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Old June 22nd, 2014, 08:38 PM   #1801
quimporte
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Hey guys,

As I’m new to this thread, I don’t know if someone has already answered that very, very, very specific question:

When coming from Geneva, immediately after the Denges-Echandens station, there’s a junction for the trains to Yverdon. At that specific location, I identified a new switch, the beginning of a potential third railway in direction of Geneva, between the existing two railways and the freeway. Does anyone know something about it?

The new switch doesn’t appear yet on Google maps, but that’s the place wehre I saw it: https://maps.google.ch/maps?q=denges...ges,+Vaud&z=21

Is it the beginning of a potential third railway in direction of Geneva, or at least Morges? Given the confined place, it would mean, in my view, the removing of the mountain side platform of the Denges-Echandens station.

Last edited by quimporte; June 22nd, 2014 at 08:47 PM.
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Old June 22nd, 2014, 11:11 PM   #1802
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Does it separate from the Yverdon-Morges chord? If it is that (which is suppose), it is quite certainly a catch point: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catch_points

Basically, it is a switch that leads to nothing, used only to derail a train (which is considered better than a head-on collision with a train on another track).

Not all countries require with the same frequency them on their railways. In Switzerland they are quite rare here another example), while in Italy they are more common.

A typical use of catch points is on single track lines. With these switches, at crossing loops two trains can enter the station at the same time without the danger of a head-on collision if one cannot brake (not that a derailment is safe...).

Sometimes catch points are even simpler, even just a movable section on one of the two rails. You can see some examples on Wikipedia.
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Old June 23rd, 2014, 01:02 AM   #1803
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coccodrillo View Post
Does it separate from the Yverdon-Morges chord? If it is that (which is suppose), it is quite certainly a catch point: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Catch_points

Basically, it is a switch that leads to nothing, used only to derail a train (which is considered better than a head-on collision with a train on another track).

Not all countries require with the same frequency them on their railways. In Switzerland they are quite rare here another example), while in Italy they are more common.

A typical use of catch points is on single track lines. With these switches, at crossing loops two trains can enter the station at the same time without the danger of a head-on collision if one cannot brake (not that a derailment is safe...).

Sometimes catch points are even simpler, even just a movable section on one of the two rails. You can see some examples on Wikipedia.
Oh, OK. So I guess you’re right. It exactly looks like that:



The main line on the drawing would symbolize the mountain side railway linking Geneva to Lausanne, and the siding the beginning of the line in direction of Yverdon. The only thing is that the trains are going in the opposite direction than the one indicated on the drawing. So, if a train follows the green arrow, it would be got off the rails before a hypothetical collision with a train coming from Geneva (from the left).

Crazy. I never heard of that. But if that happens one day, I’m pretty sure that all the people wating on the platform at that moment would be crushed and die. The concept doesn’t look very safe.

Thanx for the explanation.

Last edited by quimporte; June 23rd, 2014 at 01:11 AM.
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Old June 25th, 2014, 05:22 PM   #1804
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From London SE1. The news takes place in London, but contains famous Swiss icon:

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http://www.london-se1.co.uk/news/view/7669

Swiss Railway Clock installed at Borough Market as Olympic legacy
Wednesday 25 June 2014






Swiss ambassador Dominik Furgler addresses guests at the unveiling ceremony


Underneath the clock a plaque records the gift to the people of Southwark

Two years after Bankside hosted the House of Switzerland during the Olympic and Paralympic Games, a Swiss Railway Clock has been installed in Borough Market as gift to the people of Southwark

During the summer of 2012 more than 250,000 people visited the House of Switzerland, the national hospitality centre that showcased contemporary Swiss cuisine, design, music and tourism activities during the Olympics and Paralympics.

The house was based at Glaziers Hall, The Mug House pub, Southwark Cathedral's Millennium Courtyard, Cathedral Square, and La Cave restaurant during the Paralympics.

Now Swiss watchmaker Mondaine has given Southwark one of its clocks based on the design seen at every railway station in Switzerland.

The clock was blessed on Wednesday morning by the Dean of Southwark, the Very Revd Andrew Nunn, and unveiled by the Mayor of Southwark Cllr Sunil Chopra and Dominik Furgler, ambassador of Switzerland to the UK.

"I am delighted that Borough Market will have a new Swiss ingredient to add to its rich existing mix," said Dominik Furgler.

"The railway clock is an iconic design that combines classic style with effective public service.

"I am sure it will become an integral part of the market's rhythm and routine, as well as an enduring reminder of the friendship between Switzerland and Southwark built up over the London 2012 Olympic and Paralympic Games."

