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Old February 1st, 2013, 07:05 PM   #2641
KingNick
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And yet, show me where they misbehaved and not him. This is like a typical case where the delinquent becomes a victim. They checked his windshield outside and found out he has no vignette so they followed him inside to fine him. I just meant to buy one is like one of the worst excuses, especially since he could have seen them in their uniforms checking his windshield.

Again, he was not able to buy a Vignette for over 50 km, despite passing a couple of gas stations. If you tell me that story I don't believe it either.
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Old February 1st, 2013, 07:33 PM   #2642
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KingNick,
Sorry, what country are you from?
I think I have clearly explained that I have been captured at the Cash desk. Before that I passed about 20 km on the motorway S3 and passed zero or one gas station.
My main mistake was that I tried to purchase the vignette.
This is my point of view: I was the victim of institutional trap or a fraud of the public Austrian enterprise.

In that case, what would be the sense of selling vignettes at the highways? Anybody who is trying to purchase vignette there is already a delinquent (according to KingNick and ASFINAG) and should be fined. And the gas stations at highways that sell vignettes help delinquents to escape from responsibility.

I am quite surprised that some people in Austria can not understand my way of thinking (and vice versa).
The officers kept repeating: "Now it is to late to purchase the vignette. This is unfair, but that is the law."
The officer from the Austrian embassy said: "Austrian officers will always implement the law no matter what. There can not be any discussion with Austrian policemen or officer."

And I feel huge cultural misunderstanding.
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Old February 1st, 2013, 07:35 PM   #2643
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Does anyone have any nice pictures? :-)
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Old February 1st, 2013, 07:41 PM   #2644
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vladjack View Post
In that case, what would be the sense of selling vignettes at the highways? Anybody who is trying to purchase vignette there is already a delinquent (according to KingNick and ASFINAG) and should be fined. And the gas stations at highways that sell vignettes help delinquents to escape from responsibility.
People can buy vignettes in advance. Additionally, the annual vignette has a validity of 14 months, which means there is a 2-month overlap (December & January) in which you can buy the next (annual) vignette along the motorway if you choose to do so. Therefore, not everyone buying a vignette along a motorway is in offense.
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Old February 1st, 2013, 07:52 PM   #2645
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pumpikatze View Post
I am sorry you had such an unpleasant incident in Austria. I also fully understand your disappointment and anger....I made the same experience simply by making a formal mistake with the vignette and I was forced to pay. It is a long story....too long to tell. I asked the Automobile Club and some lawyers about that, and all I was told is that the ASFINAG is totally right by law and so it is in your case. I am sorry again for you.



My friend, that´s an absolutely stupid comment (sorry for offending you but this time I cant hold back).
Who told you the ASFINAG (or "police") made him pay just because he isn´t Austrian? I can tell you for sure they dont make any difference - I am Austrian myself and had a similar incident but even without driving one single kilometer on the highway (too long to tell the story). They wanted me to pay 120 Euros. I told them I wouldnt pay but write a statement to ASFINAG and explain my situation. They even suggested to do so. And finally I got 400 Euros to pay.
Also regarding your words "not against german of course": Germans (from Germany) are those people affected the most when it is about paying for not having a Vignette.

I can tell you that there is racism in Austria - the same racism like everywhere else in Europe or even in the world...and it´s a shame. But this case has nothing to do with racism. It is just about the ASFINAG being extremely strict and of course make everybody pay whenever they can.
Yes, my words are hard but it's not my fault if a country like Austria elected an extremist politician (Haider if I remember right).
We have the same thing in France but not at this high level.
And we can add Hungary a few months ago with an extremist like Orban.

To finish with that, give a fine to a person who is buying his vignette even if he is 50 km away from the border is an absolute stupidity.
I think you never see a case like that in france. I was arrested sometimes on the road after a fault (speed, seatbelt, stopping,...), but police or gendarmerie didn't give me a fine.
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Old February 1st, 2013, 09:10 PM   #2646
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Quote:
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Yes, my words are hard but it's not my fault if a country like Austria elected an extremist politician (Haider if I remember right).
Now it is a proven fact you simply dont have a clue of what you are talking about.
You are talking about the election in 1999, do you?
May I ask you which political function Jörg Haider had after that election? Do you know without using google? Obviously not.
It is kinda funny how people from other countries think they perfectly know the situation in other countries (in this special case it is Austria) just by something they have read in some low-quality-boulevard-magazine 10 years ago.

