daily menu » rate the banner | guess the city | one on oneforums map | privacy policy | DMCA | news magazine | posting guidelines

Go Back   SkyscraperCity > Infrastructure and Mobility Forums > Highways & Autobahns

Highways & Autobahns All about automobility



Global Announcement

As a general reminder, please respect others and respect copyrights. Go here to familiarize yourself with our posting policy.


Reply

 
Thread Tools
Old December 23rd, 2014, 04:59 PM   #7381
MichiH
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Lower Franconia
Posts: 4,400
Likes (Received): 2079

Quote:
Originally Posted by Road_UK View Post
But why would the BAG do vignette checks anyway? It has nothing to do with goods transportation...
See draft legislation: http://www.bmvi.de/SharedDocs/DE/Anl...ublicationFile.

Quote:
Page 58: Absatz 1 Satz 1 bestimmt das Bundesamt für Güterverkehr (BAG) als für die Überwachung zuständige Behörde. Der Kernbereich hoheitlicher Kontrollaufgaben muss aus verfassungsrechtlichen Gründen vom Staat durchgeführt werden und kann nicht auf einen privaten Betreiber übertragen werden. Das BAG bietet sich als Kontrollbehörde an, da es sich um eine flächendeckend präsente Bundesbehörde im Geschäftsbereich des Bundesverkehrsministerium handelt, die bereits langjährige Erfahrungen mit der Straßenkontrolle und der Kontrolle nach dem Bundesfernstraßenmautgesetz aufweist und über die entsprechende Grundinfrastruktur verfügt.
Es erfolgt keine Vollkontrolle des abgabepflichtigen Verkehrs, sondern es wird nur stichprobenartig kontrolliert. Kontrolliert wird unter Berücksichtigung des Grundsatzes der Verhältnismäßigkeit entweder über den Eingang der Zahlung der Infrastrukturabgabe oder über stichprobenartige Kontrollen auf den Bundesautobahnen mit Hilfe von Kontrollbrücken, portablen Kontrollen und Kontrollfahrzeugen. Die Kontrolle über den Eingang der Zahlung der Infrastrukturabgabe erfolgt durch das Kraftfahrt-Bundesamt (KBA). Das BAG führt die stichprobenartigen Kontrollen auf den Bundesautobahnen durch. Da bei einer E-Vignette die Fahrtberechtigung mit dem amtlichen Kfz-Kennzeichen verknüpft ist, kann die Kontrolle durch eine Abfrage des Kennzeichens im Zentralsystem erfolgen. Die Kontrolldaten zu Fahrzeugen, für die die Abgabe ordnungsgemäß entrichtet wurde, werden unverzüglich gelöscht.
It's controlled by the BAG.

Quote:
Page 33f: Die beim BAG anfallenden Kosten für die Implementierung der erforderlichen Kontrolleinrichtungen belaufen sich auf insgesamt rund 34 Mio. Euro in den Jahren 2015 und 2016. Die laufenden jährlichen Kosten für den Betrieb des Kontrollsystems sowie für die in diesem Zusammenhang erforderlichen 287 Personalstellen belaufen sich insgesamt auf
rund 32 Mio. Euro.
The control units cost 34 million €. The annual costs are 32 million € (287 new employees, salary classes "Besoldungsgruppen" are shown on page 34).

The KBA needs 84 additional employees.
__________________

Road_UK liked this post
MichiH no está en línea   Reply With Quote

Sponsored Links
Old December 23rd, 2014, 05:45 PM   #7382
MichiH
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Lower Franconia
Posts: 4,400
Likes (Received): 2079

Quote:
23rd December 2014: B207 Lübeck-South (A20) - South of Pogeez (5.3km; OSM; u/c since 2011)

Mid December 2014: A4 2x3 widening Düren - East of Düren (2.2km; OSM; u/c since ?)
December 2014: B255 Niederahr - Oberahr (2.3km; OSM; u/c since July 2007)
Late 2014: B48 Enkenbach-Alsenborn bypass, 2nd section (0.7km; OSM; u/c since September 2009)
A4 source (3rd lane of the southbound carriageway in service since 10th December but the right lane towards Aachen remains closed until spring 2015 b/c of ongoing works at the noise protection wall) and B207 source (costs: 25 million €)
MichiH no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 23rd, 2014, 06:09 PM   #7383
Road_UK
BANNED
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Mayrhofen AT, Sneek NL, Bromley UK
Posts: 5,855
Likes (Received): 1599

Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
See draft legislation: http://www.bmvi.de/SharedDocs/DE/Anl...ublicationFile.

