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Old February 23rd, 2015, 10:01 PM   #1161
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Photo update

Quote:
Originally Posted by nachalnik View Post
A motorway bridge under construction collapsed yesterday evening and is now blocking the main line between Bruck an der Mur and Graz.

Fortunately nobody was injured.
Just a few minutes before the bridge collapsed two express trains (Zürich-Graz, Graz-Salzburg) passed the site.

More impressions in this video:
http://www.kleinezeitung.at/s/steier...elChannel=4279

News reports (in German):
http://steiermark.orf.at/news/stories/2696008/
http://www.kleinezeitung.at/s/steier...elChannel=4279
Photos:
www.kleinezeitung.at


www.styria-mobile.at



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Old February 23rd, 2015, 10:21 PM   #1162
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Vmax 80 km/h

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Originally Posted by KingNick View Post
That section is far from high speeds though. The section between Bruck and Graz is among the slowest you can find on Austria's main lines.

Just check how curvy the section near the accident site is: https://www.google.at/maps/@47.27840...3905,15z?hl=de
Close to the accident site trains are limited to 80 kmh.
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Old February 24th, 2015, 02:06 AM   #1163
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Jeez that was close. IC 718 passed the bridge at 18:04; ÖBB received the first emergency calls at 18:05.
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Old February 24th, 2015, 09:32 AM   #1164
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Pure speculation, but perhaps the vibrations of that train was the final push that made the bridge collapse?
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Old February 24th, 2015, 05:02 PM   #1165
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sunfuns View Post
This happens when you don't have properly trained engineers… Fortunately at least no one was killed.
Yup lets jump into conclusion because you know it all
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Old March 1st, 2015, 11:42 PM   #1166
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Found this cool video on youtube.
It shows a load test of two new railway bridges last year.
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Old March 2nd, 2015, 12:34 AM   #1167
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Lots of power as well. Some 52,000 bhp.

It is the connection from the airport to the new Hauptbahnhof. By now it is served every two hours by the Vienna - Frankfurt ICE, but there will be a long distance service every 30 minutes from the coming December on.
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Old March 2nd, 2015, 03:29 PM   #1168
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New platform roof in Graz main train station.
Photos by www.pierer.net
Architecture by www.zechner.com











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Old March 19th, 2015, 12:03 AM   #1169
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I passed there a couple of years ago and again last Monday - and this bridge looked the same. When will it be opened? Are there serious plans to double the few remaining single track sections of the Tauernbahn?
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Old March 19th, 2015, 01:28 AM   #1170
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The infamous Angertalbrücke...

When? No idea so far. After the permit has been declared void by the Supreme Administrative Court for a second time in December 2013, we are currently back at step one assessing environmental impacts. In the meantime people living nearby get to enjoy the noise of the old steel bridge. New decisions should happen any day now though.
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Old March 20th, 2015, 11:48 PM   #1171
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Whilst the Karawanks Tunnel for the Autobahn is getting a second tube the corresponding railway tunnel is stripped of one track to increase safety instead of building a second tube.

German source: http://www.ots.at/presseaussendung/O...ahntunnel-bild

Priorities...
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Old March 21st, 2015, 11:53 AM   #1172
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I don't see how removing a track could improve safety. It could instead reduce it. I suppose it's to allow fire-fighters' road vehicles to access the tunnel. But building emergency trains like the LRZ used by SBB and BLS and keeping two tracks would be better than using small road vehicles that cannot easily move backwards, cannot carry a lot of equipment and cannot drive in case of smoke (while, for instance, a train could easily run away from a fire even if there is no visibility at all, as it follows tracks and is controlled by the signalling system).

If they really want a road access they could build a flat surface while keeping two tracks.

Beside the likely reduction in safety, I fear also the reduction in capacity. The Villach-Ljubljana railway is already single track with the exception of the Karawanken tunnel, so reducing its capacity is not really intelligent especially with the possible adhesion to the EU of more Balkan countries, thus with a possible increase of traffic.