And still I cant find the connection of being fined for not having a Vignette and racism. It is as simple as that: ASFINAG will always be strict and not let you go in case they catch you without Vignette. Never. Doesnt matter whether you are Austrian, French, Nigerian, Albanian, Russian, American etc.

I dont want to finally judge that situation....of course I fully understand him being angry because he wanted to buy a Vignette at the same moment they caught him. I also think they could have let him go. And, again, I faced the same situation (an even much worse case) and I was forced to pay 400,- ...and I am Austrian myself.

Quote:
Originally Posted by vladjack View Post
The officer from the Austrian embassy said: "Austrian officers will always implement the law no matter what. There can not be any discussion with Austrian policemen or officer."
And I feel huge cultural misunderstanding.
At least I can understand you, my friend. And it took me some months to fully forget about my anger when I had to pay the fine of 400 Euro. And I still go crazy when I am thinking about that situation again.
About the other thing I can tell you thats simply not true. There is a difference between ASFINAG and Police. I would say Police let me go in about 50% of all cases in which I broke the law - speeding, parking, even things like driving through a one-way-street in the wrong direction (yes, intentionally) and - my all time favourite - driving a car with other cars number plate (no insurance, nothing). I explained the situation to the police officer and - thanks again, officer - he let me go after telling me what would have happened if he would report what I have done.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cinxxx View Post
Things like the company he works for, to not change the waterpump of the car after the required number of km, but turn the km back after the pump fails, and ask for it to be replaced because the car is still in warranty.
Well, seems to be the exception from the rule. I know a bit about it since for some years I worked for a big fleet-management-company.
Tell your friend he is definitely working for the wrong company
Also, that is a quite complex case of cheating. To get the water pump replaced in warranty you need to take your car to the dealer for servicing it regularly. There they would change the water pump at the right amout of km driven. In case they turned back the odometer the dealer/workshop should know.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cinxxx View Post
So the only real difference is, that you have great infrastructure, some better laws, higher paychecks, good healthcare, but in the end you find the same Balkan things, only in a legal package... you can have a better life in that package, I don't deny it, but much is overrated though
I like the word "only" in that sentence
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Last edited by pumpikatze; February 1st, 2013 at 09:28 PM.
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Old February 1st, 2013, 09:17 PM   #2647
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fane40 View Post
Yes, my words are hard but it's not my fault if a country like Austria elected an extremist politician (Haider if I remember right).
We have the same thing in France but not at this high level.
And we can add Hungary a few months ago with an extremist like Orban.
...
All countries have moments in their histories that they...oh, never mind.
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Old February 1st, 2013, 09:59 PM   #2648
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pumpikatze View Post
Also, that is a quite complex case of cheating. To get the water pump replaced in warranty you need to take your car to the dealer for servicing it regularly. There they would change the water pump at the right amout of km driven. In case they turned back the odometer the dealer/workshop should know.
Yeah, only that the dealer/workshop knows the boss of my friend. And the boss is Austrian.
And he did his "job" too, when they brought the car to the workshop, he advised them to be more careful next time, cause the car had less km on board then at the previous service


Quote:
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I like the word "only" in that sentence
You caught me there
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Old February 1st, 2013, 10:05 PM   #2649
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Quote:
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Yeah, only that the dealer/workshop knows the boss of my friend.
Now that explains everything
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Old February 1st, 2013, 10:06 PM   #2650
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Now that explains everything
And this kind of thing is exactly what reminds me of how things are done in the East/Balkans
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Old February 1st, 2013, 10:10 PM   #2651
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Well, Austria actually IS part of the Balkans (partially, at least) - it is just the German language that makes people forget about that
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Old February 1st, 2013, 10:48 PM   #2652
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It's a mixture of Germanic and Balkanese values (at least in the eastern and southern part), that sometimes make us appear Germanic (for the Balkans) and other times Balkanese (for the Germans).
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Old February 1st, 2013, 11:40 PM   #2653
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pumpikatze View Post
You are obviously trolling.
Again: Where is the connection between being a foreigner and being punished for not having a Vignette? Your statement is an answer to a question nobody has asked.

So...no answer to my question about the results of the "famous" election of 1999. Thats what I expected.

