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Old December 15th, 2014, 02:07 AM   #5721
kostas97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aleksandar_s View Post
Ub-Lajkovac is part of the A2 motorway, also unofficially known as Beograd-Bar and Corridor 11. It links Belgrade with the West Serbia and eventually to the border of Montenegro, and the plan is for one day have a motorway that leads all the way to the coast. Also it may be extended in the other direction, from Belgrade to the Romanian border.
Allright then.
It is a well-designed motorway as Serbia's need of an access to the sea is necessary and it should be a priority.
But i think that the extension to the Romanian border is kinda ambitious......i hope it is going to be a long term priority....anyway

And why is the motorway numbered as "22" instead of "A2"?

Oh by the way, something a bit irrelevant i would like to ask:
Isn't Serbia in accession negotiations with the EU?
If yes, how are they going?
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Old December 15th, 2014, 02:52 AM   #5722
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Allright then.
It is a well-designed motorway as Serbia's need of an access to the sea is necessary and it should be a priority.
But i think that the extension to the Romanian border is kinda ambitious......i hope it is going to be a long term priority....anyway
Belgrade to Timisoara would be cheap, it would cost 20% of the cost of a full profile mountain Motorway to Montenegro per km as the terrain is wonderfully flat.

Belgrade/Novi Sad also have better sea access than Hungary and Slovakia. They are nearer the mouth of the Danube is why.

Serbia needs a return ( tolls and vignettes) on the big motorway investments currently underway and if that materialises as it should then there are a lot of roads that will never be motorways but still need maintenance and improvements and then if there is a really good cashflow from transit trafffic do keep building out the motorway network to smaller cities by all means with the profits.

But Serbia should not do what Portugal did, go completely mad building motorways and bankrupt the state with the scale of expenditure. Portugal were co funded by the EU and still got into trouble, Serbia will fund its key motorways itself before it ever joins the EU.

It will be interesting to see what will be announced at the big China/SE Europe summit to be held in Belgrade later this week and I hope it will not be a megamotorway to nowhere, a closing of a motorway ring around Belgrade would be far more sensible.

China through its Export banks had a $10bn pot for SE Europe since around 2010, they may expand that somewhat at the summit as most of that $10bn or ( €?10bn? ) is committed now.
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Old December 15th, 2014, 03:03 AM   #5723
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Serbia will go mad with talk but don't worry most of it won't be turned into reality as no one will want to fund such fantasies that politicians can talk about to gain votes in various areas of the country by promising them a new highway.

The most important project on that summit will be the HSR between Belgrade and Budapest, not roads.
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Old December 15th, 2014, 03:07 AM   #5724
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The most important project on that summit will be the HSR between Belgrade and Budapest, not roads.
Oh Dear. Will this possibly involve Chinese made trains. ?????
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Old December 15th, 2014, 03:16 AM   #5725
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Oh Dear. Will this possibly involve Chinese made trains. ?????
Hard to tell at this stage but I guess, I mean they are not going to finance French or German producers, plus it's a question what Serbia and Hungary can afford.
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Old December 15th, 2014, 03:30 AM   #5726
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Fresh satelite image..

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Old December 15th, 2014, 03:31 AM   #5727
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I can see lots of aggravation for the Hungarians if they sign up to this Singidunum.

I mean LOTS!!!

Even if a Belgrade - Budapest HSR is built for €2bn or so upwards the competition is with air travel and Belgrade Airport is hardly busy on a European scale. The 2 Belfast Airports have twice as many passengers between them and Dublin is 6 times bigger than Belgrade.

I honestly think most Belgrade - Budapest passengers will probably still use an express bus like they do nowadays.

The distance ( 350km) is in the sweet spot for modern buses and is doable in 4 hours from City Centre to City Centre by non stop bus. A HSR will do it in under 3 hours, perhaps even 2 hours depending ....but at a much higher cost.