Swiss rescue trains:

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lösch-...tungszug_(SBB)

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lösch-...tungszug_(BLS)

Arlbergtunnel:

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arlbergtunnel_(Eisenbahn)
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Old March 21st, 2015, 05:31 PM   #1173
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The future of the "X corridor" via Tauernbahn is not so clear. I would say it's slowly dying because the main trading routes Balkan - Central Europe are now going (of will go) via Vienna.
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Old March 21st, 2015, 07:08 PM   #1174
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Does anyone know how many trains drive through the tunnel daily?
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Old March 21st, 2015, 08:01 PM   #1175
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Around 80.
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Old March 21st, 2015, 08:06 PM   #1176
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coccodrillo View Post
I don't see how removing a track could improve safety.
No oncoming traffic therefore no second rescue tube necessary under EU law. That is the whole reason.
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Old March 21st, 2015, 08:08 PM   #1177
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With 80 trains per day a single track could handle them, but it is really nearing the limit.

Maybe they are removing a track also to increase clearance to P/C 80/400 profile? What is today's laoding gauge/intermodal profile? According to this map it's already 80/400: if this is confirmed, then removing a track is completely idiot.

Quote:
Originally Posted by KingNick View Post
No oncoming traffic therefore no second rescue tube necessary under EU law. That is the whole reason.
There is an EU law (or is it just a recommendation?) that asks for a second tube if a road tunnel has a certain traffic (20.000 vehicles per day IIRC). Never heard of such a rule for rail tunnels. There are hundreds of kilometres of double track single tube rail tunnels in Europe, but very few people were killed or seriously injured because of that. Just think of the Tauern, Gotthard, Lötschberg, ...
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Old March 21st, 2015, 09:58 PM   #1178
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coccodrillo View Post
I don't see how removing a track could improve safety.
According to the Press release posted above

Quote:
Originally Posted by KingNick View Post
Quote:
Um den Arbeitnehmerschutz sicherzustellen, werden im knapp 8 km langen Karawankentunnel durchgehende ebene Standflächen, bessere Beleuchtung und Anschlussmöglichkeiten für elektrische Arbeitsmittel nachgerüstet.
Dabei kommt es zur Umstellung auf ein Streckengleis, um das volle Lichtraumprofil herzustellen.
Damit werden die nachhaltige Bestandssanierung und die schrittweise Anhebung der Tunnelsicherheit zur Umsetzung der entsprechenden EU-Standards ermöglicht.
quick translate
They want to build an even surface on both sides, better lighting and connectivity for electric tools.
As a result the tunnel will be converted to single track (there is not enough space for 2 tracks - loading gauge!)
This enables sustainable renovation of the tunnel and step by step increase of tunnel safety in order to comply with the relevant EU standards.
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Old March 21st, 2015, 10:39 PM   #1179
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Yes, that's what they say, but it doesn't explain why doing this will really increase safety.

I think that the Mont Blanc fire (and those in the Gotthard and Tauern the following years, all on roads) marked the split between two extremes, both dangerous: few safety measures in tunnels (or none at all) before the fire, and a widespread paranoia with excessive measures also for rail tunnels like these planned for the Karawanken tunnel.

I'm sure a solution like for the Arlberg would be feasible. But even doing nothing (or just building better lighting, cables and water pipes without building a road surface) would be acceptable IMHO - rail tunnels are by the nature of the vehicles they carry are much safer than road tunnels. It is wise to build new rail tunnels with stricter safety measures, but if the old tunnels keep being used as they are, there aren't real risks.
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Old March 21st, 2015, 11:43 PM   #1180
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the way I understand it is that having just a single tracked tunnel will not improve safety but it will enable renovations to improve safety to be done with the tunel in operation.
workers for instance could be in the tunnel (perhaps protected by some kind of movable scaffolding) while a train passes through. Also this way a train in the tunnel can be accessed from both sides safely.
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