Another proof of your own disgusting racism.
You are a troll for quoting a bit of his text and make it look out of context. He was talking about a French traitor Petain, who was running French Vichy, which was collaborative with the Germans. You (Austrian) have no idea what you're talking about, nor have you understood what he was saying, but you're bloody quick on the trigger, aren't you...
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Old February 1st, 2013, 11:43 PM   #2654
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Originally Posted by pumpikatze View Post
Well, Austria actually IS part of the Balkans (partially, at least) - it is just the German language that makes people forget about that
I live in Tirol, and I don't think that any of the locals would agree with you.
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Old February 1st, 2013, 11:48 PM   #2655
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Quote:
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You are a troll for quoting a bit of his text and make it look out of context. He was talking about a French traitor Petain, who was running French Vichy, which was collaborative with the Germans. You (Austrian) have no idea what you're talking about, nor have you understood what he was saying, but you're bloody quick on the trigger, aren't you...
You are right, I am quite quick on the trigger in that case. Why did he come up again and again with that racism-thing when there is no reason for it?

I know very well who is Petain, thank you for the explanation.

About people in Tirol agreeing with my statement: I wrote "partially". More exactly, I ment the East and the South of Austria.
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Old February 2nd, 2013, 12:09 AM   #2656
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Road_UK View Post
You are a troll for quoting a bit of his text and make it look out of context. He was talking about a French traitor Petain, who was running French Vichy, which was collaborative with the Germans. You (Austrian) have no idea what you're talking about, nor have you understood what he was saying, but you're bloody quick on the trigger, aren't you...
Yes, but why are we (well, not "we," actually) talking Pétain and Haider (for over a day now) and supposed national characters when one person had an unpleasant incident with one ******* (or a few *******s - I don't remember the details, nor do I care)?

If we must argue, can't the subject be whether Austria's signs are worse than Britain's ( ;-) )? Or better yet, can't we admire pretty pictures?

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Old February 2nd, 2013, 12:20 AM   #2657
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Yes, but why are we (well, not "we," actually) talking Pétain and Haider (for over a day now) and supposed national characters when one person had an unpleasant incident with one ******* (or a few *******s - I don't remember the details, nor do I care)?

If we must argue, can't the subject be whether Austria's signs are worse than Britain's ( ;-) )? Or better yet, can't we admire pretty pictures?

I guess you still don't think that nations have characters... well come to Europe and travel around a bit while staying on places for a bit longer than a week. Somewhere law is law whatever the circumstances, somewhere else it seems there is no law whatever the circumstances. Both is not really right. There should be something like common sense and the sense of the law in a normal society.

disclaimer: This comment has nothing to do with Haider nor Pétain.
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Old February 2nd, 2013, 01:14 AM   #2658
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I feel sorry for vladjack but I still understand this from the Asfinag viewpoint.

I don't want to sound evil, but it is perfectly possible to not use the motorways at all. If it happens so unfortunately that you don't find a vignette sales point until the beginning of the motorway, you could choose not to enter the motorway at all and keep searching for the sales point elsewhere.

And if you enter Austria on a motorway (though this was not the case here), as far as I know, you can buy the vignette at the border station 24h.

That vignettes are being sold on Austrian motorways' service stations is understandable; they expire sometime and a new one has to be purchased prior to that, and service stations are a reasonable place to do so.

Anyway, the last time I bought the Austrian vignette was as far away from Austria as Regensburg.

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Old February 2nd, 2013, 09:35 AM   #2659
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pumpikatze View Post

You are right, I am quite quick on the trigger in that case. Why did he come up again and again with that racism-thing when there is no reason for it?

I know very well who is Petain, thank you for the explanation.

About people in Tirol agreeing with my statement: I wrote "partially". More exactly, I ment the East and the South of Austria.
Ah ok
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Old February 2nd, 2013, 02:06 PM   #2660
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Ok, I see, people normally buy the vignette at the highway in advance.

I still think this fine was very unfair, but I don't have an impression that was connected with the fact I was foreigner. As pumpikatze emphasized, they would fined anybody.
Also, pumpikatze explained that Austrian policemen are much better then ASFINAG officers. It was also my impression in Austria, so this time when I entered the country, I was quite relaxed. It seems the problem is the system where ASFINAG controllers have quotas. I think they felt they were doing wrong when took my money, but that was good chance for them to achieve improve their result.

When talking about Austria and Balkans, interesting topic, cultural thing, important for many things (including acting of policemen). So, here is my opinion (very brief): I think Austrian mentality is quite far from ours, including positive and negative features. In total, we are different. Again, I think Timisoara is not really Balkans as well. The mentality in Romania is also very different from the one in Montenegro.
Resume: There is no such thing as "Balkans mentality". But there exists Balkans as geographical and cultural concept. Austria is not part of Balkans (neither is Slovenia), and Romania is only slightly part of Balkans in cultural sense.

I think it is very different for us to understand that we all have slightly different concepts of fairness, friendship, etc. And to respect these differences, to discuss them, etc. That is why I asked for your opinion on my incident here.
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