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Old February 15th, 2011, 07:06 PM   #2261
g.spinoza
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Whoa... do you mind resizing them to a reasonable size, say 1024px?

By the way, what is the story behind the road numbering of the Messina - Catania - Siracusa motorway? Nowadays it turns from A18 into RA 15, then into an unnumbered motorway, then SS 114 and then A18 again... Weird.
Numbering has never been a major concern of Italian legislators. Just look at the stupid names of superstrade...

BTW, the unnumbered motorway is called NSA339.
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Old February 15th, 2011, 07:38 PM   #2262
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But this number is not used on signs, where abbreviations like "aut. CT-SR" are used.
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Old February 15th, 2011, 07:39 PM   #2263
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coccodrillo View Post
But this number is not used on signs, where abbreviations like "aut. CT-SR" are used.
It is used, AFAIK, in variable message panels.
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Old February 15th, 2011, 09:51 PM   #2264
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hofburg View Post
Why are Italian speed limits often so weird?
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Old February 15th, 2011, 10:27 PM   #2265
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verso View Post
Why are Italian speed limits often so weird?
That spot is probably considered "centro abitato" ("built-up area") and limits for centri abitati in Italy is always 50 (can be 30 in some places, too).

I've seen weirder things in Germany. 1+1 roads with 90 km/h limit and 2+2 with 80...
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Old February 15th, 2011, 10:27 PM   #2266
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indeed, and the entire section. I was the only one going 50

why built up?
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Old February 15th, 2011, 10:30 PM   #2267
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There are houses in the right part of the pic. When houses are nearby, those places are considered inhabited and therefore limits are 50.
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Old February 15th, 2011, 10:33 PM   #2268
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but the road is elevated from surroundings, or dug in later.
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Old February 15th, 2011, 10:42 PM   #2269
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The speed limits can be put to lower noise levels.
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Old February 15th, 2011, 11:07 PM   #2270
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The Sopraelevata in Genova.













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Old February 15th, 2011, 11:12 PM   #2271
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I was there some months ago but didn't have the chance to drive it. I must say this particular road is horrible. It is too close to the historical centre, some buildings and even a church are "suffocated" by its presence. It spread controversies when it was built, back in the 70s I guess.
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Old February 15th, 2011, 11:21 PM   #2272
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It opened in 1965

It's impressive but I can understand the resistance against it, it ruins the waterfront. The elevated structure doesn't make it as much of a barrier as an at-grade road would though.

Are there any traffic statistics available? I'm curious how much traffic uses it per day. It doesn't have a lot of exits and it is a good alternative for A10-A12 for local traffic.
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Old February 15th, 2011, 11:38 PM   #2273
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Interesting that even now they don't install antinoise barriers.
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Old February 15th, 2011, 11:42 PM   #2274
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
It opened in 1965

It's impressive but I can understand the resistance against it, it ruins the waterfront. The elevated structure doesn't make it as much of a barrier as an at-grade road would though.

Are there any traffic statistics available? I'm curious how much traffic uses it per day. It doesn't have a lot of exits and it is a good alternative for A10-A12 for local traffic.
http://www.comune.genova.it/servlets...Name=allegato2

Almost 75.000-80.000 vehicles/day "considering both directions". Between 7.30 and 8.30 am there are 3900 vehicles towards Foce and 3600 towards Sampierdarena.
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Old February 16th, 2011, 12:13 AM   #2275
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keber View Post
Interesting that even now they don't install antinoise barriers.
They don't have that much effect over the elevated structure with a speed limit of only 60 km/h. Plus it will add to the visual pollution.

Quote:
Almost 75.000-80.000 vehicles/day "considering both directions". Between 7.30 and 8.30 am there are 3900 vehicles towards Foce and 3600 towards Sampierdarena.
Thanks. So no way they can demolish it and funnel traffic on the existing street network. 80.000 is too much for that.
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Old February 16th, 2011, 12:25 AM   #2276
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italians love that kind of roads. similar is in trieste, although not in the city core.


http://www.panoramio.com/photo/22557806

It looks impressive.
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Old February 16th, 2011, 12:48 AM   #2277
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Thanks. So no way they can demolish it and funnel traffic on the existing street network. 80.000 is too much for that.
Yep. Some time ago they were thinking about a submarine tunnel under the bay to replace the sopraelevata:
http://www.trail.liguria.it/Interventi/tunnel.htm

but I don't think it will be ever built.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hofburg View Post
italians love that kind of roads. similar is in trieste, although not in the city core.

It looks impressive.
I don't know if we "love" it (I personally don't). Problem is that Trieste and Genova are maritime and montainous at the same time, and you don't have many alternatives to build tangenziali in these cases, there's simply no space.
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Old February 16th, 2011, 01:07 AM   #2278
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errore

Last edited by rimorski; May 17th, 2011 at 03:03 PM.
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Old February 16th, 2011, 12:52 PM   #2279
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Sopraelevata Renato Serra

The city of Milano







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Old February 16th, 2011, 01:39 PM   #2280
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post

3. You have this kind of apartment blocks.

Damn, you picked the worst and most famous example of housing in Scampia and one of the 3, 4 worst examples of Italy.

Those are the so-called "Vele" di Scampia, the most notorious complex that is always mentioned when referring to crime problems of that neighbourhood. For the record, the complex has been dismantled quite recently.

BTW, for sure that area offers some of the worst social issues of the country.
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