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Old April 27th, 2015, 11:39 PM   #3861
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
I'm considering a trip to Austria this summer. I like to film roads and produce them as timelapse videos.

Whether you can use a dashcam or not is not entirely clear.

The Österreichische Datenschutzbehörde says you cannot do any systematic video surveillance, including dashcams. (source)

However, motorway authority Asfinag says you are allowed to film from a car with a dashcam for personal reasons. If you publish the images, you would need to mask license plates and people. (source) Autorevue recently posted the same. (source)
ASFINAG has absolutely no authority to interpret the law and the guy in the Autorevue is talking bullshit. There is no such thing as a privat purposes justification in the data protection act. You may film your privat area but not public places for privat purposes.

And no, anonymising license plates and people's faces does not cut it. The problem is the fact that you are surveiling public places and this is only allowed under very narrow circumstance. I like taking driving videos is non of them.

That being said: I don't see you running into any actual trouble if you still decide to take a video. There's hardly any police on the Autobahn anyway and they have better stuff to do than enforcing the data protection act.
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Old April 27th, 2015, 11:46 PM   #3862
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You must be German, I assume ?
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Old April 27th, 2015, 11:52 PM   #3863
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I am an Austrian jurist, yes.
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Old April 28th, 2015, 09:57 AM   #3864
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I am an Austrian jurist, yes.
Oh, well, that explains everything.
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Old April 28th, 2015, 03:05 PM   #3865
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What is surveillance and what isn't? Does the fact that you're using a dashcam instead of any other type of camera make it automatically a surveillance instead of a regular video? You could easily mount a regular handy cam or cell phone into your car and film. Or, instead of a dashcam in a car, use a gopro mounted to a helmet. Is that not allowed either?

It seems they wildly overreacted with the personal data protection in relation to dashcams. I don't like how policymakers always like to ban new technology. Shoot first, ask questions later.
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Old April 28th, 2015, 05:10 PM   #3866
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
What is surveillance and what isn't? Does the fact that you're using a dashcam instead of any other type of camera make it automatically a surveillance instead of a regular video? You could easily mount a regular handy cam or cell phone into your car and film. Or, instead of a dashcam in a car, use a gopro mounted to a helmet. Is that not allowed either?

It seems they wildly overreacted with the personal data protection in relation to dashcams. I don't like how policymakers always like to ban new technology. Shoot first, ask questions later.
When the first railway was introduced in Germany in 1835, people were against it. It was found dangerous.

But back to topic. As far as I know, Asfinag is state owned and as such, I would presume that they are not telling bullshit on their website, so as a citizen (no matter if Austrian, German or Dutch), I would sort of rely on their statements, no matter if that Austrian lawyer has a different opinion (data protection fundamentalist?)

I don' t know how far the discussion goes in Austria. The Asfinag statement led me to the interpretation that Austrian authorities were handling this topic with a little more sense of proportion than the surveillance paranoids in Germany.

It is becoming almost hysterical. But in my opinion, data protection is not broken at the moment I film something, but rather at the moment where I make it public, like publishing a video on youtube. Asfinag gives a clear advice: you mask licence plates and people, and you are fine.

That is my opinion. Period.
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Old April 29th, 2015, 11:30 PM   #3867
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Didn't a court in Germany recently allowed a driver to actually use video evidence under the premise he cannot be prevented from proving his lack of responsibility for an accident and that, since car crashes are notoriously difficult to be factually determined to begin with, it makes no sense to prevent a driver using it for that purpose on his own interest?

To end this participation on the off-topic: a modern smartphone is zillion times more intrusive in one's privacy than passive video of public spaces (where people have no expectation of privacy like they'd have in a changing room, bathroom etc). It collects far more data. Your record of use of bank cards create a perfect trail of your presence at numerous places and your whole spending and shopping pattern. Combine the two and anyone really interested in gathering info about someone will manage to get it.
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Old April 30th, 2015, 02:03 AM   #3868
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heico-M View Post
When the first railway was introduced in Germany in 1835, people were against it. It was found dangerous.

But back to topic. As far as I know, Asfinag is state owned and as such, I would presume that they are not telling bullshit on their website, so as a citizen (no matter if Austrian, German or Dutch), I would sort of rely on their statements, no matter if that Austrian lawyer has a different opinion (data protection fundamentalist?)

I don' t know how far the discussion goes in Austria. The Asfinag statement led me to the interpretation that Austrian authorities were handling this topic with a little more sense of proportion than the surveillance paranoids in Germany.

It is becoming almost hysterical. But in my opinion, data protection is not broken at the moment I film something, but rather at the moment where I make it public, like publishing a video on youtube. Asfinag gives a clear advice: you mask licence plates and people, and you are fine.

That is my opinion. Period.
The ASFINAG is a privat company owned by the state. That's about it. The date protection agency is an agency equipped with empire to interpret the date protection act and its views have been upheld infront of the federal administrative court already so no, the ASFINAG has no authority in this matter.
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Old April 30th, 2015, 11:14 AM   #3869
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Apparently, the fundamentalists win:
https://www.dsb.gv.at/site/8105/default.aspx

But why does Asfinag declare something else?

