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Old December 30th, 2012, 12:51 AM   #5021
cassini83
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Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
A 13 kilometer tunnel? Wow!
There's quite a discussion in the bulgarian section about it. Some people are dead set against it due to the high cost of construction and maintenance but at this point it looks like building it is all but certain.
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Old December 30th, 2012, 01:28 AM   #5022
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I believe this tunnel section will not be built very soon, probably everything else will be completed before. Already constructing such tunnel would take at least 5 years for one tube only.
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Old December 30th, 2012, 01:38 AM   #5023
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The construction process itself will take more than a few years, no doubt about it. Also I'm sure we're going to see strong international involvement in the project because I doubt there's a bulgarian company that has the know-how and the ability of getting the job done all by itself.
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Old December 30th, 2012, 01:53 AM   #5024
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Chinese come to my mind ... at least if you really plan to do all this for just 1 billion.
13 km long twin bore tunnel should cost around 500 million euro (with additional equipment) in not too demanding rock with some normal cost European engineering company.
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Old December 30th, 2012, 03:08 AM   #5025
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keber
Chinese come to my mind ... at least if you really plan to do all this for just 1 billion.
13 km long twin bore tunnel should cost around 500 million euro (with additional equipment) in not too demanding rock with some normal cost European engineering company.
I hope it's not a Chinese company. The quality of their roads is questionable, and a tunnel must be very well built and safe.
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Old December 30th, 2012, 08:38 AM   #5026
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Originally Posted by Baiazid View Post
I've just answered you on the Romanian Motorway thread: that is absolutely not true!

We have an ongoing tendering procedure for Fesabilty Study (design!) for the South Motorway Bucharest - Alexandria - Craiova - Drobeta Turnu Severin - Lugoj, out of which Craiova - Lugoj is part of CIV South! So why would you say we're "moving away from CIV South" ?!
I answered you on the same forum. I personally think that nothing will be done on that section in the coming 4 years, from just reading the motorway construction programme of the Gov.
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Old December 30th, 2012, 08:40 AM   #5027
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If everything goes well with the Qatar project, we might see serious development on both CIV and CIX in BG.
What is the situation with the Qatar proposed funding BTW? A success story with such project could be an example for other similar projects.
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Old December 30th, 2012, 04:22 PM   #5028
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What is the situation with the Qatar proposed funding BTW? A success story with such project could be an example for other similar projects.
Bulgaria participates with land expropriation and Qatar finances construction. Then the road would be tolled. The type of toll system is still unknown.

Information about traffic, cost, type of highway(motorway or expressway), route, toll collection system would be available in January.
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Old December 30th, 2012, 10:16 PM   #5029
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cassini83 View Post
There's quite a discussion in the bulgarian section about it. Some people are dead set against it due to the high cost of construction and maintenance but at this point it looks like building it is all but certain.
1bln € for 64 km is not that much. What is AADT on the parallel road number 1? According to google maps, it seems to be high quality road with multilevel junctions, bypasses and some short tunnels.
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Old December 31st, 2012, 01:45 AM   #5030
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1bln € for 64 km is not that much. What is AADT on the parallel road number 1? According to google maps, it seems to be high quality road with multilevel junctions, bypasses and some short tunnels.
21-22 000.
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Old December 31st, 2012, 11:51 AM   #5031
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It's interesting to be mentioned that an year ago the state founded a new company - National Company for Strategic Infrastructure Projects, with the purpose to manage and build the rest of A2 Hemus, A3 Struma (including the 13km tunnel) and A5 Cherno More. Probably the company was founded because the Road Agency is lacking capacity to manage all these project.

Here is an interview with CEO where he explains about the projects. The main reason to build the 13km tunnel is to protect the environment and the biodiversity in the Kresna Gorge (part of Natura2000). However, lot 3 of A3 Struma will cost ~1 B euro, which is about half of 2014-2020 EU funds allocated for BG transport and probably will mean that other projects will suffer from lack of financing.
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Old December 31st, 2012, 01:56 PM   #5032
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It's interesting to be mentioned that an year ago the state founded a new company - National Company for Strategic Infrastructure Projects, with the purpose to manage and build the rest of A2 Hemus, A3 Struma (including the 13km tunnel) and A5 Cherno More. Probably the company was founded because the Road Agency is lacking capacity to manage all these project.