Cllr Dora Dixon-Fyle, Southwark Council's cabinet member for adult care, arts and culture, said: "Southwark was very proud to be able to host the House of Switzerland during the London 2012 Games and would like to thank the embassy for gifting the borough with such a wonderful Swiss railway clock.

"I'm sure it will quickly become a centrepiece of Borough Market, and will also act as a great legacy of such a special year for London in both sports and culture."

Borough Market managing director Keith Davis said: "The market is a 24-hour operation, so the clock will get no shortage of use: from visitors to the restaurants in the evening, the wholesalers through the night and the bakers in the very early morning, before the retail market begins to set up and the shoppers start to arrive."

Writer Diccon Bewes, who remarked that "punctuality is a national pastime" in Switzerland, reminded guests that 26 June 2014 will be the 151st anniversary of the first Thomas Cook tour of Switzerland which began at nearby London Bridge Station.

To coincide with the installation of the clock, posters designed by students of Camberwell College of Arts and the Zurich University of the Arts are on display in the Market Hall at Borough Market. The exhibition will move to Southwark Council's Tooley Street offices later this year.
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Old June 25th, 2014, 07:51 PM   #1805
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
What are chances of reopening the French sector of the railway going on the southern bank of Lac Lman?
Found it back, here's the number of commuters in the region:

[IMG]http://i43.************/35hijoz.png[/IMG]

Arrows pointing to the left: Arrivals
Arrows pointing to the right: Departures

For example, the wide grey line linking Geneva to Vaud, means that +20,000 commuters go from Vaud to Geneva.

As you can see, the relation between Geneva and Valais is absolutely negligible
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Old June 29th, 2014, 12:33 PM   #1806
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There is not much Geneva-Valais traffic, but still it would be nice to reopen that line. The right of way is still here, as is most of the track...

Quote:
Originally Posted by quimporte View Post
Crazy. I never heard of that. But if that happens one day, I’m pretty sure that all the people wating on the platform at that moment would be crushed and die. The concept doesn’t look very safe.

Thanx for the explanation.
You are welcome.

Here another clear example. It is at Bignami terminus station of automatic Milan metro line 5. Trains on this line run on the right, but the same track is also used by trains maneuvering in the depot. With this catch point, a train can maneuver (guided manually) on the track without risking to start running on the mainline, where a train might be coming. Crashing an empty train there would not be nice but likely less disruptive than having a head-on collision between that train and a train full of passengers coming from the other direction.

I took the photo from the platform edge. As I said, this is the terminus station, so trains usually arrive and depart from the platform I am on, while depot movements are done on the other plarform on my left. The catch point is pointing on the tunnel wall, which is the standard position for these switches.

[IMG]http://i57.************/scgjs9.jpg[/IMG]
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Old July 3rd, 2014, 10:54 AM   #1807
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From Rail Journal:

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http://www.railjournal.com/index.php...ml?channel=542

SBB orders Harsco catenary maintenance vehicles
Wednesday, July 02, 2014



SWISS Federal Railways (SBB) has awarded Harsco a SFr 100m ($US 113m) contract to supply 59 catenary maintenance and renewal vehicles, which will replace older units and expand the fleet to meet future maintenance requirements.

The project will be managed by Harsco Rail Europe, which is based in Ratingen (Germany), and will involve several Swiss companies that are supplying maintenance equipment for the Gotthard and Ceneri base tunnels, including ABB, Railtec Nystems, Nencki, Ferriere Cattaneo and Joseph Meyer.

The new vehicles will be delivered between March 2016 and September 2017, and will be used across Switzerland.

Last October SBB awarded Harsco a contract to supply 31 Utility Track Vehicles (UTVs), including 13 powered units, for maintenance in the Gotthard and Ceneri base tunnels. MTU announced on July 1 that it has received a contract to supply 700kW underfloor powerpacks for the 13 powered vehicles based on the 12-cylinder MTU 12V 1600 R80L diesel engine.
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Old July 6th, 2014, 11:15 AM   #1808
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Some photos taken yesterday on the Mesolcina railway.

Tracks around Roveredo (here: http://goo.gl/maps/QhYjc) have already been removed, but the other sections of the line are still in place. The section south of there will be soon demolished.

Looking southwards.

[img]http://i59.************/21ajmgw.jpg[/img]

Looking northwards.

[img]http://i60.************/214s07t.jpg[/img]

From an overpass. The road (A13 expressway) will be replaced by a tunnel in 2016, so it will be demolished as will the railway, so that this part of the village can be rebuild (a place, trees, and so on).

