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Old September 12th, 2010, 02:51 PM   #1941
-Pino-
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There is a situation with a 3-laned motorway in the figure, see "installazione a portale su tre corsie". That is indeed one arrow per lane, and that is exactly the problem. Because what you are doing in this type of situation is signposting for the upcoming fourth lane, the off-ramp. So the arrow for the off-ramp is then above the right-hand lane instead of where one would expect it to be, namely to the right of the right-hand lane. In doing so, the signage suggests that the right-hand lane can only be used to take the exit, whilst it can also be used and it will actually be used to stay on the road.

Once there is an off-ramp, you end up in the situations described as "installazione su portale con bandiera" and every lane indeed gets its own arrow, as is shown in the second photo above. The problem is in the AD signs and in ID sign placed just before the start of the off-ramp.
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Old September 13th, 2010, 03:17 AM   #1942
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I was mistaken.

In the figure ''installazione a portale su quattro corsie'' we can have:

1) 4 lanes
2) 4 lanes + off-ramp

In the first case signal used is "preavviso" (see 246 art. 126) so one arrow one lane; in the second case signal used is ''direzione'' (see 252 art. 128) so 3 arrows 4 lanes and one arrow for the beginning of off-ramp. This because arrows on signals have to stay in the middle of the lane (tabella II.25 dell'art 128 del regolamento di attuazione del codice della strada: ''la punta delle frecce deve coincidere sensibilmente con l'asse delle corsie'') and arrows of the off-ramp have to stay where there is the beginning (or a little before) of the broken line (so over the right-hand lane), see:



By the way IMHO law is not clear: in the figures is not clear if there are 3 lanes + 1 off ramp.

For example, here:



ok 3 lanes but 2 lanes+off-ramp or 3 lanes?

Last edited by lucaf1; September 13th, 2010 at 04:02 AM.
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Old September 13th, 2010, 07:39 AM   #1943
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If you pay attention, you will notice that the first sign directs people heading to the exit to the right lane, people travelling onward to the central and right lanes. Further on, another sign indicates the exit. That is the reasoning - but it is messy nonetheless -.
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Old September 13th, 2010, 01:20 PM   #1944
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hofburg View Post
I exagerated of course, but difference is pretty big. but mostly due to good motorways.
I don't know... there is huge difference between superstrade: you can find wide ones and well maintened, and narrow ones with bad maintenance
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Old September 13th, 2010, 09:56 PM   #1945
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A21 Alessandria - Tortona

A short section of Autostrada A21 between Alessandria and Tortona.

route:


1.
image hosted on flickr

ch 852 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

2. Alessandria-Ovest
image hosted on flickr

ch 853 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

3.
image hosted on flickr

ch 854 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

4.
image hosted on flickr

ch 855 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

5. Alessandria-Est
image hosted on flickr

ch 856 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

6.
image hosted on flickr

ch 857 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

7.
image hosted on flickr

ch 858 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

8.
image hosted on flickr

ch 859 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

9.
image hosted on flickr

ch 860 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

10.
image hosted on flickr

ch 861 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

11.
image hosted on flickr

ch 862 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

12.
image hosted on flickr

ch 863 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

13.
image hosted on flickr

ch 864 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

14.
image hosted on flickr

ch 865 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr

15.
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ch 866 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr
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Old September 13th, 2010, 10:52 PM   #1946
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I really like gantries over this motorway. Pictures - perfect as usual
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Old September 13th, 2010, 10:54 PM   #1947
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Quote:
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A21 Alessandria - Tortona
14.
image hosted on flickr

ch 865 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr
While interesting overhead signage constructions, is really necessary to put such expensive things for just two ordinary signs?
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Old September 14th, 2010, 01:00 AM   #1948
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Quote:
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While interesting overhead signage constructions, is really necessary to put such expensive things for just two ordinary signs?
Italians are fond of design.

The L'Austostrade per l'Italia wanted to make a showcase for "this is your toll money being invested in a highway better than French ones" (they used to have an area on their website dedicated to promote comparisons of toll prices and amenities with other privatized systems, French were the favorite picks for that).
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Old September 14th, 2010, 01:29 AM   #1949
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today ANAS has published in the Official Journal details for the provision of infrastructures of ''free-flow'' system
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Old September 14th, 2010, 11:43 PM   #1950
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Quote:
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The L'Austostrade per l'Italia wanted to make a showcase for "this is your toll money being invested in a highway better than French ones"
Investing into longer and wider exit lanes instead into big portal constructions wouldn't harm, also.
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Old September 15th, 2010, 03:18 PM   #1951
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Quote:
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Investing into longer and wider exit lanes instead into big portal constructions wouldn't harm, also.
Agreed 110%. But their cost is on a higher magnitude than fancy signposts and sing portals.
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Old September 15th, 2010, 07:32 PM   #1952
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Quote:
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Investing into longer and wider exit lanes instead into big portal constructions wouldn't harm, also.
like they are not doing it...every single third/fourth lane means the entire system is upgraded

Right now there are plans for these upgrades on most of the network
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Old September 15th, 2010, 11:51 PM   #1953
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like they are not doing it...
Eddard, non sempre si può tradurre letteralmente dall'italiano!

Per dire "in bocca al lupo" che avresti scritto? "In the mouth of the wolf"?
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Old September 16th, 2010, 08:44 AM   #1954
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Eddard, non sempre si può tradurre letteralmente dall'italiano!

Per dire "in bocca al lupo" che avresti scritto? "In the mouth of the wolf"?
vabbè mi è scappato...e pensare che ho pure la moglie ammerigana
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Old September 16th, 2010, 01:54 PM   #1955
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Ma sì... ti ho beccato solo perchè questa era troppo succulenta!
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Old September 16th, 2010, 02:24 PM   #1956
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parlare inglese, per favore
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Old September 16th, 2010, 03:29 PM   #1957
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Your forgot to write "Per San Vicente de Montalto" (Sant Vicenç de Montalt, town in Spain)
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Old September 16th, 2010, 04:25 PM   #1958
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Quote:
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parlare inglese, per favore
Sorry! I was telling Eddard Stark that it's not always possible to translate literally from Italian language to English.
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Old September 17th, 2010, 12:27 PM   #1959
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Video: A7 Tortona - Milano

My latest video from Italy:

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Old September 17th, 2010, 03:20 PM   #1960
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And Netherlanders united in the end.

Typically Italian, many drivers don't want to move away from the middle lane onto empty right one.
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