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Old July 19th, 2014, 03:44 PM   #121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonasry View Post
Are there any preliminary timetable? I'm curious on how much travel time will be reduced for tpthe Gdansk-Warsaw route.


Above is intended travel times in 2015.
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Old July 22nd, 2014, 03:06 AM   #122
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double set:

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Old July 25th, 2014, 05:39 PM   #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Balsen View Post
Above is intended travel times in 2015.
Many thanks, Balsen. I should perhaps be smug about the differences in French and Polish definitions of "high speed", but I am actually quite impressed with the reduction in travel times between Gdansk and Warsaw. Last I went that way (not so long ago) the fastest direct connection took 4 1/2 hours. They have shaven 2 hours off! Does anyone know to what extent this is due to better use of existing infrastructure, renovation and newly laid tracks? (Sorry if this has been debated already.)
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Old July 26th, 2014, 02:05 AM   #124
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hans280 View Post
Many thanks, Balsen. I should perhaps be smug about the differences in French and Polish definitions of "high speed", but I am actually quite impressed with the reduction in travel times between Gdansk and Warsaw. Last I went that way (not so long ago) the fastest direct connection took 4 1/2 hours. They have shaven 2 hours off! Does anyone know to what extent this is due to better use of existing infrastructure, renovation and newly laid tracks? (Sorry if this has been debated already.)

Simply speaking railway between Warsaw and Gdańsk gets rebuilt from scratch. Setting the speed limit up to 200 kph for Pendolino trains.

here's the latest on above railway:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showth...65151&page=541
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Old July 26th, 2014, 11:45 AM   #125
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Balsen View Post
Simply speaking railway between Warsaw and Gdańsk gets rebuilt from scratch. Setting the speed limit up to 200 kph for Pendolino trains.

here's the latest on above railway:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showth...65151&page=541
Thanks again. Very interesting photos. Unfortunately I cannot read most of the Polish text. You say "from scratch" but it looks like they're mostly following the pre-existent tracks? That would also explain the Vmax=200 km/h. Had they built a totally new line at a distance from extant railway infrastructure the temptation to go for 250+ would probably have got too strong to resist.
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Old July 26th, 2014, 03:57 PM   #126
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hans280 View Post
Thanks again. Very interesting photos. Unfortunately I cannot read most of the Polish text. You say "from scratch" but it looks like they're mostly following the pre-existent tracks? That would also explain the Vmax=200 km/h. Had they built a totally new line at a distance from extant railway infrastructure the temptation to go for 250+ would probably have got too strong to resist.
Yes, the existing railway has just been rebuilt in pre-existing corridor,
so the line is too curvy to go over 160/200 kph.

The only way to go over 200 is to build new high speed line - which would probably be extension of CMK railway.
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Old July 28th, 2014, 09:08 AM   #127
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To curvy, how much would a tilting Pendolino have helped? (The Polish Pendolino doesn't tilt, as far as I know)
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Old August 20th, 2014, 10:04 PM   #128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hans280 View Post
Many thanks, Balsen. I should perhaps be smug about the differences in French and Polish definitions of "high speed", but I am actually quite impressed with the reduction in travel times between Gdansk and Warsaw. Last I went that way (not so long ago) the fastest direct connection took 4 1/2 hours. They have shaven 2 hours off! Does anyone know to what extent this is due to better use of existing infrastructure, renovation and newly laid tracks? (Sorry if this has been debated already.)

Also be aware that the last time you went, the train took a different route, over 100 km longer, through Bydgoszcz. That was done due to the construction of the higher speed line.
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Old August 21st, 2014, 10:46 AM   #129
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M-NL View Post
To curvy, how much would a tilting Pendolino have helped? (The Polish Pendolino doesn't tilt, as far as I know)
10 minutes, tops.
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Old August 24th, 2014, 10:45 PM   #130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Balsen View Post
Simply speaking railway between Warsaw and Gdańsk gets rebuilt from scratch. Setting the speed limit up to 200 kph for Pendolino trains.
200 km/h, does this mean, there are no level-crossings anymore? Only bridges and underpasses.

