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Old November 11th, 2011, 02:15 AM   #2621
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Minato ku View Post
For the line 11, I believe they wait the extension, this extension will double the size of the line and there is several project about the conversion in a steel wheeled line.
That could be......and I say.....could be.....the "MF 2015", or even another stock entirely.
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Old November 11th, 2011, 03:13 AM   #2622
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The work should start in 2013, so I believe we will know the final decision by 2012 or early 2013.
The convertion of the line 11 in a a steel wheeled line is very serious.
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Several MP05 at Gare de Lyon
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Old November 11th, 2011, 03:19 AM   #2623
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Wow, so it is pretty much a "green light" to convert Line 11 back to steel-wheel operation.
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Old November 11th, 2011, 06:06 AM   #2624
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Why do they want to do this?
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Old November 11th, 2011, 07:03 AM   #2625
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Think View Post
Do we have any data of any difference in travel times or frequencies due to the driveless sistem?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Minato ku View Post
-A frequency of 85s instead of 105s.
-30 km/h of average speed instead of 27.4 km/h.
-MP05 have 6% more capacity than the MP89.

This will increase the capacity of the line 1 of more than 25%.
Anyway the real difference will be when all the trains on the line 1 will be driverless MP 05.

Except kids, fans and elders, nobody seem to care.
I think people will care more during and after future labour disruptions. The driverless trains will operate and the driver-dependant trains will stand idle. I expect commuters will appreciate the difference.
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Old November 11th, 2011, 10:32 AM   #2626
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iampuking View Post
Why do they want to do this?
RATP & STIF would like to convert M11 to steel because :
- this line is segregated to other rubber lines (no straight connexion : you have to go through steel lines)
- MF require less energy to move (-25% or -30% approx.)
- line M11 is about to double its lenght : this is a good opportunity.

This conversion is now sure at 95%.
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Old November 11th, 2011, 04:46 PM   #2627
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EDIT

Last edited by HARTride 2012; November 11th, 2011 at 05:03 PM.
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Old November 11th, 2011, 05:07 PM   #2628
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hugues75 View Post
RATP & STIF would like to convert M11 to steel because :
- this line is segregated to other rubber lines (no straight connexion : you have to go through steel lines)
- MF require less energy to move (-25% or -30% approx.)
- line M11 is about to double its lenght : this is a good opportunity.

This conversion is now sure at 95%.
I was about to ask of this. When I looked at the Carto Metro maps, I see no direct link (tunnel) from Line 11 to any of the other rubber-tyred lines (1, 4, or 14). So I was like, "how on earth did they get rubber trains into Line 11?" The only linking tunnel on the maps is from Line 3.

At least with the MP 89CC from Line 1 to Line 4, the trains are transferred via Line 6 (slip ramps between Line 1 & 6 are located at Nation & Etole, and there is a tunnel from Line 6 to Line 4 near Vavin).
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Old November 11th, 2011, 06:12 PM   #2629
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the MP 89 TL (Laussane)
Then I stand corrected ("another") although not per "few" ... I dislike truth being twisted.
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Old November 12th, 2011, 02:19 AM   #2630
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Originally Posted by HARTride 2012 View Post

Wow, so it is pretty much a "green light" to convert Line 11 back to steel-wheel operation.
all metro line should be converted to steel-wheel...the rubber-tyred metro was and still a big miskate
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Old November 12th, 2011, 02:24 AM   #2631
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Disagreeing 101% ... who wants to lose the acquired tranquility to wheels a-screeching and French cuisine tossed onto a diner's lap ... pneumatic traction underground pushes the urban factor all the higher
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Old November 12th, 2011, 02:57 PM   #2632
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MP89 at Chatelet
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Old November 12th, 2011, 07:23 PM   #2633
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That sure is crowded Minato.

MP 89 #20 @ Montparnasse Bienvenue (I only post a link here)
http://youtu.be/_5kE7MBpmFQ
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Old November 13th, 2011, 12:35 AM   #2634
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harrys View Post
all metro line should be converted to steel-wheel...the rubber-tyred metro was and still a big miskate
This maybe not possible in certains lines due to the slope. I don't know if they're great slopes in any wheel line in Paris, but if they exist it's a problem.
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Old November 13th, 2011, 09:59 PM   #2635
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The river valley throughout Paris proper is flat. The old metro tunnels themselves there are quite slopey but not enough to have been obliging pneumatic traction. Pneumatic traction came about due to (a) the Republic's post-WWII quest for modernisation and (b) to increase acceleration and braking capabilities so as to boost line capacities. Meanwhile, conventional-traction capabilities have been improved remarkably although I'd be astonished were its rumbling vibrations ever satisfactorily eliminated.
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Old November 13th, 2011, 10:25 PM   #2636
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Meanwhile, conventional-traction capabilities have been improved remarkably although I'd be astonished were its rumbling vibrations ever satisfactorily eliminated.
Have you tried the TGV lately?

The advantages of pneumatic traction for metros tend to dominate as the size of the metro cars gets smaller. The advantages of steel traction tend to dominate as the size of the metro cars gets larger.
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Old November 13th, 2011, 10:42 PM   #2637
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British Classes 43 and 313 hailing from the 70s outstepped any TGV. As per loading-guage capabilities, take a look below (at my outstanding query).
Quote:
Originally Posted by trainrover View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by trainrover View Post
Aha!
  1. heavy-duty rubber-tyred metro DOES appear possible
  2. Sapporo, being a snowy place like here, has definitely worked at running its trains outdoors COVERED
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Originally Posted by trainrover View Post


How did Sapporo overcome the loading guage of rubber-tyred metro, for its metros appear heavy-duty, e.g., broad cars? I've understood that rubber-tyred metros must limit the weight of trains + passengers, otherwise the tyres wouldn't be capable of all the extra weight that Sapporo's fleets seem quite capable of accommodating.

(Clickable...)


interesting-looking switches/points
At any rate, what Parisian is gonna ride their metros hours on end ... plus the rumbling I was referring to isn't related to passengers' experience either.
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Last edited by trainrover; November 13th, 2011 at 10:53 PM.
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Old November 13th, 2011, 11:27 PM   #2638
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trainrover View Post
The river valley throughout Paris proper is flat.
That is not so relevant. Toulouse is in a flat river valley and the metro has great slopes to take all the advantages of the wheel traction. Whith big slopes you could have deeper tunnels and shallower stations in the same line.

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The old metro tunnels themselves there are quite slopey but not enough to have been obliging pneumatic traction.
That's the relevant question.
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Old November 13th, 2011, 11:37 PM   #2639
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Somebody! tell me the last time Toulouse traipsed about Paris, pleez ... the infrequently-encountered hilliness and tunnels've been around longer than any rubbery wheel underground there
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Old November 14th, 2011, 04:50 AM   #2640
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Franklin D. Roosevelt (I only post a link for this one)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Qx1ALDu42Y

Would anyone know if the Line 9 station will receive a renovation any time soon? Especially since the Line 1 station was completely overhauled.
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