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Old December 29th, 2015, 05:31 PM   #2601
Penn's Woods
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John Maynard View Post
But, 3-lane roads are not dangerous if properly configured to 2+1, and with a median barrier at top, they are very safe > look at Sweden, they have many of these kind of roads and one of the lowest road fatality rates in the world :


Swedish 2+1 highway
What I meant by "three-lane road" was the sort of thing that was common in the U.S. in the early days of automobiles: a driving lane each direction with a center lane that was meant for passing.
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Old December 29th, 2015, 05:35 PM   #2602
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2+1 roads are not the problem, Spain even has lots of them. The problem is to have a central lane where fast traffic from both sides can move to.
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Old December 29th, 2015, 07:34 PM   #2603
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It's not a countryside road we're talking about here. Physical barries are not desirable in this case.
It's a typical main street passing trough a village. Here are some examples on the same N70:

Usually they are configured like thisn where the central lane is only for left turns.:
https://goo.gl/maps/t7mgXHEFRg22

2+1 without physical barrier:
https://goo.gl/maps/YRaBqirkfCA2

Or 1+1 with median:
https://goo.gl/maps/eQR5jBMgj6r
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Old January 15th, 2016, 11:09 PM   #2604
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The French-speaking liberal Minister of mobility, Jacqueline Galant, would like to reduce the speed on motorways when it rains as done in countries like France. A study will be conducted:

http://www.rtl.be/info/belgique/soci...es-785750.aspx
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Old January 16th, 2016, 02:19 AM   #2605
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What does it matter she's French-speaking?

The article you're linking to is *very* brief and I'd say very unprofessional even. Saying that the minister has her aim at the 120 km/h speed we have now is non-factual and besides the point completely.

This article in Dutch seems much more factual to me: http://deredactie.be/cm/vrtnieuws/politiek/1.2544917

While the study will indeed look at the impact of reducing the speed during the rain, it will also look at higher speeds during the night and lower speeds during the day or more stretches with different speeds like in the Netherlands.
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Old January 17th, 2016, 09:27 AM   #2606
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Originally Posted by Glodenox View Post
What does it matter she's French-speaking?

The article you're linking to is *very* brief and I'd say very unprofessional even. Saying that the minister has her aim at the 120 km/h speed we have now is non-factual and besides the point completely.

This article in Dutch seems much more factual to me: http://deredactie.be/cm/vrtnieuws/politiek/1.2544917

While the study will indeed look at the impact of reducing the speed during the rain, it will also look at higher speeds during the night and lower speeds during the day or more stretches with different speeds like in the Netherlands.
I suppose that by "French-speaking liberal," he just meant to identify her party, the MR. To the 99.99 percent of non-Belgians who - unlike me - have never heard of your parties. :-)

Have a Chimay Rouge. Or a Westvleteren:
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Old January 17th, 2016, 12:25 PM   #2607
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Penn's Woods View Post
What I meant by "three-lane road" was the sort of thing that was common in the U.S. in the early days of automobiles: a driving lane each direction with a center lane that was meant for passing.
This configuration was used in some half-built Italian motorways in the 1950s and 1960s, but it was later abandoned because it was very dangerous (the middle lane was called death lane).
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In real life, electronic toll collection was first introduced in Bergen, Norway in 1986, and well into the 21th century many countries still struggle to implement it.
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Old January 17th, 2016, 07:00 PM   #2608
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Center turn lanes are still pretty dangerous (and often called "suicide lanes" here too), seeing as how the turning vehicle has to cross speeding oncoming traffic. But they're definitely not as dangerous as that center overtake lane design.
Honestly I would say the centre turning lane is much safer than the alternative of no turning lane. My office is on a 4 lane undivided road with no turning lane, where traffic normally flows at around 45 mph, but there's always someone stopped dead in the left lane wanting to turn left (often myself too ) IMO it is pretty hairy and stressful unlike the typical 5-lane (incl. centre turn lane) design, examples of which are common in the area

At least the centre turn lane allows them to wait outside the main lanes, and the occasional confusion where two cars oppose each other is usually fixed (go back to main lanes) and in the worst case the speeds are extremely low...
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Last edited by Kanadzie; January 18th, 2016 at 04:35 AM.
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Old January 18th, 2016, 04:10 AM   #2609
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I think Gilant is taking about French motorway 'weather limits' where 130kph automatically becomes 110kph when it rains.
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Old January 21st, 2016, 04:11 PM   #2610
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Walloon government is about to invest 640 million euros next 4 years in their road (and water) network

The list of projects you can find here
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Old January 21st, 2016, 04:30 PM   #2611
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Meurisse View Post
Walloon government is about to invest 640 million euros next 4 years in their road (and water) network

The list of projects you can find here
That's quite a lot for Wallonia lol.

