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Old September 25th, 2007, 08:29 AM   #261
Jeroen669
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Quote:
Originally Posted by x-type View Post
khm, in Croatia we have a section on A6 where trucks go downhill about 20-30 km/h. why? because the difference in lattitude the motorway changes is about 500 m in about 10 km. you Netherlanders will never understand that
Do we have to be jealous for that?
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Old September 26th, 2007, 01:33 AM   #262
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Well, not for the geometry of the motorway, but certainly by the beauty of the landscape! Hehe!

500m in 10km... sounds familiar... Just try spanish A-15 going from S. Sebastian to Pamplona... you climg about 500m roughly in a 10km's stretch where the grade is a constant 5% (except in the tunnels, where it drops to some 3% or less).
Guaranteed fun if you're pulling a trailor! Anyway, who wants to do more than 60km/h in a motorway!
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Old September 26th, 2007, 12:01 PM   #263
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goschio View Post
There is a general speed limit of 90km/h for trucks on german autobahns. And 40km/h downhill seems ok since trucks are unable to stop at higher speed if it gets downhill. Just imagine there is a crash and all the trucks just crash into it.

Too many accidents with trucks involved have happened already. And most were horrible crashs with many people killed.They are the most dangerous part on german auotbahns.

But this can also happen in the CITY, and that´s dangerous

for example: 1987 Herborn

on highways there happens enough things when there´s fog or traffic jam ends
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Old September 26th, 2007, 12:11 PM   #264
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update for A96 Memmingen in direction Munich:

photos from last Saturday:





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Old September 26th, 2007, 12:33 PM   #265
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finally some good looking German aspahlt
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Old September 26th, 2007, 07:18 PM   #266
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Of course. You know, why?
It is NEW!
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Old September 27th, 2007, 12:39 AM   #267
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nephasto View Post
I've been on dozens of motorways downhills with a 6% grade and I don't see trucks doing 40... more like 80.. some of them possibly 60 or something.
it's not dangerous if downhill lasts for 2-3 km, but if it lasts more then 5 km, then it can be disaster. brakes are very sensitive at downhills like that. you cannot imagine how easy can you burn them! i have more times felt smell of brakes on my car after such downhill, and imagine 25 tons heavy truck! driver mustn't leave brake at one moment, he'll in few seconds catch such acceleration because of inertion and won't be able to stop!

btw, what about uphill?! trucks cannot go faster uphill neither!
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Old September 27th, 2007, 12:49 AM   #268
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5 km's downhilll with 6% is alot I admit. But I bet that's not the case on that german motorway.
But when that's the case, it's up to the truck drivers to take care of their brakes(depending on their load, etc...) ... I don't think that setting a really low speed limit is the solution.
Also, in those downhill there are usually emergency exits, to bge used by vehicles who lost their brakes. You've probably seen some of those already.

As for upphill, trucks go as fast as they can... unfortunatly, on those 6% upphill, some can't go any faster than 40. Still it's not as all vehicles tend to go slower upphill. Besides, it's much easier to brake when it's upphill than downhill.
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Old September 27th, 2007, 06:49 PM   #269
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Elzer Berg (Mountain of Elz):

the average downhill grade is about 5%, and the lenght of that stretch is about 8km.

Before the cameras were installed in 1972, the average number of accidents was 350 per year. In the following years, the number of accidents decreased, in 1999 there were "only" 64 accidents, but with a lot more traffic (88.000 vehicles/day in 1999) than 1972 (in 1978, it was 35.000 near Montabaur (91.000 in 2005), only 1 exit away from Diez (and 2 from Limburg-Nord)).