[img]http://i60.************/5vrnk0.jpg[/img]

One of the three Moesa river bridges.

[img]http://i58.************/10dd1xx.jpg[/img]

The new terminus of the line. It is the southernmost point of the northern half of the line. This section of the line is just 4 km long, but it has a depot where trains are stored. Trains may run there until 2020, end of the federal concession on the infrastructure.

The photo has been taken here: http://goo.gl/maps/eJKxA

Tourists on this line averaged 2.000 to 4.000 trips a year, with two thirds of the line closed down traffic will drop significantly. The original line was 31,3 km long. It is not officially known what will happen after 2020, but a complete demolition is very likely.

[img]http://i57.************/6opf5u.jpg[/img]

Previous posts about this railway are here:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpo...&postcount=672
The second photo shows the depot which will remain in place, the othes photos shows sections that have already been dismantled or will be soon removed. The two red-white railcars were built for the Appenzeller Bahnen and will likely be demolished or sold (at least one), because they were not built for this line, while the green-white railcar was built for the nearby Biasca-Acquarossa line and will be preserved. The last photo is the bridge now without tracks shown above.

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpo...postcount=1314
Here is again the depot, and two photos of tracks around Castione-Arbedo, which will be soon removed to make place for a regional bus station and a park&ride.
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Old July 6th, 2014, 11:18 PM   #1809
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The Swiss side of the Mendrisio-Varese railway ends abruptly just before the border.

In the following map, the border is along the vertical road-footpath (which, itself, is in Switzerland): http://map.geo.admin.ch/?X=77405.13&...opo.swissimage

You can find traces of a tunnel and a bridge on the Italian side, but just after the border there is nothing.

[IMG]http://i62.************/e00c4j.jpg[/IMG]

The fences in the background circle the work site, after them there is the footpath, and then the border.

[IMG]http://i57.************/154a96s.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i60.************/2mdi9w2.jpg[/IMG]

The overhead line ends some hundred metres before the end of the tracks.

[IMG]http://i58.************/29nh639.jpg[/IMG]

The line here is complete, but leads to nothing. The view is looking towars the Gotthardbahn, behind me there is no passenger station nor sidings, so for the time being these two tracks will be useless. On the right there is an industrial siding and the Valmorea line (which sees a few tourist trains a year).

[IMG]http://i60.************/23vni9s.jpg[/IMG]

The line will open to passenger trains next December until Stabio, which is around one kilometre north of the last photo. The Italian side of the line might open in 2016 (but I don't think so).
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Old July 6th, 2014, 11:28 PM   #1810
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Some videos from Swiss state television, in French. I have seen only the third one for now, I liked it, but I cannot judge the others.

The Great St Bernard tunnel, in a video from 1962:

http://www.rts.ch/archives/tv/divers...des-alpes.html

Then the Mont Blanc tunnel, also in 1962:

http://www.rts.ch/archives/tv/divers...ont-blanc.html

The first proposals for the Gotthard base tunnel, in a video from 1972. At that time it was planned to be 45 km long, with the northern portal in Amsteg (where now there is a service access tunnel):

http://www.rts.ch/archives/tv/inform...l-de-base.html

Finally, a description of some rail coaches with rubber wheels instead of steel wheels. They had to reduce their weight from 30 to 13 tonnes, but even witht his reduction, they needed two bogies with 5 axles each instead of just two for heavier coaches with steel wheels.

http://www.rts.ch/archives/tv/inform...s-a-pneus.html
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Old July 10th, 2014, 08:00 PM   #1811
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Old July 13th, 2014, 01:55 AM   #1812
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Swiss trains are efficient, neat and user friendly.

Was in Lausanne last week and did travel through trains.

But they are very expensive. Think normal tickets cost round about twice as in France.....
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Old July 13th, 2014, 04:41 AM   #1813
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ab_ltf View Post
Swiss trains are efficient, neat and user friendly.

Was in Lausanne last week and did travel through trains.

But they are very expensive. Think normal tickets cost round about twice as in France.....
Regular SBB tickets are rather expensive, indeed. No wonder lots of people have a Halbtax pass which gives a 50% discount, but this is probably not very interesting for a tourist.

SBB offers Supersaver tickets which give discounts up to 60%, but for this you are required to book in advance and your ticket is tied to a particular train. Depending on your journey this can work out well (if you like to plan your trip to the hour).
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Old July 13th, 2014, 05:01 AM   #1814
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexNL View Post
Regular SBB tickets are rather expensive, indeed. No wonder lots of people have a Halbtax pass which gives a 50% discount, but this is probably not very interesting for a tourist.

