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Old May 18th, 2012, 04:29 AM   #781
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Quote:
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The principle that every traffic can run faster if it is completely segregated from everything else.
Lost in the '50s?
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Old May 18th, 2012, 02:27 PM   #782
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Lost in the '50s?
Well it seems that Suburbanist just cant accept compromises and love shiny stuff to much.
In a real life, when you can get 90% of effect for 50% of cost, you will go for it, while Subrubanist will pursue 100% effect for 100% of cost, just for shininess...
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Old May 18th, 2012, 09:55 PM   #783
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Graubünden & Rhätische Bahn are actively promoting the additiom to the UNESCO world heritage of the Albula and Bernina railway lines. After the Google Street view from the train you can now take an online walk along both lines from Thusis to Tirano. The real time video of the 36 hour walk is uploaded on a special website.
http://www.webwandern.ch/

The route of the walk is along regular foot paths along the railway lines. And between Preda and Spinas, where the train uses the Albula tunnel the video over the mountain.
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Old June 3rd, 2012, 08:22 PM   #784
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Today another negative record may have been reached: out of 14 trips scheduled to be done with the ETR 470 Pendolino, only two were run with that type of train. A third trip was canceled because the train broke down en route.

This means that out of 9 trainsets, one was in service, one broke down when running, and the other 7 were out of use for various kinds of failures.
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Old June 3rd, 2012, 10:12 PM   #785
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coccodrillo View Post
Today another negative record may have been reached: out of 14 trips scheduled to be done with the ETR 470 Pendolino, only two were run with that type of train. A third trip was canceled because the train broke down en route.

This means that out of 9 trainsets, one was in service, one broke down when running, and the other 7 were out of use for various kinds of failures.
cant blame Switzerland trying to get rid of them. Piece of junk...
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Old June 3rd, 2012, 11:12 PM   #786
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It's also lack of maintenance from Trenitalia, which owns 5 of these trains. SBB owns 4 trains, but they work better and run more often than the identical Trenitalia's sets. Although they are still unreliable and of expensive maintenance.
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Old June 3rd, 2012, 11:40 PM   #787
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How are the ETR 600 and ETR 610 (New Pendolino) doing now that they're no longer owned by Cisalpino, but by SBB and Trenitalia instead. Are these trains reliable, or are they just as worthless as their predecessor, ETR 470?
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Old June 4th, 2012, 12:27 AM   #788
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They are better, and SBB is even considering to order more of them (it's an option, not a certitude, and don't ask anything about that - I don't know more).

By the way they are still owned by Cisalpino AG (but they are managed as two indipendent fleets with two different owners) for legal reasons: the original contract with the guarantee was made by Cisalpino, that will continue to own the vehicles for a certain time. The ETR 470 instead have been split between SBB (trains 0, 2, 3, 5, 9) and Trenitalia (trains 1, 4, 6, 7, 8).

(train 0 is the 3-car prototype, never used in revenue service, apparently now partly owned by SBB)
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Old June 4th, 2012, 07:10 AM   #789
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coccodrillo View Post
By the way they are still owned by Cisalpino AG (but they are managed as two indipendent fleets with two different owners) for legal reasons: the original contract with the guarantee was made by Cisalpino, that will continue to own the vehicles for a certain time. The ETR 470 instead have been split between SBB (trains 0, 2, 3, 5, 9) and Trenitalia (trains 1, 4, 6, 7, 8).
The Trenitalia ETR 610 no longer run in Switzerland AFAIK however. The service over the Simplon is done enterily with swiss stock. The service over the Gotthard is mostly done with Swiss ETR 470's, and loco hauled sets, as Trenitalia rarely has more than one of it's 5 ETR 470's in working order.
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Old June 4th, 2012, 10:09 AM   #790
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The service over the Gotthard is mostly done with Swiss ETR 470's, and loco hauled sets, as Trenitalia rarely has more than one of it's 5 ETR 470's in working order.
That's why I said "SBB owns 4 trains, but they work better and run more often than the identical Trenitalia's sets".

Usually SBB uses three sets on trips 13-16, 21-15 and 153-22 (3 sets out of 4*), Trenitalia uses one on trip 12-17-20-25 (1 set out of 5). Trenitalia should use an ETR also on the trip 14-23, but it offer an hauled composition instead. The remaining trip 15-24 is a Swiss conventional train by schedule (Re 484 loco + 6 coaches).

This means that 75% of SBB's ETR 470 are in working order, while available Trenitalia's ETR 470 are only 20% (in these days it's an astonishing 0% are none of them is working).

If trains from Italy are late they might be stopped in Arth Goldau (40 minutes from Zürich), from where they start again to Milano to avoid propagation of delays. This happens nearly daily with trains 12-17 (because they are not so loaded), rarely with trains 20-25 (because they are well loaded), and sometimes with trains 16-21 (usually SBB uses a third ETR if the 16 is late).

*if train 16 is on time, which happens statistically one or two times a month, the set is then used on train 21, so that only one ETR is needed for all 13-16-21-158 trains instead of two
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Old June 4th, 2012, 10:30 AM   #791
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coccodrillo View Post
They are better, and SBB is even considering to order more of them (it's an option, not a certitude, and don't ask anything about that - I don't know more).
According to the Eisenbahn-Reveu 6/2012 it's 1 of 4 options that is considered.

The 4 options:

- Loco hauled trains.

6 sets with a Re 474 locomotive at each end, with 7 intermediate cars max (because of train length restrictions at Milano. They will consist of EC cars plus a EW IV restaurant car that needs to have some modifications. For the Swiss leg of the trip extra cars will be added. For this the SBB has asked Bombardier how much it will costs to retrofit some of the IC Bt driving trailers with the radio control system of the Re 474. So they can form the standard extra capacity sets with EW IV stock.

- Taking options of the ETR 610

There are open options for 8 more ETR 610 sets. Some of them are for a delivery before December 2014, Alstom can deliver them quickly. And without any upgrades or other changes they can put into service directly.

- Using Stadler Rail Flirt EMUs.

In this option the SBB will buy 12 6-car Tilo Flirts, this type already has permission for use in Italy and can be delivered quickly. They will get a more comfortable interior then the current regional Tilo Flirts. After the new High Speed Trains will replace them on the EC services they will go to Tilo to be used on their regular regional services between Ticino and Italy.

- Suspending the Zurich - Milano services from 2014.

This option is the non decision option. I's not actively pursued but it will be the consequence when the board of the SBB doesn't make any decision at all.


The SBB hasn't said which option they prefer, but with all the tests with the Re 474 loco hauled trains this option seems to be the most likely to be chosen right now.
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Old June 4th, 2012, 10:43 AM   #792
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The ETR 610 option is also being evaluated seriously, at least 8 sets, maybe more.

It may be a mixture of the first and second option, considering also that a 7 car ETR 610 would be too small for the Gotthard (at least on weekends and in summer).
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Old June 4th, 2012, 03:32 PM   #793
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Momo1435 View Post
6 sets with a Re 474 locomotive at each end, with 7 intermediate cars max (because of train length restrictions at Milano.
Train length restrictions at Milano, really? Milano Central can't cope with a train longer than that?

Quote:
- Suspending the Zurich - Milano services from 2014.
I assume that is the option that Trenitalia would prefer...
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Old June 4th, 2012, 07:01 PM   #794
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Quote:
Originally Posted by K_ View Post
Train length restrictions at Milano, really? Milano Central can't cope with a train longer than that?
This is what the article says:

"... die miet Rücksicht auf Einschränkungen in der Gleiszuteilung in Milano Centrale nicht mehr als sieben Zwischenwagen aufweisen dürfen."

There are several ways to interpreted this, the Italians bullying the SBB is one of them.
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Old June 4th, 2012, 08:51 PM   #795
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The EC 15-24 (loco+ 6 coaches) is often received or sent from track 2, which is quite short (around 8 coaches and a loco, or 7 coaches and 2 locos).

The 9 coaches ETR 470 are instead forced to use longer tracks, usually those between 4 and 11 (included).
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Old June 5th, 2012, 10:56 AM   #796
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Trenitalia has decided to retire its ETR 470 sets from EuroCity (dis)service probably already some time ago. In December 2009 it promised to have all its 5 trains in running order and to keep one of them in reserve in case of delays, but it has never maintained this promise. In December 2011 Trenitalia promised to make available two trains a day, one for trips 12-17-20-25 and one for trips 14-23.

14-23 last run as ETR on 26th March 2012, and 12-17-20-25 last run regularly as ETR on 30th April 2012. Since then Trenitalia doesn't make available regularly any ETR 470, as since 1st May it only sent an ETR to Switzerland a few times. In the last 36 days, a Trenitalia's ETR worked in Switzerland 7 days of the planned 36, the other days all remained in the depot or shuttled between Milano and the Swiss border at Chiasso (apparently the only working set, number 001, can run under 3 kV DC but no more under 15 kV AC).

Now Trenitalia said officially that it will keep its ETR 470 out of use at least until 30 June, but I suppose forever.

In my opinion this is a deliberate choice, so as to oblige the SBB to use its stock for all Milano-Zürich trains. This would free Trenitalia's ETR 470 for use on Italian national services, either on ESCI/Frecciabianca trains or on Frecciargento/Frecciarossa trains (I know for sure that the conversion of the ETR 470 from 15 kVF to 25 kV has seriously been projected).

Train ETR 470.004 is waiting in a workshop since December 2010 (18 months), while some coaches of trains 006 and 007 are also stored following an accident. The only Trenitalia's 470 "working" sets are number 001, 008, and some coaches from trains 006 and 007 joined together in a single consist.

SBB's trains, number 002, 003, 005 and 009, are all in working order except the one that broke down a few days ago.
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Old June 5th, 2012, 03:22 PM   #797
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Another landlside blocked the Gotthard railway this morning, causing three injuried between workers who were working on this mountain, the same that slided in March blocking the line for 5 days. The line may reopen on Friday.

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Old June 6th, 2012, 05:28 PM   #798
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Gotthard train line cut off for one month

The Gotthard railway line, the main north-south axis through the Swiss Alps, will be shut down for at least a month after a landslide damaged the track near Gurtnellen in canton Uri. Swiss Federal Railways said the site remains unsafe.

The company said on Wednesday the cliff face would probably have to be dynamited as more rocks threaten to come crashing down on the line and the valley below.

Federal Railways spokesman Reto Kormann added making the site secure and clearing the debris would take at least a month, meaning the closure of the line would last as long. Work will include repairing the electric line, the tracks as well as a retaining wall.

Up to 3,000 cubic metres of rock came tumbling down on Tuesday, injuring two workers and carrying away another who is still buried under the debris according to the authorities.

The men were securing the site of a smaller landslide that came down in March, closing the line for five days while other rocks were dynamited and the site cleaned up.

The recovery of the 29-year-old’s body has not been able to get underway due to the instability of the cliff above, where another 500 cubic metres of rock threaten to come down at any time. An unaccompanied sniffer dog was able to find the body’s location on Tuesday.

Disturbances

Rail traffic has been seriously disturbed by the shutdown. Around 4,000 passengers per day usually travel along the Gotthard line.

Travellers from northwestern Switzerland heading south to canton Ticino and Italy have been advised to take trains going through the Lötschberg and Simplon tunnels. Those leaving from Zurich can transfer to buses to get around the accident site, but can also expect to arrive at their destinations up to 90 minutes late.

The Federal Railways is also scrambling to find alternative solutions for up to 1,500 schoolchildren who had booked trips to Ticino for their end-of-year excursions this Friday, according to Kormann.

Cargo traffic is another problem. So far ten goods trains are blocked in Switzerland and another ten in Germany. “We are looking with France and Austria for alternative routes,” said Kormann.

Capacity through the Simplon tunnel in canton Valais is currently restricted because of construction work on the Swiss and Italian sides.

Not unusual

Rockfalls are not unusual in the area, regularly leading to closures of the railway line and the nearby roads. The worst recent accident happened when a bedroom-sized rock came down on the A2 motorway in May 2006, crushing a car heading south and killing its two occupants.

Geologists who had been watching the site said they were surprised by the latest landslide, as well as it size, direction and speed, especially as the cliff had been under constant surveillance.

“We had no way of predicting this latest landslide 30 to 50 metres away
from the previous one,” said Federal Railways Marc Hauser on Wednesday.
“There were no warning signs and no movement of the cliff face.”

Rockfalls should become less of a problem for the railways when the new 57-kilometre Gotthard base tunnel opens in 2016, replacing the current one finished in 1881 and bypassing the danger zone.

http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/swiss_ne...l?cid=32846578
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Old June 6th, 2012, 07:54 PM   #799
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Another picture of the landslide.


http://www.tagesanzeiger.ch/panorama...story/27195023
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Old June 6th, 2012, 11:54 PM   #800
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Around 4,000 passengers per day usually travel along the Gotthard line.
Traffic is around 9.000 people per day, and easily up to 15.000 on peak days (like Fridays and Sundays, Summer, bank holidays, ...). To compare, the Lötschberg has around 7.000, the Brenner 5.000, the Simplon 2.500.
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