If those passengers existed they would be flying today, and they are not.
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Old December 15th, 2014, 04:15 AM   #5728
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Fresh satelite image..
Belgrade ~2030:

[img]http://i45.************/z0dxx.jpg[/img]
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Old December 15th, 2014, 05:01 AM   #5729
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Singidunum View Post
Serbia will go mad with talk but don't worry most of it won't be turned into reality as no one will want to fund such fantasies that politicians can talk about to gain votes in various areas of the country by promising them a new highway.

The most important project on that summit will be the HSR between Belgrade and Budapest, not roads.
It is too early! First you should improve your roads. There is an European Route being built from Budapest to Sarajevo. I think a HSR will not be afordable for the people and there will no have enough passengers for it.
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Old December 15th, 2014, 09:54 AM   #5730
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He has already suggested to various Eastern European countries that they should improve their road connections to Western Europe, even if some already have a good motorway connection (like Belarus). He is obviously unaware of the road situation in these countries. Serbia already has the main roads to Western Europe completed (Belgrade-Zagreb, Belgrade-Budapest), and all roads to Russia lead through EU countries.
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Old December 15th, 2014, 12:43 PM   #5731
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I can see lots of aggravation for the Hungarians if they sign up to this Singidunum.

I mean LOTS!!!
Aggravation? For getting HSR from the northernmost point in the country to the southernmost point? I don't think you used the right word, I think they will rejoice. Serbia will only get it in one third of the territory, that's why the Government is trying to get others signed up like I guess Turkey or Bulgaria.
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Old December 15th, 2014, 03:15 PM   #5732
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Aggravation? For getting HSR from the northernmost point in the country to the southernmost point? I don't think you used the right word, I think they will rejoice.
The people will love the idea, don't get me wrong. The 'aggravation' will come from the fact that Chinese HSR 'technology' was all stolen from Germany France and Japan in the first place. Let the Hungarians deal with that problem, eh!
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Old December 15th, 2014, 05:46 PM   #5733
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Aerial video of Pupin bridge:

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Old December 16th, 2014, 05:59 PM   #5734
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...the competition is with air travel and Belgrade Airport is hardly busy on a European scale. The 2 Belfast Airports have twice as many passengers between them and Dublin is 6 times bigger than Belgrade.
The competition is with various means of transport. Few of the current passengers (less then 50%) of the Belgrade-Budapest direct flights are point-to-point - the majority connect onto other destinations on Air Serbia's network ex-Belgrade

As for the Ireland analogy - remember Ireland is an island and that changes the dynamics significantly as regards mode of transport choice.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sponge_bob View Post
A HSR will do it in under 3 hours, perhaps even 2 hours depending ....but at a much higher cost.
One other issue is how horribly slow and painful the Hungarian border officials are. Unless a sort of pre-clearance facility was established in Belgrade and the other stops along the line like Novi Sad, then the wait at the border would be horrible and effectively make 'high speed' a fairly slow option. Anyone who has taken the existing 8+ hour Budapest-Belgrade train can attest to that.
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Old December 17th, 2014, 12:29 AM   #5735
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Opening of the Mihajlo Pupin bridge is going to be on 18th December.
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Old December 17th, 2014, 02:49 AM   #5736
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So, what we were waiting for has happened - under the auspices of the China-Eastern Europe summit currently being hosted in Belgrade, some preliminary agreement seems to have been reached with China's "Synohydro" firm regarding the completion of the city's motorway ring-road ... Dobanovci - Bubanj Potok and Bubanj-Potok - Pancevo section, along with a new Danube road & rail bridge.

Media seems to be concentrating on the far more interesting, Chinese-financed Belgrade-Budapest HSR project for now, but hopefully we'll hear more about this tomorrow.


Last edited by CrazySerb; December 17th, 2014 at 03:04 AM.
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Old December 17th, 2014, 03:05 AM   #5737
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A1 near Vranje:

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Old December 17th, 2014, 06:12 AM   #5738
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Why Will China build a HSR in Serbia? What is its interess?
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Old December 17th, 2014, 06:59 AM   #5739
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To spread their influence and hopefully earn a bit of money.
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Old December 17th, 2014, 12:47 PM   #5740
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The HSR would be 300 km/h fast? Are the plans to conenct these kind of railway with Skopje, Sofia and Athens?
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