SBB offers Supersaver tickets which give discounts up to 60%, but for this you are required to book in advance and your ticket is tied to a particular train. Depending on your journey this can work out well (if you like to plan your trip to the hour).
Or if it's worth it, get a rail pass if you on vacation there. I did it once and it was worth it every penny to me at least. All other times I book my tickets in advance
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Old July 13th, 2014, 03:44 PM   #1815
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coccodrillo View Post
There is not much Geneva-Valais traffic, but still it would be nice to reopen that line. The right of way is still here, as is most of the track...



You are welcome.

Here another clear example. It is at Bignami terminus station of automatic Milan metro line 5. Trains on this line run on the right, but the same track is also used by trains maneuvering in the depot. With this catch point, a train can maneuver (guided manually) on the track without risking to start running on the mainline, where a train might be coming. Crashing an empty train there would not be nice but likely less disruptive than having a head-on collision between that train and a train full of passengers coming from the other direction.

I took the photo from the platform edge. As I said, this is the terminus station, so trains usually arrive and depart from the platform I am on, while depot movements are done on the other plarform on my left. The catch point is pointing on the tunnel wall, which is the standard position for these switches.
This makes an awful lot of sense once explained. By just looking at the picture I was rather confused.
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Old July 14th, 2014, 06:36 AM   #1816
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexNL View Post
Regular SBB tickets are rather expensive, indeed. No wonder lots of people have a Halbtax pass which gives a 50% discount, but this is probably not very interesting for a tourist. SBB offers Supersaver tickets which give discounts up to 60%, but for this you are required to book in advance and your ticket is tied to a particular train. Depending on your journey this can work out well (if you like to plan your trip to the hour).
Public transport in Switzerland is expensive for occasional travelers, but actually rather cheap for frequent travelers. For example the GA is extremely good value, of a kind you won't find elsewhere, especially since public transport can for many people completely replace a car. (I have never owned a car myself...)
When I'm in a sarcastic mood I just say that it's all a hidden tax on tourists and stupid people.
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Old July 17th, 2014, 12:30 PM   #1817
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From Railway Gazette:

Quote:
http://www.railwaygazette.com/news/n...nd-funded.html

SBB overspend funded
17 Jul 2014

SWITZERLAND: SBB announced on June 30 that it had reached agreement with the Federal Office for Transport over the financing of projected overspends in its infrastructure maintenance budget during the five-year plan period 2013-17.

Faced with increasing traffic volumes, SBB spent SF129m more than anticipated in 2013, and the overspend is projected to continue at SFr150m per year until 2016. Under the agreement, SBB has agreed to cover the extra outlay in 2014-15 through cost savings and increased revenue. The 2016 overspend will be met from the Rail Infrastructure Fund, which will be available to draw on from that year.

Some small upgrading and renewal projects are to be postponed until after 2017, but the ministry says that major projects in the NEAT, ZEB and high speed connections will not be affected, nor will the STEP 2025 package approved by a referendum in February. Both parties insisted that safety and punctuality would remain the top priorities
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Old July 21st, 2014, 09:08 PM   #1818
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexNL View Post
Regular SBB tickets are rather expensive, indeed. No wonder lots of people have a Halbtax pass which gives a 50% discount, but this is probably not very interesting for a tourist.

SBB offers Supersaver tickets which give discounts up to 60%, but for this you are required to book in advance and your ticket is tied to a particular train. Depending on your journey this can work out well (if you like to plan your trip to the hour).
Apart SBB executives, who really knows if the prices are fair or not. Personally, I have a doubt.

The half-fare pass is something interesting. Do you pay half of the price of the ticket if you have the pass, or do you pay twice the price if you don’t have it?

Considering that most of the people that live in Switzerland and take the train quite often, but not every day, have such a half-fare pass, I can’t help but think that it’s rather a disguised tax and not a discount card.

SBB would have gone bankrupt long ago if most of the travelers pay only half of the price – never mind all the owners of general system pass – even if it is a semi-state company.
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Old July 21st, 2014, 09:14 PM   #1819
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Half price means half price!
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Old July 21st, 2014, 11:01 PM   #1820
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Quote:
Originally Posted by quimporte View Post
SBB would have gone bankrupt long ago if most of the travelers pay only half of the price
I doubt it. The number of trips done by travellers without a demi-tarif is really small, and I don't make up the figures, here they are:

[IMG]http://i61.************/2wp5v20.png[/IMG]

Those travellers do around 400km in trips by rail per year.

Compared to those with a public transportation subscription + half-fare, only public transportation subscription or only half-fare, they represent a negligible amount.
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