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Old October 20th, 2017, 07:25 AM   #9901
Coccodrillo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by g.spinoza View Post
I think they are not completely synonyms, you can use "valico" also for tunnels, in general it has more the sense of "going to the other side" not necessarily on a mountain saddle.
Yes, "valico" is also used for border crossings (valico di Chiasso).

"Sella" is usually used where there is a watershed, but where it is not evident as the two valleys loose height slowly, like between Toblach (Mediterranean basin) and Innichen (Black Sea basin). Here the watershed is at around 1220 m above sea level, but the valley floor is quite flat: the section above 1000 m on both sides of this saddle is around 45 km long and you don't clearly notice the differences in height.

To compare, a similar distance (by road) links Wassen and Faido (both around 900 m) via the Gotthard pass (2106 m).

https://www.google.ch/maps/place/390...289403!5m1!1e4

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toblacher_Feld

https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sella_di_Dobbiaco

Another saddle is near Santa Maria Maggiore:

https://www.google.ch/maps/@46.13842.../data=!5m1!1e4

Then there are absolutely unnoticeable watersheds on plains, like between Po and Adige rivers:

https://www.google.ch/maps/@45.00603.../data=!5m1!1e4
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Old October 20th, 2017, 11:02 AM   #9902
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coccodrillo View Post
"Sella" is usually used where there is a watershed, but where it is not evident as the two valleys loose height slowly, like between Toblach (Mediterranean basin) and Innichen (Black Sea basin).
Not necessarily.
"Sella di Corno" is an Apennine pass along the SS17 road that separates the Tiber basin (western Med) from the Aterno-Pescara basin (eastern Med).
Whilst on the southeastern side (Aterno basin) there's a relatively gentle slope, going north-west (Tiber basin) one descends quickly and steeply into the bottom of the Velino valley (the Velino is a sub-tributary of the Tiber).
The highest point along the route (right on the watershed) is very evident.
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Old October 20th, 2017, 11:16 AM   #9903
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Yes, usage of these terms is not unambiguous.
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Old October 20th, 2017, 12:19 PM   #9904
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SS 640 Agrigento-Caltanissetta

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Old October 22nd, 2017, 07:36 PM   #9905
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2x3 expansion of A4 between Gonars and Palmanova i/c with A23 has started today.
http://www.udinetoday.it/cronaca/lav...palmanova.html
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Old October 23rd, 2017, 11:34 AM   #9906
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what about Portogruaro-Noventa di Piave section? Is it started yet?
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Old October 23rd, 2017, 01:44 PM   #9907
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keber View Post
what about Portogruaro-Noventa di Piave section? Is it started yet?
Nope, we don't even know when it will start.
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In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.
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Old October 29th, 2017, 11:54 PM   #9908
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Today I was driving to Genova (hi from there and I was quite surprised by speeding of pretty large amount of cars. I was driving with cruise control a little bit above 130 but many cars (about one fifth) were driving considerably faster, some at least 30 km/h more. Is Tutor system still in function or has large tolerances?
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Old October 30th, 2017, 12:23 AM   #9909
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Quote:
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Today I was driving to Genova (hi from there and I was quite surprised by speeding of pretty large amount of cars. I was driving with cruise control a little bit above 130 but many cars (about one fifth) were driving considerably faster, some at least 30 km/h more. Is Tutor system still in function or has large tolerances?
Not every stretch of Italian motorways has Tutor.
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In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.
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Old October 30th, 2017, 12:29 AM   #9910
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I know, but A4 Padova-Brescia has it. And A7 over Apenines too. But there was no difference to other sections when observing speeders.
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Old October 30th, 2017, 12:58 AM   #9911
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The tolerance is 5%, so 136.5 km/h.

Probably locals know the exact stretches with section control.
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“The transponder’s personalised signal would be picked up when the car passed through an intersection, and then relayed to a central computer which would calculate the charge according to the intersection and the time of day and add it to the car’s bill” - Nobel Economics Prize winner William Vickrey, proposing a system of electronic tolling for the Washington metropolitan area, 1959
In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.
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Old October 30th, 2017, 08:48 AM   #9912
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A7 and A12 are all limited to much less than 130 in Liguria though.

Some stretches of the A7 are limited to 90 IIRC.
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Old October 30th, 2017, 08:55 AM   #9913
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Quote:
Originally Posted by narkelion View Post
A7 and A12 are all limited to much less than 130 in Liguria though.
Yeah.
The speed limit on the A7 from Serravalle to Genoa Bolzaneto is 60 km/h.
If you're a good driver and decide to ignore the limit you should be able to cruise at 80 - 90 km/h.
In my opinion it is absolutely impossible to drive any faster.
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Old October 30th, 2017, 09:56 AM   #9914
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In Italy we have a large abuse of speed limitations because of other reasons than presente danger.
On motorways speed limit below 130 km/h shall be always temporary, using temporary signeage. So, when the reason for the speed limit is no more present, the speed limit is set to normal conditions. In this way drivers can recognize that a speed limit, when placed, it’s for a good reason, an will comply easier.
If the speed limit can’t be temporary, within a reasonable time, depending on the reason, the road MUST be upgraded to fulfill the requirements for the normal speed limit. If not, no more toll shall be withdrawn.
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Old October 30th, 2017, 10:03 AM   #9915
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Speed limit on A7 curvy section in direction of Genova is mostly 80-90 km/h, even 100 km/h and only really close to Genova it can drop to 60 km/h. But even those speed limits are too high. So can drive faster if you dare (and most do that) but visibility in many curves is so low that it is unsafe to drive even 10 km/h below official speed limit (in case of stopped vehicle or some other obstacles).
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Old October 30th, 2017, 11:41 AM   #9916
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You drove on the A7 (southbound carriageway) recently, therefore I suppose you're correct.
I thought the whole Apennine chunk from Serravalle to Bolzaneto was 60 km/h, but evidently my memory doesn't serve me right.

But the point is (and I wholeheartedly agree with you) that it is extremely unsafe to drive any faster than, say, 80 km/h.
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Old October 30th, 2017, 12:52 PM   #9917
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A scaffolding collapsed on SR14 near Trieste during works to reinforce a landslide-prone rock wall. A worker was severly injured and it's not known when the road will reopen.


http://www.triesteprima.it/cronaca/c...da-chiusa.html
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In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.
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Old October 30th, 2017, 01:53 PM   #9918
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According to Autovie Venete, A4 between Noventa di Piave and Portogruaro will widened to 2x3 only in 2025-2031 period, for funding reasons.

http://nuovavenezia.gelocal.it/venez...aro-1.16056838
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“The transponder’s personalised signal would be picked up when the car passed through an intersection, and then relayed to a central computer which would calculate the charge according to the intersection and the time of day and add it to the car’s bill” - Nobel Economics Prize winner William Vickrey, proposing a system of electronic tolling for the Washington metropolitan area, 1959
In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.

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Old October 30th, 2017, 05:04 PM   #9919
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Jesus Christ, that's another 14 years.


I recently drove on the SR14 to Trieste. It's a really beautiful coastal road, it's truly a must-see.
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Old October 31st, 2017, 06:29 AM   #9920
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nantro litro View Post
Yeah.
The speed limit on the A7 from Serravalle to Genoa Bolzaneto is 60 km/h.
If you're a good driver and decide to ignore the limit you should be able to cruise at 80 - 90 km/h.
In my opinion it is absolutely impossible to drive any faster.
But is that not an incredibly ancient stretch of road from the 1930s or so??
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