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Old October 20th, 2007, 11:04 PM   #821
KGB
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Wikipedia stinks as a source, and is full of people like here on SSC, trying to make their country/city/road look better.
I wish you would stop incinuating people are making shit up in some attempt to make "something look better". I was accused of this because people simply can't read (something this site IS full of).

If the AADT in 2004 was 420,800 at it's busiest section, it's pretty common sense that it would peak at 500k or more quite often.

With the massive growth in the GTA, traffic would almost certainly have increased on the 401. Since peak hours put it at capacity, people choose to travel on it at off-peak hours and weekends. I'm not claiming the official AADT is now 500k, but given the factors, it is not out of the question as a possibility.



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I was just pointing out that there's so much more traffic overall in the LA area.
Well, that's just stating the obvious...Toronto has less people and a much higher percentage of trips on transit as opposed to vehicles.

The 401 has freaky numbers because it is not just a "another" commuter highway...it's also the main artery of the entire Quebec-Windsor corridor, carrying travelers cross-province, cross-country, as well as cross-border between the USA and Canada. A lot of it's vehicles are trucks carrying the bulk of goods between the world's largest trading partners.









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Old October 20th, 2007, 11:13 PM   #822
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Originally Posted by KGB View Post
The 401 has freaky numbers because it is not just a "another" commuter highway...it's also the main artery of the entire Quebec-Windsor corridor, carrying travelers cross-province, cross-country, as well as cross-border between the USA and Canada. A lot of it's vehicles are trucks carrying the bulk of goods between the world's largest trading partners.

KGB
Which, I'll add, is why Torontonians (and Ontarioaianianians) exhibit a degree of pride in this highway.


Well said KGB. That's a bitchin photo, I can't imagine how you climbed up that light standard, but it was well worth it.
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Old October 20th, 2007, 11:23 PM   #823
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No.....thats not a joke. Toronto's great but its nowhere near the city that New York is and I realize thats my opinion and you may not agree and thats fine. As far as Jane Jacobs, wow......I couldnt care less about what she thought...BUT....she actually moved to Canada during the Vietnam era because she was fearful that her sons were going to be drafted. Oh and since you like to look at pics of US cities.....keep looking because you'll find plenty more that are gorgeous and not "rotting from the inside" as you say. By the way, how many cities in the US have you visited?
I'll concede that saying that your statement was a joke was being entirely histrionic on my part, but I still believe that on some points it's false, or that at least it's an apples to oranges comparison. We'll leave it be, unless the mods decide to bring city vs city back again

Good point about Jane Jacobs, but she did stay here unlike many Americans at the time, and she was often outspoken about the quality of life (and urbanity) of Toronto. Interestingly enough (and to bring us right back to the point at hand) she was pivotal in stopping a particular highway being built through inner-city Toronto, which was the ultimate catalyst for preventing a series of highways from being built. It's actually written in the cities planning rules that no more expressways can be built. I can't over emphasize how important she was to Toronto.

I know there are lots of cities in the US that are not rotting away, but you must admit that theres an inordinate amount that are.

I've had the pleasure of visiting Boston, Manhattan, Brooklyn, Washington DC (twice), Seattle, parts of Detroit, and Las Vegas. Plus countless smaller ones; I don't remember them all because I've been to about 25 states, some when I was a teenager. My memory of Boston is pretty foggy; Seattle I only drove to the airport.

The funny thing about NYC... I was immediately struck at how much it reminded me of Toronto - but Toronto on steroids. Lots and lots of steroids. I was pleasantly surprised by Brooklyn (I stayed near Prospect Park, on the north side near that plaza with the Library... can't remember it's name). New York is awesome.
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Old October 21st, 2007, 12:16 AM   #824
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WOW. That's one hell of a photo.

I may be wrong, but counting the off and on-ramps...that 22 lanes there!

This is in Missisauga, right? It looks like it's in the area where the 401 is next to the airport.
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Old October 21st, 2007, 12:28 AM   #825
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the 401 is the back bone of Ontario and the real only way to get across the entire Toronto area....
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Old October 21st, 2007, 12:37 AM   #826
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If the AADT in 2004 was 420,800 at it's busiest section, it's pretty common sense that it would peak at 500k or more quite often.
You are missing the point. You can't have a peak aadt. It is by definition a yearly average -- one figure for the entire year. Could there be days where there are 500,000 vehicles on one particualar stretch of highway? Sure, and few would dispute that possibility; however claiming a peak aadt of 500,000 means that the terminology isn't understand, which certainly suggests this figure doesn't come from a reputable source.
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Old October 21st, 2007, 12:48 AM   #827
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Ontario's newest freeway opens next month, November 3rd, Red Hill Creek Expressway.





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Old October 21st, 2007, 05:08 PM   #828
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..
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Old October 22nd, 2007, 05:14 AM   #829
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Ontario's newest freeway opens next month, November 3rd, Red Hill Creek Expressway.
That should cut down the time to go around Hamilton for people heading west towards Brantford and London or from Brantford to the Niagara Peninsula, correct?
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Old October 22nd, 2007, 06:39 AM   #830
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Yep, it'll shave off time and take trucks off local roads as Hamilton will have a complete ring road.
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Old October 22nd, 2007, 07:45 AM   #831
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That should cut down the time to go around Hamilton for people heading west towards Brantford and London or from Brantford to the Niagara Peninsula, correct?
yeah...the local TV crew took a trip down it.