It's controlled by the BAG.

The control units cost 34 million €. The annual costs are 32 million € (287 new employees, salary classes "Besoldungsgruppen" are shown on page 34).

The KBA needs 84 additional employees.
Time to change it into the BAGVK then.

Bundesamt für Güternverkehr und Vignette Kontrolle.
Road_UK no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 24th, 2014, 04:38 PM   #7384
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,559
Likes (Received): 19352

A25 Geesthacht - Hamburg

Some leftover photos I took in June 2014. All of A25 from Geesthacht to Hamburg. Parts of it was being reconstructed, and a part had some very good new asphalt.


A25-1 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


A25-2 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


A25-3 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


A25-4 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


A25-5 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


A25-6 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


A25-7 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


A25-8 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


A25-9 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


A25-10 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


A25-11 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


A25-12 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


A25-13 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


A25-14 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


A25-15 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


A25-16 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr


A25-17 by Chriszwolle, on Flickr
__________________

my clinched highways / travel mapping • highway photography @ Flickr and Youtube

SRC_100, Luki_SL liked this post
ChrisZwolle no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 24th, 2014, 04:58 PM   #7385
RipleyLV
Registered User
 
RipleyLV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Jelgava
Posts: 4,632
Likes (Received): 2262

Well that's an unusual road sign structure in the last one.
RipleyLV no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 24th, 2014, 05:27 PM   #7386
Attus
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Rheinbach
Posts: 2,762
Likes (Received): 1038

Quote:
Originally Posted by RipleyLV View Post
Well that's an unusual road sign structure in the last one.
What do you mean by that? It's quite common in Germany.
Attus no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 24th, 2014, 05:50 PM   #7387
RipleyLV
Registered User
 
RipleyLV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Jelgava
Posts: 4,632
Likes (Received): 2262

Ok, I haven't seen that before.
RipleyLV no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 27th, 2014, 01:20 PM   #7388
MichiH
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Lower Franconia
Posts: 4,400
Likes (Received): 2079

B262 Mendig (A61) - Mayen (A48)

The B262 has a length of about 12km. It's a shortcut between A61 and A48 from Cologne/Bonn to Trier/Saarbrücken (also because of missing A1). The detour via Koblenz (by using A61/A48) is 24km (36km vs. 12km). B262 features 3-lanes from A61 to L120 but there are two at-grade-intersections (A61 and L113). It's also 2+1 b/n Thür (B256) and Mayen (B258).

Two plan approval orders for a 2+1 upgrade of the remaining 1+1 sections started in November 2014:
- 2+1 widening b/n Mendig (L120) and Thür (B256): 3.0km; OSM; plan approval documents
- 2+1 widening b/n Mayen (B258) and Mayen (A48): 3.3km; OSM; plan approval documents

AADT 2010 (source):
AS Mendig (A61) – AS Mendig-Pellenzstraße (L120) 21900 / 2015 (9,2%) - 2+1
AS Mendig-Pellenzstraße (L120) – AS Thür/Kottenheim (B256/K93) 20200 / 2081 (10,3%) - 2+1 planned
AS Thür/Kottenheim (B256/K93) – AS Mayen-Hausen (L98/K26) 20400 / 2183 (10,7%) - 2+1
AS Mayen-Hausen (L98/K26) – AS Mayen-Bernhardshof (B258/L82) 26100 / 2297 (8,8%) - 2+1
AS Mayen-Bernhardshof (B258/L82) – AS Mayen (A48) 23400 / 2293 (9,8%) - 2+1 planned
__________________

Deadeye Reloaded liked this post
MichiH no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 27th, 2014, 01:47 PM   #7389
MichiH
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Lower Franconia
Posts: 4,400
Likes (Received): 2079

