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Old July 24th, 2012, 06:42 PM   #3781
hofburg
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A23 has far less traffic than A22. therefore it's more pleasant. also, it's not brown.
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Old July 24th, 2012, 06:49 PM   #3782
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Brown?

Anyway, I both enjoy A10 and A22. A10 because I love the bends, the tunnels, bridges and views over Genoa and the sea, and the A22 because of the scenery, full HGV and caravan overtaking ban, so I can get a move on. And going northbound I'm nearly home. Exactly 100 km from Brenner border. This is what I hate about that Turin-Piacenza road, even though its fairly quiet, you are always stuck behind overtaking lorries.
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Old July 24th, 2012, 06:53 PM   #3783
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Road_UK
Brown?
He means brown crashbarriers. A22 has rusty crashbarriers all the way from Modena to the Austrian border, the only motorway in Italy with this feature.
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In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.
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Old July 24th, 2012, 06:55 PM   #3784
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Quote:
Originally Posted by italystf View Post
He means brown crashbarriers. A22 has rusty crashbarriers all the way from Modena to the Austrian border, the only motorway in Italy with this feature.
They are not rusty. They are state-of-the-art, made with a variety of steel that gets that color when exposed, but not because of oxidation or lack of maintenance.
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Old July 24th, 2012, 07:01 PM   #3785
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Actually, they have nearly all been replaced in the last few months, and while they were at it, they carried installing them well into Austria...
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Old July 24th, 2012, 07:09 PM   #3786
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Road_UK
Actually, they have nearly all been replaced in the last few months, and while they were at it, they carried installing them well into Austria...
Two weeks ago I drove between Egna and Bolzano sud and were still brown. Off course I know they're brown on purpose and not because they're old. Such crashbarriers are also used in many national roads in Trentino and Alto Adige.
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“The transponder’s personalised signal would be picked up when the car passed through an intersection, and then relayed to a central computer which would calculate the charge according to the intersection and the time of day and add it to the car’s bill” - Nobel Economics Prize winner William Vickrey, proposing a system of electronic tolling for the Washington metropolitan area, 1959
In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.
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Old July 24th, 2012, 07:13 PM   #3787
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What is Egna again? Neumarkt?
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Old July 24th, 2012, 07:24 PM   #3788
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Road_UK
What is Egna again? Neumarkt?
Yep.
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Old July 24th, 2012, 07:32 PM   #3789
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In my opinion for Südtirol-Alto Adige place names both names should be used in an English phrase, not only the Italian one, as often they are very different (and often the Italian one is recently invented). Or just follow the en.wiki rule: Innichen, but Bolzano.
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Old July 24th, 2012, 07:38 PM   #3790
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I agree. And with a majority of ethnic Tyrolians, Bozen-Bolzano excepted, it would be rude to name it the Italian way only, when placed in a context outside Italy/Tyrol.
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Old July 24th, 2012, 07:40 PM   #3791
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I think either name will do fine, as both are official city names like Brennero, Merano, Trento, Bolzano etc.

It is the same case with Swiss cities, either Visp or Viège, Biel or Bienne, Müster or Disentis will do the job.

Specifically, sud-tyrol is not a German-language area, it is a bi-lingual area like Bruxelles-Brussel and thus EITHER language is fine. Let's not foster anti-Italianism here... It's like the Passo Rombo / Timmelsjöch controversy... useless...
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Old July 24th, 2012, 07:48 PM   #3792
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Disagree. While the subject remains controversial for both sides, and many locals believe that the area shouldn't be Italian in the first place, it is best to use both names, then everyone will be happy.
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Old July 24th, 2012, 07:58 PM   #3793
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In Switzerland if there is a translation of the name in the language of the text, then it's this that is used (so, Geneva in a text written in English, and so on, Genève in a French text, Genf/German and Ginevra/Italian). If the city doesn't have a name in that language, then the local name is used (so, Neuchâtel in French and English texts, but Neuenburg in German ones).

In the case of the bilingual city of Biel-Bienne then often both names are used (with the main language first) - and that could be a way for Bolzano-Bozen.
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Old July 24th, 2012, 08:05 PM   #3794
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Road_UK
I agree. And with a majority of ethnic Tyrolians, Bozen-Bolzano excepted, it would be rude to name it the Italian way only, when placed in a context outside Italy/Tyrol.
In English you should always use the local name if no English exonimus exists. Since those places are in Italy the local name is in Italian.
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In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.
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Old July 24th, 2012, 08:08 PM   #3795
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Sudtirol is just as Tirol as the Tirol in Austria, and the far majority feel Tirolian, more then anything else, whether you like it or not. And the area is multi lingual. Not just Italian.
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Old July 24th, 2012, 08:14 PM   #3796
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Road_UK View Post
Sudtirol is just as Tirol as the Tirol in Austria, and the far majority feel Tirolian, more then anything else, whether you like it or not. And the area is multi lingual. Not just Italian.
It doesn't matter how people feel, but whose national state give them passports, health care, education, an ID
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Old July 24th, 2012, 08:19 PM   #3797
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Road_UK View Post
Sudtirol is just as Tirol as the Tirol in Austria, and the far majority feel Tirolian, more then anything else, whether you like it or not. And the area is multi lingual. Not just Italian.
And it's not just German.
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Old July 24th, 2012, 08:21 PM   #3798
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Never said that.
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Old July 24th, 2012, 08:29 PM   #3799
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I never write Pola, Fiume and Capodistria in the international forum even if I use them while speaking Italian because they aren't local names anymore. For the same reason I don't expect Bozen, Meran and Bruneck written here, even if German speaker use them.
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“The transponder’s personalised signal would be picked up when the car passed through an intersection, and then relayed to a central computer which would calculate the charge according to the intersection and the time of day and add it to the car’s bill” - Nobel Economics Prize winner William Vickrey, proposing a system of electronic tolling for the Washington metropolitan area, 1959
In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.
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Old July 24th, 2012, 08:31 PM   #3800
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