I hope that this plan will be real.
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Old January 21st, 2016, 04:32 PM   #2612
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glodenox View Post
What does it matter she's French-speaking?

The article you're linking to is *very* brief and I'd say very unprofessional even. Saying that the minister has her aim at the 120 km/h speed we have now is non-factual and besides the point completely.

This article in Dutch seems much more factual to me: http://deredactie.be/cm/vrtnieuws/politiek/1.2544917

While the study will indeed look at the impact of reducing the speed during the rain, it will also look at higher speeds during the night and lower speeds during the day or more stretches with different speeds like in the Netherlands.
I took the first one I found.

Of course, I prefer the articles from L'Echo : http://www.lecho.be/economie_politiq...&ts=1453386688
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Old January 21st, 2016, 04:35 PM   #2613
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Fair enough

I also hope the plans for Wallonia will go through. Because I don't know the roads mentioned in the document, I'm not sure whether it'll be sufficient, but I'm under the expression that it'd be a big improvement.
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Old January 21st, 2016, 07:28 PM   #2614
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How's this for a suicide lane?

https://goo.gl/maps/PgEV7tKJjJB2

On a slightly less severe note, here's a helpful demonstration of one which I have actually driven:

https://goo.gl/maps/pckzJSNaziT2
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Old February 3rd, 2016, 10:30 PM   #2615
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New about the A601.

According to an interview given to RTL-TVI (a French-speaking channel), the A601 is not a priority and won't probably be renovated before 2020.

A petition has however been opened by users that are forced to make a detour.

http://www.rtl.be/info/regions/liege...o--791732.aspx
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Old March 7th, 2016, 08:08 PM   #2616
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According to a recent study made for VAB, only 48% of the Walloons are satisfied with their motorways. In Flanders, however, the satisfaction rate is 65%.

http://www.rtl.be/info/belgique/soci...es-800087.aspx
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Old March 7th, 2016, 08:32 PM   #2617
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Walloon motorways tend to be in a worse shape, but do not have as much congestion as those in Flanders.

I'm a bit worried about the bridges though. If they are maintained as bad as the tunnels in Brussels then they have a real problem, given the fact that they don't even have sufficient funding to keep a motorway in safe condition (A601). Sure, A601 isn't the most important motorway of Belgium, but it's telling that they cannot find a few million euros for renovation, but instead have shut the motorway down indefinitely. What if there are problems at a major motorway bridge? The E40 Meuse River Bridge in Liège was in terrible condition before they started renovations a while ago.
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Old March 7th, 2016, 09:52 PM   #2618
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Walloon motorways tend to be in a worse shape, but do not have as much congestion as those in Flanders.

I'm a bit worried about the bridges though. If they are maintained as bad as the tunnels in Brussels then they have a real problem, given the fact that they don't even have sufficient funding to keep a motorway in safe condition (A601). Sure, A601 isn't the most important motorway of Belgium, but it's telling that they cannot find a few million euros for renovation, but instead have shut the motorway down indefinitely. What if there are problems at a major motorway bridge? The E40 Meuse River Bridge in Liège was in terrible condition before they started renovations a while ago.
And the scariest thing is that we're talking about a western country.
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Old March 7th, 2016, 09:55 PM   #2619
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Walloon motorways tend to be in a worse shape, but do not have as much congestion as those in Flanders.

I'm a bit worried about the bridges though. If they are maintained as bad as the tunnels in Brussels then they have a real problem, given the fact that they don't even have sufficient funding to keep a motorway in safe condition (A601). Sure, A601 isn't the most important motorway of Belgium, but it's telling that they cannot find a few million euros for renovation, but instead have shut the motorway down indefinitely. What if there are problems at a major motorway bridge? The E40 Meuse River Bridge in Liège was in terrible condition before they started renovations a while ago.
What is the deal with the Brussels tunnels, anyway? I've seen headlines....
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Old March 7th, 2016, 10:08 PM   #2620
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What is the deal with the Brussels tunnels, anyway? I've seen headlines....
Lack of maintenance, basically. The team meant to maintain the tunnels didn't have enough budget for the people they needed and important maintenance work got postponed.
Also apparently there's quite a bit of water seeping in through the protective layers, damaging the concrete structure. That would be due to substandard materials having been used for some tunnels.

The main issue is simply that tunnels are expensive to maintain and that Brussels has many of them (when compared to most other cities of a somewhat similar size). Now there's talks about closing down some of these tunnels as they are not really necessary for the traffic flow as a whole.
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Last edited by Glodenox; March 9th, 2016 at 10:31 AM. Reason: typo
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