Upcoming openings

Estimated Autobahn and B road openings of the next 8 month including widening projects:

Quote:
December 2014: B255 Niederahr - Oberahr (2.3km; map; u/c since July 2007)
Late 2014: B48 Enkenbach-Alsenborn bypass, 2nd section (0.7km; map; u/c since September 2009)

Early 2015: A40 2x3 widening at AD Bochum-Stahlhausen (~2km; map; u/c since Late 2009; 2x3)
Early 2015: B49 2x2 widening Solms – AS Oberbiel-East (3.2km; map; u/c since May 2010; 2x2)
Spring 2015: A4 2x3 widening Düren - East of Düren (2.2km; map; u/c since ?; 2x3)
Summer 2015: A26 AS Horneburg – AS Jork [direction Hamburg] (4.6km; map; u/c since Summer 2006; 2x2)
Summer 2015: B6n AS Bernburg/Nienburg (L65) – AS Bernburg-East (4.6km; map; u/c since 2010; 2+1)
August 2015: A71 B85 near Etzleben – AS Sömmerda-East (11.4km; map; u/c since June 2010; 2x2)
Late August 2015: B41 2x2 widening east of Waldböckelheim - Waldböckelheim-Reitweg (1.1km; map; u/c since 2012; 2x2)
__________________

SRC_100 liked this post

Last edited by MichiH; December 27th, 2014 at 02:15 PM. Reason: order corrected
MichiH no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 27th, 2014, 02:51 PM   #7390
Karaya
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 1,626
Likes (Received): 752

Regarding the german vignette and "fairness"... why don't they make two different entities, one for the state roads and the other one for the motorways? At this point you can lower the road tax and introduce the vignettes.
Karaya no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 27th, 2014, 03:11 PM   #7391
MichiH
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Lower Franconia
Posts: 4,400
Likes (Received): 2079

What do you mean exactly, "different entities"?

The toll was planned for all roads but states and municipalities claimed getting money too.
Germans should pay for all Federal roads (Autobahns and B roads) according to the new draft legislation. Foreigners should only pay for Autobahns.
MichiH no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 28th, 2014, 11:41 AM   #7392
andy5
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 64
Likes (Received): 6

So enforcement of the vignette will be done by random checks?

If some of this is automatic, for example by overhead cameras that read number plates, then how do they collect the money from non-payers? Will they predict which way the car is heading and try to send a police car out to catch it? I've noticed on my trips in Germany that they have a fairly low presence of police vehicles on the autobahn. Sending a fine by post to the registered address might be tricky, as not all countries share their databases of registrations.

It is fair to start with an assumption that the cost of the road should be paid by people using it, and that foreign visitors should be liable for a share.

In most countries the duty and tax collected on fuel taxes surpass the actual cost of the road system, so the spare revenue goes into other parts of the state budget. I'm not intending to start a debate on this.

But it means that if foreigners buy fuel when they visit, they are already paying a share, and roughly pro rata to their amount of road use. If I filled the car up with fuel one time in 400 or 600 km of motorway in Germany that would collect more money in duty and tax than a €10 short stay vignette.

If this new scheme proposal is only intended to collect more from foreigners, and if they don't consider collection via fuel taxes to be already an adequate method to do so, why not?
andy5 no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 28th, 2014, 11:53 AM   #7393
MichiH
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Lower Franconia
Posts: 4,400
Likes (Received): 2079

Quote:
Originally Posted by andy5 View Post
So enforcement of the vignette will be done by random checks?
Correct.

Quote:
Originally Posted by andy5 View Post
Will they predict which way the car is heading and try to send a police car out to catch it?
No.

Quote:
Originally Posted by andy5 View Post
Sending a fine by post to the registered address might be tricky, as not all countries share their databases of registrations.
It will be done this way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by andy5 View Post
In most countries the duty and tax collected on fuel taxes surpass the actual cost of the road system, so the spare revenue goes into other parts of the state budget. I'm not intending to start a debate on this.
In Germany too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by andy5 View Post
But it means that if foreigners buy fuel when they visit, they are already paying a share, and roughly pro rata to their amount of road use. If I filled the car up with fuel one time in 400 or 600 km of motorway in Germany that would collect more money in duty and tax than a €10 short stay vignette.
I can drive more than 600km without refueling.