Here is an interview with CEO where he explains about the projects. The main reason to build the 13km tunnel is to protect the environment and the biodiversity in the Kresna Gorge (part of Natura2000). However, lot 3 of A3 Struma will cost ~1 B euro, which is about half of 2014-2020 EU funds allocated for BG transport and probably will mean that other projects will suffer from lack of financing.
One small correction - 1B is half the budget for roads.
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Old December 31st, 2012, 02:32 PM   #5033
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Are you comparing multi-year construction costs with the annual road budget? Because that's not exactly the right way to put construction costs into context.
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Old December 31st, 2012, 02:49 PM   #5034
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PhirgataZFs1694 View Post
One small correction - 1B is half the budget for roads.

Are you sure? IMO 2 B will be allocated for transport, not only for roads. I'm judging from the current (2007-2013) budget of the OP Transport.

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Old December 31st, 2012, 04:58 PM   #5035
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21-22 000.
This is data published in 2010.

We have data for 22-25 000 published in 2008.
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Old December 31st, 2012, 05:25 PM   #5036
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The project with the tunnel just for the unimportant tiny kresna gorge is so rediculous. the canyon is not high at all and building the motorway without tunnels there would not harm the animals at all. The animals are not suited only in the valley, the valley extents to the left and to the right of the mountain where the snakes and the other animals can be found aswell, some people have wine growing there, so spending that ammount of money for the valley is insane.
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Old January 1st, 2013, 12:57 PM   #5037
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The project with the tunnel just for the unimportant tiny kresna gorge is so rediculous. the canyon is not high at all and building the motorway without tunnels there would not harm the animals at all. The animals are not suited only in the valley, the valley extents to the left and to the right of the mountain where the snakes and the other animals can be found aswell, some people have wine growing there, so spending that ammount of money for the valley is insane.
Strumatic reality always amazes me. You can't say a section that has up to 25k AADT is unimportant. As for the animals, try speaking with ecologists. They blocked fiercely the idea of building the motorway next to Struma river. And what valley are you talking about? Simitli-Krupnik? The 13km tunnel is not there. Its south beneath Mlashevska mountain AFAIK. Besides the EU approved the financing of lot 1 Dolna Dikanya - Dupnitsa only after the parliament tied Bulgaria to building the whole motorway. So building Struma motrway[A3] is now inevitable.

Why are you so much against continuing Struma motorway after Blagoevgrad?

My only concern is that lot 3 Blagoevgrad - Sandanski would have ~16km tunnels out of 64km which would not significantly improve travelling times especially for Kresna gorge.
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Old January 1st, 2013, 02:19 PM   #5038
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PhirgataZFs1694

Strumatic reality always amazes me. You can't say a section that has up to 25k AADT is unimportant. As for the animals, try speaking with ecologists. They blocked fiercely the idea of building the motorway next to Struma river. And what valley are you talking about? Simitli-Krupnik? The 13km tunnel is not there. Its south beneath Mlashevska mountain AFAIK. Besides the EU approved the financing of lot 1 Dolna Dikanya - Dupnitsa only after the parliament tied Bulgaria to building the whole motorway. So building Struma motrway[A3] is now inevitable.

Why are you so much against continuing Struma motorway after Blagoevgrad?

My only concern is that lot 3 Blagoevgrad - Sandanski would have ~16km tunnels out of 64km which would not significantly improve travelling times especially for Kresna gorge.
Tunnels have a lower speed limit?
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Old January 1st, 2013, 02:32 PM   #5039
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Tunnels have a lower speed limit?
80 vs 90. Although I have heard there are 50 and 60 speedlimits at roadside restaurants and gas stations.


Btw, there are 10versions of routes for passing the gorge. Unfortunately unavailable to general public.
There are three types of routes:
1. Build a 13km tunnel. The variant that was chosen.
2. Expand current road that is next to the river or build the motorway next to it . The ecologist are dead against it.
3. Build the motorway east from the gorge with a series of viaducts and shorter tunnels. It was said this variant was rejected due to chance for ice on the viaducts and costs of winter maintenance.

Last edited by PhirgataZFs1694; January 1st, 2013 at 02:42 PM.
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Old January 1st, 2013, 08:29 PM   #5040
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Is there traffic data available from Bulgarian motorways?
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