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Old July 7th, 2012, 10:41 PM   #601
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Momo1435 View Post
The 330 km/h runs are just tests, the operational speed of the line will be 250 km/h. And the Railjet will run with it's max. speed of 230 km/h on the line.
Track layout is 300 km/h (therefore test speed 330 km/h) and the RJ could run at 250 km/h as tests have shown (250 km/h + 10 % reserve). At this point it is just not really economical to go faster than 230 on the Westbahn. We'll see what the future brings.
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Old July 7th, 2012, 11:29 PM   #602
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it would be awesome to have a line Budapest-Gyor-Pozsony-Wien-..westbahn..-Salzburg-Munchen-Stuttgart-Paris some day....
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Old July 7th, 2012, 11:44 PM   #603
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Too bad Bratislava is not on the Vienna - Budapest corridor, yes, but this project has no priority at all within Austria.
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Old July 8th, 2012, 12:25 AM   #604
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingNick View Post
Too bad Bratislava is not on the Vienna - Budapest corridor, yes, but this project has no priority at all within Austria.
Do you think it would be better to have a direct Vienna-Budapest HSR or Vienna-Bratislava-Budapest? Similarly, a direct Ljubljana-Budapest HSR will probably never exist, but Ljubljana-Zagreb-Budapest might exist some day.
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Old July 8th, 2012, 01:16 AM   #605
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It's just that there aren't all that many prospective passengers for such international high speed lines... Isn't Paris-London the only high speed line built primarily for cross-border traffic?
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Old July 8th, 2012, 03:10 AM   #606
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Do you think it would be better to have a direct Vienna-Budapest HSR or Vienna-Bratislava-Budapest? Similarly, a direct Ljubljana-Budapest HSR will probably never exist, but Ljubljana-Zagreb-Budapest might exist some day.
Of course it would make much more sense to have Bratislava on the corridor as well. I mean 500.000 people are not that little for European standards. Actually it would not take that much on the Austrian side to upgrade the existing tracks to HSR. Vienna - Hegyeshalom is approved for 140 km/h already and runs pretty straight. Trains to Bratislava also use these tracks till Parndorf where they make a turn to the left. Parndorf - Slovakian border is damn straight and running at 160 km/h. I am pretty sure that all these tracks could be upgraded to 200 km/h. The problem is though what comes behind the Slovakian border. Bratislava got no real connection from the border to their main station hlavná stanica. Trains have to circle around the whole town to get there.

So you got two alternatives in Bratislava:

1) Cross the Danube and dig a tunnel under the whole city to get to the main station somehow. It would be possible, since Vienna has done it was well to connect the new main station with all the relevant railway lines (Lainzer Tunnel), but it costs a shitload of money.

2) Make Petržalka railway station in the south the new station for HS trains between Vienna and Budapest. No idea how good public transportation is there.

A different route on the Austrian side is very unlikely to happen, since the government wants VIE to be on the line between Vienna and Budapest. That's why a link from the eastern railway to the airport is being built right now (pictures if your interested: http://www.bahnforum.info/smf/index.php?topic=144369.0). Further more a connection from the airport back to the eastern railway is needed to achieve the goal mentioned before, but postponed so far. The so called Götzendorfer Spange (red line):

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Old July 8th, 2012, 03:12 AM   #607
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It's just that there aren't all that many prospective passengers for such international high speed lines... Isn't Paris-London the only high speed line built primarily for cross-border traffic?
Hardly anybody would take the train from Paris to Budapest. That is not gonna happen, but in between I see a lot of potential (Vienna - Budapest, Vienna - Munich, Munich - Stuttgart aso).
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Old July 8th, 2012, 03:49 AM   #608
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingNick View Post
The problem is though what comes behind the Slovakian border. Bratislava got no real connection from the border to their main station hlavná stanica. Trains have to circle around the whole town to get there.
I wanted to ask why HSR couldn't go via Marchegg (and continue to Bratislava main station), but then you mentioned the Vienna airport (VIE). But would HS trains really stop already 15 km (or so) after departure from Vienna?
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Old July 8th, 2012, 09:52 AM   #609
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Bratislava could easily be incorporated into a new line, half of that city is on the southern side of the Danube, draw a slightly curved line from VIE to the triple border and there you have it...
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Old July 8th, 2012, 10:01 AM   #610
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verso View Post
I wanted to ask why HSR couldn't go via Marchegg (and continue to Bratislava main station), but then you mentioned the Vienna airport (VIE). But would HS trains really stop already 15 km (or so) after departure from Vienna?
Why wouldn't a HS train stop at such a short distance, it's not like it doesn't happen anywhere else. The ICE from Frankfurt to Collogne also stop at Frankfurt Airport. And the Shinkansen from Tokyo to Osaka has 2 stops within 25 km from Tokyo Station.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
It's just that there aren't all that many prospective passengers for such international high speed lines... Isn't Paris-London the only high speed line built primarily for cross-border traffic?
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Old July 8th, 2012, 01:35 PM   #611
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Verso

I wanted to ask why HSR couldn't go via Marchegg (and continue to Bratislava main station), but then you mentioned the Vienna airport (VIE). But would HS trains really stop already 15 km (or so) after departure from Vienna?
They definitely would, yes. Eventually this could make domestic flights between Vienna and Linz/Salzburg obsolete and attrack new people from the Bratislava area and Hungary.
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Old July 8th, 2012, 06:44 PM   #612
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KingNick View Post
Hardly anybody would take the train from Paris to Budapest. That is not gonna happen, but in between I see a lot of potential (Vienna - Budapest, Vienna - Munich, Munich - Stuttgart aso).
Sure, but how big is a Vienna-Budapest or Vienna-Munich market? I don't know, but I suspect not quite big enough to make it the first priority...

