daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Highways & Autobahns

Highways & Autobahns All about automobility



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old July 29th, 2010, 04:31 PM   #1721
-Pino-
Funkin' down the Track
 
-Pino-'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Amsterdam
Posts: 706
Likes (Received): 127

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
The biggest potential for a 150km/h maximum speed, in my opinion, is for the A1 (Milano-Bologna) and the A4 (Torino-Milano-Bergamo), of course outside the tangenziali milanese limits. It will be awesome, 150km/h cars travelling alongside 270 km/h trains all over the Pianura Panda
On an empty A1, A4 or A14 through the Pianura, I can see the point of raising the speed limit. But for large parts of the time, 150 would be over the top on those roads. The difference in speed between cars and trucks would be a point of attention as well. Maybe you'd end up with a dynamic speed limit, with 150 being permitted at night and during other hours with light traffic.

On top of that, I would hope that the 150 kmh speed limit will actually get enforced. I read a hint that drivers would not get demerit points until 210 kmh.
__________________
http://www.brombeer.net/signs
-Pino- no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old July 29th, 2010, 04:47 PM   #1722
Suburbanist
on the road
 
Suburbanist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: the rain capital of Europe
Posts: 27,539
Likes (Received): 21254

Quote:
Originally Posted by -Pino- View Post
On an empty A1, A4 or A14 through the Pianura, I can see the point of raising the speed limit. But for large parts of the time, 150 would be over the top on those roads. The difference in speed between cars and trucks would be a point of attention as well. Maybe you'd end up with a dynamic speed limit, with 150 being permitted at night and during other hours with light traffic.

On top of that, I would hope that the 150 kmh speed limit will actually get enforced. I read a hint that drivers would not get demerit points until 210 kmh.
They will be fined if they exceed 150 + 5% + 10km/h = 157,50 + 10 = 167,50. For that there is a 86 fine. They will get demerit points if they run over 157,50 + 20 km/h = 177,50.

Rules are different for infractions on average speed controls, though (Tutor). Fixed speed controls are not effective, as they have to be ostensibly signed beforehand.
__________________
YIMBY - Yes, in my backyard!
Suburbanist está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old July 29th, 2010, 06:55 PM   #1723
3naranze
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Belluno - I
Posts: 369
Likes (Received): 2

A28 opening soon...

...but not so soon!
A28 will only open next 5 weekends from friday 2 p.m. till sunday 10 p.m. ("working hours") and only to by-pass A4 from A4-A27 junction to portogruaro. this to prevent the mega jam occured last year at quarto d'altino, junction A4-A57.
full opening next september
3naranze no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2010, 09:55 PM   #1724
3naranze
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Belluno - I
Posts: 369
Likes (Received): 2

today opening, but with restrictions. see my masterpiece


Last edited by 3naranze; July 30th, 2010 at 10:01 PM.
3naranze no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 30th, 2010, 10:59 PM   #1725
Verso
Islander
 
Verso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Ljubljana
Posts: 22,089
Likes (Received): 4752

Quote:
Originally Posted by 3naranze View Post
A28 will only open next 5 weekends from friday 2 p.m. till sunday 10 p.m. ("working hours") and only to by-pass A4 from A4-A27 junction to portogruaro. this to prevent the mega jam occured last year at quarto d'altino, junction A4-A57.
But who'll go from Padova to Portogruaro via A28 instead of A4 (Quarto d'Altino)? Will signs for Trieste point to A27 and A28, if congestion at A4A57 gets too big?
Verso no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 31st, 2010, 11:19 AM   #1726
Suburbanist
on the road
 
Suburbanist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: the rain capital of Europe
Posts: 27,539
Likes (Received): 21254

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verso View Post
But who'll go from Padova to Portogruaro via A28 instead of A4 (Quarto d'Altino)? Will signs for Trieste point to A27 and A28, if congestion at A4A57 gets too big?
Maybe... the A28-A27-A4 route will function like a "passante esterno di Venezia" (external Venezia bypass)
__________________
YIMBY - Yes, in my backyard!
Suburbanist está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old July 31st, 2010, 06:16 PM   #1727
Coccodrillo
Moderator
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 7,200
Likes (Received): 768

This detour is useful only when there are huge jams, that is, a few days per year.
__________________
1.6.2016: Basistunnel!

