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Old August 22nd, 2013, 06:32 PM   #5461
Heico-M
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
I think this is the only chance of getting A20 built within a reasonable timespan. General tolls at the Elbtunnel are acceptable in my opinion.

The idea is a PPP project where the concessionair gets part or all of the truck toll revenue for a period of 50 years. Generally speaking, these contracts are less advantageous to the government because the company receives more money than construction and operations would have cost if the government constructs the road. On the other side, this means the A20 could be completed as much as 15 years sooner, and you also have to put a value to that factor.
The French company apparently wants to make some profit. That is what companies do.

The offer is seductive. The construction time is breathtakingly short.
What do you guys reckon the state government of Schleswig-Holstein will say to this.

The current status is that the red-green-Danish coalition in Kiel only want to let the A20 end at the A7 interchange near Bad Bramstedt.
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Old August 22nd, 2013, 06:32 PM   #5462
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I think it could be possible to complete the A20/A26 until 2026. But the article refers a construction time from 2015 to 2020. The last A20 part b/n A28 and A27 could be built conventionally.
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Old August 22nd, 2013, 06:35 PM   #5463
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
Many governments view PPP as "free money".
And with a good reason: they can kick-start many projects, and generate consensus, while the effects of a bad PPP will show way after the time a politician might get bad publicity from them.
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Old August 22nd, 2013, 07:55 PM   #5464
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And with a good reason: they can kick-start many projects, and generate consensus, while the effects of a bad PPP will show way after the time a politician might get bad publicity from them.
Politicians only think until the next election. Most of them will be gone when bad effects get obvious.
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Old August 22nd, 2013, 08:04 PM   #5465
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heico-M View Post
Politicians only think until the next election.
Right.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heico-M View Post
Most of them will be gone when bad effects get obvious.
Most of them? At maximum some of them... (also in Germany)
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Old August 22nd, 2013, 10:19 PM   #5466
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Well, let's go on with hustings aka groundbreaking ceremonies:

- B169 Göltzschtal bypass: construction start for the next phase (OSM), see press release. The groundbreaking for the first phase was in September 2012. Completion of the two phases is estimated in 2015.

- B311 Unlingen bypass: the groundbreaking ceremony will be on 5th September (3-laned; 4.4km; ~14 million €; OSM). The Baden-Württemberg Minster of Transport Hermann (Green party) reproaches the Federal Minster of Transport Ramsauer groundbreaking policy.

The symbolic opening ceremony for the B260 Dausenau bypass also happened today (7.8 million €; 1.1km; OSM), see press release. Groundbreaking was in summer 2009. The road was already opened some weeks ago.
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Old August 22nd, 2013, 11:39 PM   #5467
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What I don't understand, is why you should (as signs suggest) use the A94 (what's of it!) to get from Munich (München) to Passau. Wouldn't using the A92 and A3 be much faster? And I don't know why they are planning the A94 anyway. Connecting Munich with Linz (Vienna) other than by the A8 isn't forseeable (especially not in Austria), and connecting Munich to those small towns there just sounds senseless to me (Marktl am Inn being the pope's birth-place isn't enough, let alone Hitler and Braunau ), and connection with Passau is already good enough.
I think one reason for A94 is simply to replace the current B12 which has a reputation as lots of accidents happened in the past 10 years. Not sure though if that is still the case.
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Old August 22nd, 2013, 11:43 PM   #5468
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Quote:
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I think it could be possible to complete the A20/A26 until 2026.
Self-fulfilling prophecy
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Old August 22nd, 2013, 11:48 PM   #5469
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Heico-M View Post
The offer is seductive. The construction time is breathtakingly short.
What do you guys reckon the state government of Schleswig-Holstein will say to this.
Governments always talk about the "user pays principle" (making the ridiculous suggestion motorists don't pay enough taxes to support the infrastructure without tolls). But when there is a great opportunity to put that user pays principle to work (quickly building a new Autobahn or widen an existing one) with truck tolls, they're suddenly against it.
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Old August 23rd, 2013, 02:03 AM   #5470
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They should use a PPP to build a Freiburg-A81 link I'd not mind paying some tolls there.
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Old August 23rd, 2013, 08:38 AM   #5471
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They should use a PPP to build a Freiburg-A81 link I'd not mind paying some tolls there.
Why stop at A81? Why not carry on to Lindau and Bregenz, so that there will be a new route to France available avoiding Switzerland...