Bratislava is in a commuting distance from Vienna so there is no need for high speed rail there. A proper S-Bahn service would be welcome though, assuming there isn't one already.
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Old July 8th, 2012, 10:18 PM   #613
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Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
Sure, but how big is a Vienna-Budapest or Vienna-Munich market? I don't know, but I suspect not quite big enough to make it the first priority...

Bratislava is in a commuting distance from Vienna so there is no need for high speed rail there. A proper S-Bahn service would be welcome though, assuming there isn't one already.
Vienna - Munich is always full and it occasionally (especially at the end and beginnings of holidays) happens that trains have to be emptied by the police in Vienna as way too many people show up. Same occurred on the Austrian/Hungarian border some weeks ago, as the ÖBB conductor had to kick out quite a few people. MAV apparently is not as strict regarding safety rules. From my personal experience Vienna - Munich is far bigger than Vienna - Budapest though, which is just logical as you got Austria's most important economic areas on that line.

Regional trains are running twice per hour between Vienna and Bratislava (xx:03 to Bratislava-Petrzalka and xx:20 to Bratislava hl.st.). The thing is, if you put Bratislava on the Vienna - Budapest corridor it would no longer be just a commuter link as it is now, but give Bratislava access to western Austria and southern Germany.

Operational wise it would be much smarter to take the route via Parndorf to Bratislava-Petrzalka since this station has capacity left whereas Bratislava hl.st. is clogging already with it's 6 platforms.
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Old July 8th, 2012, 10:40 PM   #614
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Actually, now that Malév is closed and we've lost direct connection with many important destinations the addition of VIE to the stops of the Budapest railjets is a wonderful enhancement of the service.

Unfortunately the bankruptcy of Malév brought on that currently Albania, Transsylvania, Moldavia, Bosnia are not at all accessible by air from any nearby airport, maybe an actual HSR (with no 80 kph limits on most of the stations on the way) and connections from Schwechat would make somewhat up for the loss.


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Old July 8th, 2012, 10:56 PM   #615
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Actually Austrian is flying BUD - VIE three times a day. IMO a HSR connection between Budapest and Vienna would more likely attract people from in between those cities.

New CAT design, btw

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Old July 9th, 2012, 03:04 PM   #616
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Very cool looking. I liked the old design, too.
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Old July 9th, 2012, 04:09 PM   #617
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What are the chances of a higher speed line between Vorarlberg and the rest of the country being built, mainly by straightening up the Arlberg railway and building more tunnels? It is quite unacceptable the minimum travel times of freaking 7 hours between Brengez and Wien with RailJet services, I think.
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Old July 9th, 2012, 04:43 PM   #618
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What are the chances of a higher speed line between Vorarlberg and the rest of the country being built, mainly by straightening up the Arlberg railway and building more tunnels? It is quite unacceptable the minimum travel times of freaking 7 hours between Brengez and Wien with RailJet services, I think.
It would make a lot more sense to speed up Bregenz - München, as that also improves Zürich - München. That together with a reduction on München - Wien might mean that Zürich - Wien becomes quicker via München (and Bregenz)

Building a new Arlberg line would be prohibitively expensive.
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Old July 9th, 2012, 05:48 PM   #619
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
What are the chances of a higher speed line between Vorarlberg and the rest of the country being built, mainly by straightening up the Arlberg railway and building more tunnels? It is quite unacceptable the minimum travel times of freaking 7 hours between Brengez and Wien with RailJet services, I think.
Since around 100 km additional Kilometers of HSR will enter service on this line in December, travel time will be reduced by 30-40 Minutes. Speeding up Innsbruck - Bregenz has no real priority at all, I am afraid, at least not to HSR level. What is being done constantly is upgrading the existing tracks (2nd track where it's missing).
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Old July 9th, 2012, 06:02 PM   #620
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It would make a lot more sense to speed up Bregenz - München, as that also improves Zürich - München. That together with a reduction on München - Wien might mean that Zürich - Wien becomes quicker via München (and Bregenz)

Building a new Arlberg line would be prohibitively expensive.
That would make sense for those going from Bregenz to Vienna, but of how many people are we talking there? I hardly see any demand for that service. But once Munich - Lindau is being electrified (should be around 2016) going from Bregenz to Vienna via Munich should be faster than via Innsbruck, yes. It's just the question who should operate this relation? I see DB doing Zurich - Bregenz - Munich, but there's no way ÖBB would do the same to get to Vienna.
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