Kind regards
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Old August 26th, 2014, 06:37 PM   #131
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Yes.
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Old December 15th, 2014, 01:44 AM   #132
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Poland's first HST service has opened:

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Originally Posted by JanVL View Post
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Old December 17th, 2014, 03:00 AM   #133
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Polish Pendolinos enter service

Quote:
Originally Posted by www.railjournal.com
POLISH long-distance operator PKP Intercity launched its new EIC Premium services on December 14, marking the entry into passenger service of its Alstom ED250 Pendolino EMUs.

More than 6000 passengers used the service on the first day and PKP Intercity says it has already sold more than 61,000 EIC Premium tickets.

EIC Premium offers a 2h 58min journey time for Warsaw – Gdansk, 3h 42min for Warsaw – Wroclaw, 2h 28min for Warsaw – Krakow, and 2h 34min for Warsaw – Katowice. Each seven-car seats 345 passengers in standard class and 57 in first.

PKP Intercity ordered the 250km/h non-tilting multi-system (25kV ac 50Hz, 15kV ac and 3kV dc) trains from Alstom in May 2011 at a cost of €400m, and the fleet of 20 sets will be maintained by the manufacturer under a 17-year deal worth a further €265m, which includes the construction of a dedicated maintenance depot at Olszynka Grochowska in Warsaw. Nine sets from the 15 trains delivered so far are required to operate the initial service pattern, although PKP Intercity will ultimately diagram up to 17 of the 20 sets when the network is fully operational.

With the completion of the upgrading of Central Main Line (CMK) between Warsaw and Zawiercie in Silesia next year, which includes the installation of ERTMS Level 2, it is likely the trains will be able to operate at up to 230km/h on this route.
www.railjournal.com
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Old December 18th, 2014, 01:48 PM   #134
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Hi!
congratulations on the release.

I have some questions. I apologize if you are already answered in the Thread and my bad English.

The maximum speed in Poland is 200 km/h until next year comes into operation ETCS 2 on line Warsaw-Zawiercie (Katowice) ?.
The security system to 200 km/h is KPH / SHP ?.
The lines served by the EIC Premium are generally 200 km/h, or there are only sections at this speed?, How many km are there in Poland to 200 km/h ?.
Warsaw-Gdansk is 327 km, is it right ?. żWarsaw to Wroclaw?. żWarsaw to Kraków?
When entered service 19 trains Husarz ?, the first was in 2009, but how ?, year 2009/2011 ?.
There are more EMUs to 200 km/h?

A greeting, and thanks in advance

Note 1: I think it should not be called Pendoline because it will lead to confusion.

Note 2: The ICE 2 circulated at 280 only pulling, and at 200 pushing with the problem of crosswinds. It is the problem of push-pull trains at high speeds.
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Old December 18th, 2014, 01:51 PM   #135
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gusiluz View Post
The maximum speed in Poland is 200 km/h until next year comes into operation ETCS 2 on line Warsaw-Zawiercie (Katowice) ?.
The maximum speed 200 km/h is now allowed on circa 90 km from Zawiercie to Olszamowice on CMK line. This line was for over 20 years cleared to 160 km/h but now it is modernised and thanks to ECTS level 1 200 km/h was allowed on almost ready section. When works will finish this speed will be from Zawiercie to Grodzisk Mazowiecki (roughly 222 km).

Quote:
The security system to 200 km/h is KPH / SHP ?.
For up to 160 km/h SHP over that speed it is either ETCS or ERTMS. CMK line from Zawiercie to Warszawa will have ETCS level 1 while from Warszawa to Gdańsk ERTMS level 2 will be installed. PKP PLK is also installing ERTMS on other lines with lower speeds - E20 from German Border through Poznań and Warszawa to Belarus Border, on E30 corridor from German Border through Legnica, Wrocław and up to Opole and on Warszawa - Koluszki - Łódź line. All of them are cleared for 160 km/h maximum speed (of course with some point speed restrictions).

Quote:
The lines served by the EIC Premium are generally 200 km/h, or there are only sections at this speed?, How many km are there in Poland to 200 km/h ?.
No, EIC Premium run on regular lines modernised or being modernised to various speeds. The Zawiercie - Grodzisk Mazowiecki corridor which serves Warszawa to Kraków, Katowice and Wrocław has now 200 km/h on approximate 90 km section but it will allow that speed on whole 222 km stretch when finished. This section has superb parameters and it is envisaged that in near future speeds may be raised even up to 250 km/h.