fr Gter die Bahn ~ pour vos marchandises le rail ~ chi dice merci dice ferrovia
Coccodrillo no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 31st, 2010, 06:35 PM   #1728
Verso
Islander
 
Verso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Ljubljana
Posts: 22,089
Likes (Received): 4752

Quote:
Originally Posted by Coccodrillo View Post
This detour is useful only when there are huge jams, that is, a few days per year.
If there're huge jams, it's useful only, if detour is over A57-A27-A28, not Passante di Mestre (A4)-A27-A28. Between A4A27 and A4A57 it's just 6 km.
Verso no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 31st, 2010, 10:01 PM   #1729
3naranze
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Belluno - I
Posts: 369
Likes (Received): 2

last year a 32 km huge jam, under a sunny july saturday, occured at quarto d'altino A4 bottleneck, where A4"passante di mestre/mestre bypass" (3 lanes) and A57"tangenziale di mestre" (2 lanes) merge in A4 (2 lanes) towards trieste and slo/hr. this year, to avoid the same nightmare, police has forced the opening of the A28, in advance of the work's full ending. this time, however, the mega jam occured this early morning at trieste-lisert head toll station: 25 km at 4.30 a.m.. police, for half an hour, permitted free passing for safety reasons. the same at 6.15.
3naranze no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old July 31st, 2010, 10:30 PM   #1730
Suburbanist
on the road
 
Suburbanist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: the rain capital of Europe
Posts: 27,539
Likes (Received): 21254

A few questions about roads in Sicilia

Hi there,

It has been 1 year since I've last been in beloved Sicilia. Last time I was there, some things made me happy, like the full completion of A20 and the progress on construction of A18 between Catania in Siracusa (at least 10 years late).

Now, I have some questions (I was going to make them on Italian forum, but I'll make them here instead so we can discuss and - maybe - bring pictures).

- The A18 near Avola had serious structural problems, mostly unsettled embankments, though being a relatively new "autostrada". Speed was dropped to maximum 70km/h. Have they fixed the problem?

- How is construction of additional sectors of A18 going (or not)? Any estimated date of completion until Modica, at least?

- Last summer I stayed in Marina di Ragusa and travelled - among other destinations - to Caltassineta and Enna. Both trips made me take detours. The SS116 near Gela was closed (here: http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sour...09863&t=h&z=14 ), so I had to take a detours through a picturesque but jammed and somehow dangerous at night with rain road through Butera. I realize the road is complete but a viaduct felt to the ground due to design failure (!!!). Have they replaced that viaduct?

- On the following day, I was travelling to Piazza Armerina (everything was fine) and then to Catania. To do so, I took the SS117 then was planning to take the SP4 until the A19. However, there was a road closure at this point near Grottacalda, where SP4 join SS117 (http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&sour...09863&t=h&z=14). The detour was way shorter than the one through Butera, but the road was damn-narrow and the TIRs never minded it Have they reopened the road (Google Street View will show the road still closed with detour signs).
__________________
YIMBY - Yes, in my backyard!
Suburbanist está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old August 1st, 2010, 12:27 AM   #1731
Eddard Stark
Keep your head
 
Eddard Stark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Bruxelles
Posts: 13,171
Likes (Received): 3845

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verso View Post
If there're huge jams, it's useful only, if detour is over A57-A27-A28, not Passante di Mestre (A4)-A27-A28. Between A4A27 and A4A57 it's just 6 km.
If passante and the first stretch of A4 towards Trieste are blocked the autorities can deviate traffico on the old Tangenziale and from there A27-A28

It's quite a good tool actually: it's like having to completely different tracks forming a sort of 8
Eddard Stark no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 1st, 2010, 06:03 AM   #1732
Verso
Islander
 
Verso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Ljubljana
Posts: 22,089
Likes (Received): 4752