Time it takes with the highway - 5 minutes

Time it takes now with taking surface arterial roads - 16.5 minutes.

So you'll be shaving off on average 10 or so minutes.

can't wait to see the road open!
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Old October 22nd, 2007, 07:55 AM   #832
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That's a bitchin photo, I can't imagine how you climbed up that light standard, but it was well worth it.
I agree.. a great picture. I'm still in awe w.r.t the photo... it must have been quite daunting to climb all the way up there... nevermind getting past 10+ lanes of highway traffic to reach the standard. It's wide but this stretch of Mississauga is still congested... all cars halt to a standstill every weekday.

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Old October 22nd, 2007, 10:48 PM   #833
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Are they extending 406 south towards Welland? I drove along it in August 2006 and it looked like they were making some cloverleafs south of where it turns into a surface street through farmland.
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Old October 23rd, 2007, 05:32 AM   #834
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The extended the freeway about 7km south of where it narrowed before, including one new interchange, at Road 20.

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I agree.. a great picture. I'm still in awe w.r.t the photo... it must have been quite daunting to climb all the way up there... nevermind getting past 10+ lanes of highway traffic to reach the standard. It's wide but this stretch of Mississauga is still congested... all cars halt to a standstill every weekday.
It's a fantastic photo, but I think it was probably taken from an airplane, no?
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Old October 23rd, 2007, 08:07 AM   #835
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I could say that its easy to have nice large cities in Canada when you only have 2 cities with more than a million people!...but I wont because I love Canada!!....but I just had to point that fact out to you.
If you want to talk about facts, then do your research first. There are actually 6 cities in Canada over 1 million. Another point: the 401 is the busiest highway in the world, but LA has a larger highway system than Toronto. Both are true, but we all know that already. Why bring it up?
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Old October 23rd, 2007, 02:56 PM   #836
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i think the guy from LA was saying is that we really have one big highway going east and west with so much traffic (okay two more but one is a toll and the other only goes to the DVP), while in LA there are many that go east-west and have very very high traffic...
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Old October 23rd, 2007, 03:06 PM   #837
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I wish we had great highway like this in Quebec!
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Old October 24th, 2007, 10:24 AM   #838
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Originally Posted by LordMandeep View Post
i think the guy from LA was saying is that we really have one big highway going east and west with so much traffic (okay two more but one is a toll and the other only goes to the DVP), while in LA there are many that go east-west and have very very high traffic...
Yes, I know. My point was that rather than acknowledging that the 401 was massive, he seemed more interested in trumpetting LA. It was rather petty, since we're all aware of LA's highway system.

It would be like us visiting a California site discussing that LA had the busiest highway system in the world, and a Canadian saying that LA's largest freeway is no match for what we have here in Toronto. There are better ways to share information than cutting down one acheivement to bolster another. What he did is called bragging and it doesn't go over well regardless of who is doing it.
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Old October 26th, 2007, 07:41 PM   #839
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Yes, I know. My point was that rather than acknowledging that the 401 was massive, he seemed more interested in trumpetting LA. It was rather petty, since we're all aware of LA's highway system.

It would be like us visiting a California site discussing that LA had the busiest highway system in the world, and a Canadian saying that LA's largest freeway is no match for what we have here in Toronto. There are better ways to share information than cutting down one acheivement to bolster another. What he did is called bragging and it doesn't go over well regardless of who is doing it.
I just got back from a wedding so I havent been on here for awhile. I see my post provoked a couple of responses!!!

First of all, I was NOT "trumpeting" LA, if you read my entire post you'll see that I wrote that I DONT believe that massive amounts of freeway traffic are a urban quality to be proud of. I just was making the comparison for the fun of comparison!! I was simply responding to another post that stated that traffic levels on the 401 are far larger than the 405 in LA.....this is not true and I pointed out some updated numbers. I also agreed, in a subsequent post, that the 401 does indeed have higher numbers than any 'single' LA freeway but traffic in the LA region is FAR heavier.....thats it!....can you handle that one??
Lastly, its you that should do some research. There ARE only 2 cities in Canada with more than a million people....Toronto and Montreal. However, there are 6 "Metropolitan Areas" in Canada that exceed 1 million...but not cities. Theres quite a difference between a Metropolitan area and a city....you should study up on it.

Ciao!!
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Old October 26th, 2007, 07:46 PM   #840
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i think the guy from LA was saying is that we really have one big highway going east and west with so much traffic (okay two more but one is a toll and the other only goes to the DVP), while in LA there are many that go east-west and have very very high traffic...
You are absolutely right!! Thats all I was saying and thank you for not getting defensive like isaidso did. I certainly was not 'cutting' down the achievement of the 401 or bragging about the traffic of LA. I hate traffic in LA!! Take care bud.
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