Remaining sections from Grodzisk to Warszawa and from Psary to Kraków are / will be cleared up to 150-160 km/h while from Zawiercie to Katowice 120 km/h is possible. CMK is also used by EIP on Warszawa - Wrocław corridor which diverge from that line near Koniecpol and go through Częstochowa Stradom and Opole. This section was modernised for 120 - 140 km/h speeds while Opole - Wrocław for some years already allows 160 km/h.

Regarding line from Warszawa to Gdańsk it is in process of modernisation which still isn’t fully completed but after it will be done 160 km/h will be possible on let say 80 % of the line. Some sections are modernised for 200 km/h operations but before this ERTMS level 2 still has to be finished and commissioned. But when this will be ready (approximately 2016) 200 km/h will be on circa 50 % of the line.

Quote:
Warsaw-Gdansk is 327 km, is it right ?. żWarsaw to Wroclaw?. żWarsaw to Kraków?
Warszawa Centralna - Gdańsk is 299 km
Warszawa Centralna - Kraków is 292 km
Warszawa Centralna- Katowice is 297 km
Warszawa Centralna -Wrocław is 427 km

Quote:
When entered service 19 trains Husarz ?, the first was in 2009, but how ?, year 2009/2011 ?.
PKP IC uses 10 Husarz locomotives delivered between 2009-2011. Due to lack ERTMS in cab equipment they are limited to 160 km/h.

Quote:
There are more EMUs to 200 km/h?
No
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Old December 18th, 2014, 02:03 PM   #136
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Thank you very much!
What response speed, true high speed. And very full!

The Husarz would not be 19?
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Old December 18th, 2014, 02:09 PM   #137
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The Zawiercie - Grodzisk Mazowiecki corridor was built with track geometry allowing 250 km/h. So after comissioning ETCS 2 Pendolino should increase speeds - according to PKP.
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Old December 18th, 2014, 02:20 PM   #138
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PKP AFAIK isn't going to upgrade ETCS 1 to 2 on CMK. ETCS 1 is enough to reach 250 km/h.

BTW. The biggest problem with reaching 250km/h is power supply. (we should change voltage from 3kV DC to 25 kV AC)
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Old December 18th, 2014, 02:43 PM   #139
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gusiluz View Post
The Husarz would not be 19?
No, PKP IC bought only 10 Husarz locomotives and any additional units won't be purchased as this locomotive doesn't comply with latest crashworthiness standards.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Balsen
The Zawiercie - Grodzisk Mazowiecki corridor was built with track geometry allowing 250 km/h. So after comissioning ETCS 2 Pendolino should increase speeds - according to PKP.
Geometry of this corridor is suitable for speeds of up to 300 km/h (4000 m minimum curve radius) and even some infrastructure works were made towards that speed. The problem lays with 3 kV DC power supply which isn't suitable for higher speeds while re-electrification for 25 kV 50 Hz AC was cancelled in favour of boosting DC supply which hopefully will allow raising speed over 200 km/h mark.

Regarding ETCS level 1 and its upgrade to ERTMS level 2 at this moment nothing is clear. The level 1 was set for 200 km/h but it may be used for higher speeds. The problem seems to be more of a nature of legacy signalling systems (as in Level 1 ETCS functions more as cab signalling) while upgrade to ERTMS level 2 may allow to overcome this problem. The biggest concern seems to be stopping distance, and in level 1 eurobalises function as data transfers means while in level 2 they function as train detection while communication is put through GSM-R radio allowing quicker and continous data transmissions. It will be also useful to implement level 2 on CMK as only this line received level 1 variant while others from start assume full ERTMS level 2.
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Old December 18th, 2014, 03:16 PM   #140
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BTW. The biggest problem with reaching 250km/h is power supply. (we should change voltage from 3kV DC to 25 kV AC)
Yes, the italian/dutch problem. If catenary is redesigned for 200 km/h and 3000V DC it makes no economic sense to change this to 25kV 50 Hz AC in the near future. Also this would mean that tracks are dedicated to High-Speed only. Maybe on CMK some freight-trains would run with 25kV 50 Hz AC, if it would make sense to buy locos for that purpose only.
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