Quote:
Originally Posted by 3naranze View Post
last year a 32 km huge jam, under a sunny july saturday, occured at quarto d'altino A4 bottleneck, where A4"passante di mestre/mestre bypass" (3 lanes) and A57"tangenziale di mestre" (2 lanes) merge in A4 (2 lanes) towards trieste and slo/hr. this year, to avoid the same nightmare, police has forced the opening of the A28, in advance of the work's full ending. this time, however, the mega jam occured this early morning at trieste-lisert head toll station: 25 km at 4.30 a.m.. police, for half an hour, permitted free passing for safety reasons. the same at 6.15.
Trieste-Lisert is a tiny toll station, but 25 km? That's all the way to Palmanova (A4A23). Forget about taking a detour over Gorizia... even if you have a Slovenian vignette. I found a few photos on Il Piccolo.







http://ilpiccolo.gelocal.it/dettagli...ovenia/2216152
Verso no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 1st, 2010, 08:02 AM   #1733
Suburbanist
on the road
 
Suburbanist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: the rain capital of Europe
Posts: 27,539
Likes (Received): 21254

The congestion problem in toll plazas during summer holiday peak times in Italy is aggravated by the fact that the share of cars using automated systems (cards and RFID systems) is far lower, as occasional drivers and international visitors usually don't have them.
__________________
YIMBY - Yes, in my backyard!
Suburbanist está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old August 1st, 2010, 10:00 AM   #1734
x-type
con los terroristas
 
x-type's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Bjelovar [HR]
Posts: 13,474
Likes (Received): 3448

Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
The congestion problem in toll plazas during summer holiday peak times in Italy is aggravated by the fact that the share of cars using automated systems (cards and RFID systems) is far lower, as occasional drivers and international visitors usually don't have them.
but at Lisert nothing helps - that toll plaza is miniature for traffic volumes. last time i passed there i made a jam because it didn't want to accept my card, something blocked. in that moment horrible rain started, the jam happened in a moment!
__________________
Svaki dan sanjam autobahn...
x-type no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 1st, 2010, 03:10 PM   #1735
Eddard Stark
Keep your head
 
Eddard Stark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Bruxelles
Posts: 13,171
Likes (Received): 3845

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verso View Post
Trieste-Lisert is a tiny toll station, but 25 km? That's all the way to Palmanova (A4A23). Forget about taking a detour over Gorizia... even if you have a Slovenian vignette. I found a few photos on Il Piccolo.







http://ilpiccolo.gelocal.it/dettagli...ovenia/2216152
this is indeed ridicolously small
Eddard Stark no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 1st, 2010, 03:51 PM   #1736
Verso
Islander
 
Verso's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Ljubljana
Posts: 22,089
Likes (Received): 4752

Hard terrain, not much space there.
Verso no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 1st, 2010, 04:57 PM   #1737
x-type
con los terroristas
 
x-type's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: Bjelovar [HR]
Posts: 13,474
Likes (Received): 3448

Quote:
Originally Posted by Verso View Post
Hard terrain, not much space there.
but there are much more suitable places to move toll booths - for instance, just after an exit Ronchi. it could easily be done to leave Ronchi - Lisert section under toll.
__________________
Svaki dan sanjam autobahn...
x-type no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 1st, 2010, 04:59 PM   #1738
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,629
Likes (Received): 19424

Nothing the Italian engineers cannot handle.
ChrisZwolle está en línea ahora   Reply With Quote
Old August 2nd, 2010, 02:44 PM   #1739
3naranze
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Belluno - I
Posts: 369
Likes (Received): 2

last year autovie has been fined ( and what a big fine! ) by lacking assistance during the 32 km traffic jam. so this year, when the queue was going to stretch out towards A4-A23 junction at Palmanova, with high risk of accidents, they didn't collect toll fees for half an hour at 4.30. and the same another time in the morning at 6.15. ( while slovenian police continued to check vinjeta sticker on windshields..., says "il Piccolo")
trieste-lisert head barrier is so small because it has been designed in the early '60 (opened in the '66), when europe was divided by iron courtain: at that time what kind of traffic outlook they could ever consider? now traffic outlook is quite different and they should widening(?) or replacing(!) the toll plaza, otherwise every peak of traffic will mean a traffic jam
3naranze no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old August 2nd, 2010, 03:13 PM   #1740
JB Colbert
In the Grid.
 
JB Colbert's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Stuttgart
Posts: 556
Likes (Received): 18

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Nothing the Italian engineers cannot handle.
Thank you for the estimation, Chris!
JB Colbert no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
autobahn, autostrada, highways, italia, italy, motorways

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 08:39 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium