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Old March 31st, 2014, 08:36 PM   #1581
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
Not sure I understand the difference…
Well, broken down means the tracks have been removed, while abandoned means there are still track but they're not used anymore. Or so I think.
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Old March 31st, 2014, 09:10 PM   #1582
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I found another abandoned line in kanton Bern.

Sumiswald-Grünen - Huttwil including a short branche line from Sumiswald to Wasen im Emmental.

This line was part of the Ramsei-Sumiswald-Huttwil-Bahn, which became the VHB, then the Regionalverkehr Mittelland and finally the BLS who now operate the S-Bahn train from Bern to Sumiswald. The other parts of the line have gradually been closed down over the last 15 years.

But there still looks to be a future for the line, the Emmentalbahn is working on operating steam trains on the line to stimulate tourism.
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Old March 31st, 2014, 09:26 PM   #1583
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Interesting… Thanks for the information and of course broken up lines, particularly if long, are just as interesting. Some countries (UK, for example) is covered with a large number of abandoned lines. I now see that Switzerland also has some relics.
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Old March 31st, 2014, 09:59 PM   #1584
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In that case, earthJoker already mentioned Hinwil-Bauma, this was part of the Uerikon-Bauma-Bahn. The line started at Uerikon on the shore of the Zürichsee via Bubikon and Hinwil to Bauma.
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uerikon-Bauma-Bahn


Most of the line has been broken up except for the freight line between Bublikon and Wolfhausen and the museum line Hinwil - Bauma. What's interesting is that you usually can track these old railway lines in the landscape, but this line seems to be completely wiped out. You can't trace it on Google Earth for example.


In the same region there were also more narrow gauge tram service. The Forchbahn from Zurich now terminates at Esslingen. But in the past there were several lines running further to Wetzikon, Uster & Männedorf.


Uster–Oetwil-Bahn
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wetzikon-Meilen-Bahn

Wetzikon–Meilen-Bahn
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wetzikon-Meilen-Bahn


Nothing can be seen from these lines, that often run half on the street.
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Old March 31st, 2014, 10:39 PM   #1585
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
Any of you know if there are any abandoned rail lines in Switzerland?
There is an excellent (German) website that documents all completely abanded rail lines in Switzerland, see here.
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Old March 31st, 2014, 11:05 PM   #1586
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There is an excellent (German) website that documents all completely abanded rail lines in Switzerland, see here.
Fantastic! That's exactly the type of information I was looking for. If I'm lucky maybe there is something nearby I can go an see one weekend.
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Old March 31st, 2014, 11:17 PM   #1587
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On an other order of things, Geneva railway station is about to open. They are teasing us passengers by opening parts of it so we can see through now, and it looks goooooooorgeous! I'm so much looking forward the opening!
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Old April 1st, 2014, 10:55 PM   #1588
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From Railway Gazette:

Quote:
http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/i...85-wagons.html

SBB orders 485 wagons
01 Apr 2014

SWITZERLAND: Swiss Federal Railways announced a SFr50m contract for Slovakian company ŽOS Trnava to supply 485 wagons to replace its infrastructure maintenance fleet on March 31.

The order covers:
  • 70 twin-axle hopper wagons;
  • 140 bogie hopper wagons;
  • 50 tipping wagons with high sides;
  • 25 tipping wagons with low sides;
  • 50 bogie sleeper wagons;
  • 150 twin-axle wagons
Deliveries are scheduled to run from May 2015 to October 2016. The new wagons will replace existing vehicles which have an average age of 40 years.
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Old April 1st, 2014, 11:14 PM   #1589
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
Had I never seen a map of Switzerland, I might, after reading this, think that Geneva has very poor connections.
And on the opposite side, if you look at a topographic map of Switzerland, you might, after reading this, think that Ticino has very good connections, especially after the GBT opening. On a political map it might no be very obvious, but in a topographic map you can see that both cantons are equally isolated from the rest of the country.

I would rather invest in a new Lausanne-Fribourg-Bern line than throw any more money in trans-european or alpine projects
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Old April 1st, 2014, 11:17 PM   #1590
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Quote:
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I would rather invest in a new Lausanne-Fribourg-Bern line than throw any more money in trans-european or alpine projects
The problem is that Switzerland locked itself into expanding Transalpine capacity as it voted off cheaper alternatives, namely twinning the Gotthard road tunnel (which is partially excavated), the Simplon pass and the Bellinzona-Chur route via San Bernardino pass.

So CH negotiated with EU to build these rail links in lieu of extended road capacity. As part of the free movement agreements and free trade agreements, CH can't simply tell Germany <=> Italy trucks to detour via France or Austria.
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Old April 1st, 2014, 11:22 PM   #1591
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What are chances of some upgrades to the (Goeschenen)-Andermatt-Brig sector of RMB, with conversion to standard gauge, as to allow through trains coming from kanton Uri to reach Valais faster?
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Old April 2nd, 2014, 07:50 AM   #1592
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None.

(it's MGB, not RMB, by the way)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vaud View Post
And on the opposite side, if you look at a topographic map of Switzerland, you might, after reading this, think that Ticino has very good connections, especially after the GBT opening. On a political map it might no be very obvious, but in a topographic map you can see that both cantons are equally isolated from the rest of the country.

I would rather invest in a new Lausanne-Fribourg-Bern line than throw any more money in trans-european or alpine projects
No new infrastructures to Ticino are planned (either directly or via Simplon-Domodossola), cannot be politically justified and are not really economically supportable because other regions of the country have more urgent needs (and I live in Ticino, so I'm not speaking because I'm envious about the money spent on the GBT+CBT). Even a second Gotthard road tunnel will have some difficulty to be approved by voters.

Some good rail connections might be proposed in Gallarate for Lugano-Wallis/Valais-Vaud trips, but even that is not sure. Beside that, the only other possible improvement may be more fast Bellinzona-Chur buses, but even that is not sure. A more needed improvement in Ticino, but not financed, would be a freight bypass of Bellinzona (with an 8 km tunnel) because the Castione Arbedo-Bellinzona-Giubiasco section is becoming a serious bottleneck.

As I already said, for Ticino a Lugano-Locarno-Meiringen-Interlaken/Lucerne line would have been a better link rather a simple copy (although faster) of the existing line, but now it is too late.
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Old April 2nd, 2014, 08:57 AM   #1593
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Quote:
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What are chances of some upgrades to the (Goeschenen)-Andermatt-Brig sector of RMB, with conversion to standard gauge, as to allow through trains coming from kanton Uri to reach Valais faster?
You do know that it's a cog railway, with several very steep gradients and some very tight corners. "Some Upgrades" won't make it faster especially if you want to convert to standard gauge.

And you have to ask the always important question, is it economically viable? What is the travel market between Uri and Wallis? Is it big enough for an investment to make any sense? And probably even more relevant, will it hurt the current tourist market? Which is the only reason why these kind can exist to this day. Do you really want to stop the Glacier Express running the original complete and slow route from Zermatt to St. Moritz?
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Old April 2nd, 2014, 09:02 AM   #1594
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Ticino will now have good connections to the north of Switzerland, but could use some upgrade for routes to Italy. Major investments in other directions (Graubunden, Valais) are probably not economically viable.
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Old April 2nd, 2014, 09:11 AM   #1595
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Momo1435 View Post
You do know that it's a cog railway, with several very steep gradients and some very tight corners. "Some Upgrades" won't make it faster especially if you want to convert to standard gauge.

And you have to ask the always important question, is it economically viable? What is the travel market between Uri and Wallis? Is it big enough for an investment to make any sense? And probably even more relevant, will it hurt the current tourist market? Which is the only reason why these kind can exist to this day. Do you really want to stop the Glacier Express running the original complete and slow route from Zermatt to St. Moritz?
does it have rack sectors between Andermatt and Brig? I know they have rack segments between Brig and Zermatt and also between Andermatt and Disentis, but I'm not sure about the Andermatt-Brig sector.

They've build the Furka Base Tunnel in the 1980s, that doesn't seem to have killed the touristic traffic, has it? Even the named trains "Glacier Express" run on the tunnel and the old alignment is not a heritage railway with steam locos and vintage cars.
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Old April 2nd, 2014, 01:01 PM   #1596
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The Furka tunnel was just a shortcut, not a gap in the route. It also made it possible to run the Glacier Express the whole year round.

And yes there are several rack parts between Brig and Andermatt, just look at line in Grengiols and Fiesch. And not to mention the very steep line between Göschenen and Andermatt.
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Old April 2nd, 2014, 10:53 PM   #1597
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It's not just the gradients and corners, but the general terrain which is very difficult. The Matterhorn Gotthard Bahn is a high-alpine railway! You can't simply convert it to standard gauge or upgrade it to higher speeds..

Some pictures for those of you who don't know of what we speak:







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Old April 3rd, 2014, 09:50 PM   #1598
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The mountainous terrain is of course the main reason for the steep gradients and the tight corners.

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Old April 3rd, 2014, 11:05 PM   #1599
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
What are chances of some upgrades to the (Goeschenen)-Andermatt-Brig sector of RMB, with conversion to standard gauge, as to allow through trains coming from kanton Uri to reach Valais faster?
I would rather like to see an underground station under Andermatt in the old tunnel. The so called "Mini Porta Alpina" would make direct link between the Glacier express and the Inter Regio serving the old line possible. The lift would be about 130 Meters. IMO much more practical than the original Porta Alpina idea.
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Old April 4th, 2014, 01:13 PM   #1600
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Quote:
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I would rather like to see an underground station under Andermatt in the old tunnel. The so called "Mini Porta Alpina" would make direct link between the Glacier express and the Inter Regio serving the old line possible. The lift would be about 130 Meters. IMO much more practical than the original Porta Alpina idea.
Göschenen - Andermatt on The MGB is only 10 minutes. I don't think that building a station in the Gotthard tunnel would speed things up enough to warrant the investment...
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