Are Austrian motorways public places, anyways? Or are they private?
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Old April 30th, 2015, 11:59 AM   #3870
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Of course they are.
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Old May 12th, 2015, 07:44 PM   #3871
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S7 Fürstenfelder Schnellstraße

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The EIS of the first S7 section is passed, see press release. Riegersdorf (A2) to Dobersdorf (OSM). Length: 14.8km, including 2 tunnels (Tunnel Speltenbach: 1000m and Tunnel Rudersdorf 2900m) and 24 bridges (10-200m). 2x2 lanes. Total costs: 471 million €, including 98 million €for environmental compensation measures.
The appeals were rejected in April (source), the groundbreaking ceremony will be on 21st May 2015, preliminary works are already ongoing. It's planned to open the entire S7 b/n A2 and Hungarian border at once (source).
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Which new motorways are currently under construction?
Which new motorways will be opened next?

See 'New motorway projects' thread

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Old May 13th, 2015, 01:13 AM   #3872
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Any plan on the Hungarian side?
And why Austrians prefer to use the S-prefix for new roads, even if they have full Autobahn standards?
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In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.
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Old May 13th, 2015, 10:37 AM   #3873
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Originally Posted by italystf View Post
Any plan on the Hungarian side?
Yes, M8: http://www.miabonyunk.hu/images/659389_N.jpg / http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpo...postcount=6087. According to German and Hungarian wikipedia, the ~30km section b/n border and Körmend (map) is approved (all permits since 2013). It was planned to start construction in 2014/15..............
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Which new motorways are currently under construction?
Which new motorways will be opened next?

See 'New motorway projects' thread

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Old May 13th, 2015, 09:47 PM   #3874
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Any plan on the Hungarian side?
And why Austrians prefer to use the S-prefix for new roads, even if they have full Autobahn standards?
only for image, motorway are bad, a lot of traffic, noise, pollution a negative picture

"Schnnellstraße" in engish the easiest words are : fast road

for law and tax they are both the same, the best example is the A7-S10 naming, the A7 was built a lot of years ago, the S10 is only from the end the next section, same standard, same speeds, only the name is new, there was a funny situation that a section was opened 6 month ago and they company painted some signs wrong with A10 ( A7+S10)
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Old May 13th, 2015, 11:14 PM   #3875
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Are S roads financed the same way as A motorways?

What about Maut on S roads?
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Old May 13th, 2015, 11:16 PM   #3876
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There used to be a legal difference between Autobahnen and Schnellstraßen up until 2006. The only difference remaining now is how close people are allowed to build next to each kind of road (40 meters for Autobahn and 25 meters for Schnellstraße). Both are financed and operated by ASFINAG
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Old May 24th, 2015, 11:23 AM   #3877
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S7 Fürstenfelder Schnellstraße

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Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
The appeals were rejected in April (source), the groundbreaking ceremony will be on 21st May 2015, preliminary works are already ongoing. It's planned to open the entire S7 b/n A2 and Hungarian border at once (source).
The groundbreaking ceremony took place. The first 14.8km section contains a 1km and a 2.9km tunnel. Total costs: 471 million €, thereof 98 million € (21%) for environmental compensation. First, the renovation and widening of an A2 bridge is done for 1.8 million € until November 2015. See press release. (I guess it should be this bridge)

It's still planned to open both sections (14.8km + 13.6km) at once in 2021 but the construction of the 2nd section could be delayed due to appeals. See project page.

The appeal against the court decision and expropriation procedures of the 1st section are still pending. 30 land owners have not yet agreed. Opponents claim that the groundbreaking ceremony is just an election propaganda because the state's election in Steiermark and Burgenland will be on next Sunday. They say that just an existing bridge is renovated and this cannot be called the beginning of the new roads' construction. See news article.

If I got it right, the bridge is also widened because the acceleration and deceleration lanes need more space. So this could be called the beginning of the constuction works:

S7: Riegersdorf (A2) – Dobersdorf 14.8km (May 2015 to 2021) – projectmap
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Which new motorways are currently under construction?
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See 'New motorway projects' thread

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Old May 24th, 2015, 12:32 PM   #3878
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I am curious to see when they will actually start to work (currently it seems to me indeed that this is mostly for the elections...), especially when you look at the very unambitious time schedule - estimating 6 (!!!) years of works for a rather short segment with not many difficult sections (even the 2,9 km tunnel is nothing special....) is rather strange... With that "speed", they can still use it as a topic in the next regular provincial elections in 2020...

Maybe due to lack of financial resources, but still being able to claim that there is progress? Or is it really technically so difficult?
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Old May 24th, 2015, 01:10 PM   #3879
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I guess Poland would build a section like this in 2 years, Germany would split it into 2 section and build it in 10 years. So 6 years seem to be a normal pace .
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Which new motorways are currently under construction?
Which new motorways will be opened next?

See 'New motorway projects' thread

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Been/driven: A, AND, B, CDN, CH, CZ, D, DK, E, EST, F, FIN, FL, GB, H, I, L, LV, LT, N, NL, P, PL, RO, S, SLO, USA (My cumulative travel mapping)

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Old May 24th, 2015, 07:39 PM   #3880
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rudiwien View Post
I am curious to see when they will actually start to work (currently it seems to me indeed that this is mostly for the elections...), especially when you look at the very unambitious time schedule - estimating 6 (!!!) years of works for a rather short segment with not many difficult sections (even the 2,9 km tunnel is nothing special....) is rather strange... With that "speed", they can still use it as a topic in the next regular provincial elections in 2020...

Maybe due to lack of financial resources, but still being able to claim that there is progress? Or is it really technically so difficult?
first yes the start now is for the elections, politicans believe that they get more vote for this start now

the real building time is 4 years for the tunnel Rudersdorf, the main reason for making slow (6 years) is the aim to get the whole S7 (west and east part) opened at the same time, at the moment the west part is in building status, the east is still missing
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