translated to English in the link I've provided couple posts ago).
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Old July 18th, 2010, 03:37 PM   #96
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One thing I really love about this proposed line is that it links the major airports in Sao Paulo and Rio De Janeiro. Guarulhos can't be expanded much further, so linking it with Galeao and Viracopos will distribute air traffic more evenly, as well as take the pressure of the RIO-SAO shuttle routes, relieving Congonhas and saving expansion costs on GRU.
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Old July 18th, 2010, 04:04 PM   #97
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I agree with the first three assertions but not with the fourth. IMO, GRU needs to be expanded regardless of any high-speed rail project. It is the Brazilian hub and gives Brazilian airlines a huge continental advantage that could be lost if Brazil ends like Italy, with two competing international hubs or more.
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Last edited by Suburbanist; July 19th, 2010 at 12:42 AM. Reason: typo
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Old July 18th, 2010, 08:46 PM   #98
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(...)like Italy, with two competing international bus or more.

I think u mean two competing hubs...
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Old July 18th, 2010, 09:00 PM   #99
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Brazil have 2 projects now, the TAV Rio-Sao Paulo-Campinas and the Expresso Pequí (Goiania-Brasília)

But, in 2010 the studies for Sao Paulo-Curitiba and Sao Paulo-Belo Horizonte, starts.

And have a project for olympic games, Rio host the olympic games and Sao Paulo host the soccer games in 2016. It's the original project.
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Old July 19th, 2010, 12:50 AM   #100
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Brazil have 2 projects now, the TAV Rio-Sao Paulo-Campinas and the Expresso Pequí (Goiania-Brasília)
This Expresso Pequi was dumped and ditched. Indeed, civil courts convicted two of the officials involved in selecting, with disregard of the bid legislation, a consulting firm totally unprepared to do a technical study on the project, which was deemed "laughable at" by the judge.

It will not happen, which doesn't mean other project could not be started, from scratch, for a rail link between these two cities.
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