But you know it won't happen. They're not going to build a motorway through the Black Forest like that...
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Old August 23rd, 2013, 11:28 AM   #5472
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Why stop at A81? Why not carry on to Lindau and Bregenz, so that there will be a new route to France available avoiding Switzerland...
Combining with the former A98 plan to get an Autobahn from Freiburg to Holzkirchen (at the A8 south of Munich) .
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Old August 23rd, 2013, 02:08 PM   #5473
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I think one reason for A94 is simply to replace the current B12 which has a reputation as lots of accidents happened in the past 10 years. Not sure though if that is still the case.
I am sure past-Verso is going to appreciate this answer.
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Old August 23rd, 2013, 02:20 PM   #5474
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Combining with the former A98 plan to get an Autobahn from Freiburg to Holzkirchen (at the A8 south of Munich) .
That'd be good. Holzkirchen is not far from me. I'll probably be able to get to France faster that way than via either Bregenz or Switzerland. Basel border is approximately 4 hours from me via Arlberg and St Gallen.
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Old August 23rd, 2013, 02:27 PM   #5475
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But A98 completion is canceled, right?
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Old August 23rd, 2013, 02:30 PM   #5476
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Apparently. But never say never....
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Old August 23rd, 2013, 03:21 PM   #5477
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Quote:
Originally Posted by g.spinoza View Post
But A98 completion is canceled, right?
All projects in that region were canceled long ago: A98, A91, A88, A86, A85, A84, A83... See map with all current and former (1970ths) projects: > click < (grey = canceled).
The A98 is only planned b/n Lörrach and Waldshut and will end in the middle of nowhere because there is no agreement with the Switzerland regarding a route to the A81 end near Gottmadingen.
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Old August 23rd, 2013, 03:28 PM   #5478
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The construction of the 2nd longest German Autobahn tunnel has started. The so-called Hirschhagen tunnel has a length of 4.2km and is part of the 6.1km long A44 section AS Helsa-East – AS Hessisch Lichtenau-West (OSM). The preliminary works have already started in May 2010.
The section has estimated costs of 326 million € and will be completed in late 2018 (see press release).
Vid of the construction: > click <.

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The next A44 opening will be the section east of the above mentioned section from AS Hessisch Lichtenau-West to AS Hessisch Lichtenau-Center (OSM). The construction of the 2.2km section has started in April 2008 and is expected to be completed in autumn 2013. It includes a 700m tunnel and a 100m ecoduct.
There are no delays according to the A44 project page. But they have changed the completion date for the section AS Hessisch Lichtenau-West to AS Hessisch Lichtenau-Center from fall 2013 to spring 2014 within the last few days.
According to a newspaper article the delay is caused by problems with the technical equipment of the tunnel.
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Old August 23rd, 2013, 03:59 PM   #5479
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Upcoming Autobahn openings 2013

A 1.6km part of the A30 Bad Oeynhausen bypass is announced to be opened in late 2013. It is the section from AS Bad Oeynhausen-North to AS Dehme (OSM).

The 2nd carriageway of the A94 Malching bypass is also announced to be opened in late 2013 (OSM; 5.8km).

I have no up-to-date info, but it was announced that the A23 b/n AS Itzehoe-North – AS Itzehoe-Center (OSM; 1.7km).

The German Autobahn network would be extended by 42.4km if the A23 and A30 sections would be completed on time (A94 does not count because it is only the 2nd carriageway). An incertitude (no official info) is the A72 Borna bypass. It was signed as B road in the last years, but it was signed as A72 after the recently completion of the section Borna-South to Rochlitz.

The 2012 extension was 30.8km. The foresight 2014 shows an extension by 33.3km.

Total list since 2001:
2001: 72.0km
2002: 199.1km
2003: 107.5km
2004: 120.9km
2005: 191.0km
2006: 176.1km
2007: 36.9km
2008: 143.7km
2009: 81.0km
2010: 11.9km
2011: 20.1km
2012: 30.8km
2013: 42.4km
2014: 33.3km
2015: 22.1km
2016: 46.4km
2017: 33.5km
2018: 6.1km
2019: 30.0km
2020: 4.5km
2021: 0.0km
2022: 3.2km
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Old August 25th, 2013, 09:38 PM   #5480
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Gießener Ring Direction East







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