Last edited by Patrick; September 27th, 2007 at 06:58 PM.
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Old September 27th, 2007, 09:02 PM   #270
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@ nephasto:

yes, there are radars for these 40km/h. Even a usual car will be flashed when it is faster than 40km/h, but the driver won't get anything unless he is faster than 100km/h. Many drivers don't know that, so they won't drive on the right lane if there's no truck on it (for example on sundays); there should be an additional sign saying that these 40km/h is only for heavy traffic.
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Old September 27th, 2007, 09:18 PM   #271
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^ Agreed. I still don't know, whether the far right lane (out of 3) on the Venice bypass is limited to 50 km/h just for trucks or also for cars. Therefore I never drive on it.
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Old September 28th, 2007, 01:36 AM   #272
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick View Post
Elzer Berg (Mountain of Elz):

the average downhill grade is about 5%, and the lenght of that stretch is about 8km.
You've got me on that.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick View Post
yes, there are radars for these 40km/h. Even a usual car will be flashed when it is faster than 40km/h, but the driver won't get anything unless he is faster than 100km/h.
That sounds more reasonable. Still, even for trucks I find the 40 limit exagerated, but there's no point in discussing it any more.
But I'm 100% in favour of radars to enforce the limit speed (whichever they are) on those dangerous points of the motorways.

And they are most certainly effective in reducing casualties.
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Old September 29th, 2007, 05:37 PM   #273
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I've taken pics of the A1 Cloppenburg - Bremen - Hamburg, the A261 near Hamburg and the A7 Hamburg - Flensburg. I'll hope to upload them later this evening.
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Old September 29th, 2007, 08:14 PM   #274
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A1 Cloppenburg - Bremen - Buchholzer Dreieck (Hamburg)

[IMG]http://i22.************/2yyyzxx.jpg[/IMG]

This serie starts halfway between Osnabrück and Bremen, and goes by Bremen, a large port city of 600.000 inhabitants. The A1 near Bremen has 2x3 lanes, and some very old signs can be seen. It has an automated traffic control over 43 kilometers. After Bremen, we head on to Hamburg, where the A1 comes extremely busy, being "stockender Verkehr" (Queueing traffic) over much of the 80km between the two cities.

To the pictures (114 pics)
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Old September 29th, 2007, 08:43 PM   #275
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they really should widen the A1 atleat between Bremen and Hamburg to 3 lines each dir.
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Old September 29th, 2007, 08:48 PM   #276
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Yeah, obviously, it's very busy, with one accident, and the road is jammed for a long distance. The A7 is very busy too, they should widen that to 2x3 lanes between AD Bordesholm and Hamburg-Schnelsen-Nord and 2x4 lanes in Hamburg. The A23 is often clogged up because they can't merge into the busy A7. I'll show some pics of this road too.
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Old September 29th, 2007, 10:36 PM   #277
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2 pics of the Kohlbrandbrücke today. One of the rare moments it wasn't raining, i drove 6 hours in rain.

[IMG]http://i22.************/5ygrj5.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]http://i24.************/2rfy3pc.jpg[/IMG]
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Old October 3rd, 2007, 03:34 PM   #278
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Quote:
The first A-Model PPP contract to widen and operate the heavily congested A8 between Augsburg and Munich in southern Germany is being carried out by the Autobahnplus consortium. The A8 forms part of Germany’s national autobahn network, which charges a distance-based truck-toll for all commercial vehicles of 12tonnes or more. Steer Davies Gleave in partnership with the German transport consultancy Beratergruppe Verkehr Umwelt (BVU), provided Traffic and Revenue advice to support the consortium bid. The A8 is the first of its kind to be given the go-head in Germany. Last year the German Federal Government launched a series of pilot projects to evaluate the suitability of PPP contracts to procure motorway widening. These involve the design and construction of additional lanes as well as the maintenance and operation of the extended section of road for 30 years. In addition to an upfront contribution towards construction costs the concessionaire is provided with a shadow toll through the existing monthly truck-toll revenue.
Finally, the rest of the A8 between Karlsruhe and Salzburg needs widening too.
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Old October 3rd, 2007, 03:57 PM   #279
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Damn, just look at those Chemtrails in the sky (typical grid pattern)
Anyways, the part between Karlsruhe and Basel needs to be widened to 3 lanes each side aswell.
Right now there are still some parts there which have been built in the 30s (if I remember correctly) which makes for a bumpy ride.
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Old October 3rd, 2007, 04:10 PM   #280
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I don't think the A5 between Karlsruhe and Basel still has it actual 30's pavement, but yes, it's a bumpy ride.
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