Quote:
Originally Posted by andy5 View Post
If this new scheme proposal is only intended to collect more from foreigners, and if they don't consider collection via fuel taxes to be already an adequate method to do so, why not?
The route through Germany is less than 100km . There's no need for foreigners to refuel in Germany.
MichiH no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 28th, 2014, 11:57 AM   #7394
Road_UK
BANNED
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Mayrhofen AT, Sneek NL, Bromley UK
Posts: 5,855
Likes (Received): 1599

Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
Correct.







It will be done this way.

.
Not to the UK they won't unless the driver of the offending vehicle has been stopped by the police. The UK doesn't share it's car registration index with other European countries.
Road_UK no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 28th, 2014, 12:02 PM   #7395
ChrisZwolle
Road user
 
ChrisZwolle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Zwolle
Posts: 43,559
Likes (Received): 19352

Quote:
Originally Posted by andy5 View Post
I've noticed on my trips in Germany that they have a fairly low presence of police vehicles on the autobahn.
They use often use unmarked cars. I know a couple that was pulled over three times on their way to Austria by unmarked police cars.

The vignette will be enforced by BAG - Bundesamt für Güterverkehr. I'm not sure if it's still the case, but they used to have nearly all their vans registered in Köln (license plate K).

The BAG has a history of toll enforcement. They also used to enforce the Eurovignette (for trucks) until Germany switched to their own LKW Maut.
ChrisZwolle no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 28th, 2014, 12:03 PM   #7396
MichiH
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Lower Franconia
Posts: 4,400
Likes (Received): 2079

Ok, one Austrian guy will not be caught
MichiH no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 28th, 2014, 12:05 PM   #7397
Road_UK
BANNED
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Mayrhofen AT, Sneek NL, Bromley UK
Posts: 5,855
Likes (Received): 1599

The BAG still has its vehicles registered in Cologne. And the police presence in Bavaria on their motorways is unbelievably high. Especially on the A3 through to Würzburg, A93 between Regensburg and Austria and the A8 south of Munich. At and around the Inntal Dreieck and at Irschenberg there are always unmarked police vehicles present. Big fat BMW's...
Road_UK no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 28th, 2014, 12:09 PM   #7398
MichiH
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Lower Franconia
Posts: 4,400
Likes (Received): 2079

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
The vignette will be enforced by BAG - Bundesamt für Güterverkehr. I'm not sure if it's still the case, but they used to have nearly all their vans registered in Köln (license plate K).
You can easily recognize BAG vans.

source: auto-bild.
MichiH no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 28th, 2014, 12:13 PM   #7399
MichiH
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Lower Franconia
Posts: 4,400
Likes (Received): 2079

Quote:
Originally Posted by Road_UK View Post
The BAG still has its vehicles registered in Cologne. And the police presence in Bavaria on their motorways is unbelievably high. Especially on the A3 through to Würzburg, A93 between Regensburg and Austria and the A8 south of Munich. At and around the Inntal Dreieck and at Irschenberg there are always unmarked police vehicles present. Big fat BMW's...
I live west of Würzburg. Can't remember ever recognized an unmarked police vehicle on A3....... Maybe I drive too decent (can't believe )... But I've heard and read about it. Yes, BMW's.... WÜ or M license plate?
MichiH no está en línea   Reply With Quote
Old December 28th, 2014, 12:15 PM   #7400
Road_UK
BANNED
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Mayrhofen AT, Sneek NL, Bromley UK
Posts: 5,855
Likes (Received): 1599

I never had anything to do with BAG officers in person, however, they wrote me a love letter in German once, sent to my address in the UK. In Germany you are supposed to keep a log book with your hours when driving a freight van, even if it's under 3.5 tonnes. So after being thoroughly inspected once again by the Bavarian police just outside Straubing when I was on my way to Hungary, they were so kind enough to pass my details on to the BAG, seeing that I failed to provide a log book. Cocky gestapo bastards...
Road_UK no está en línea   Reply With Quote


Reply

Tags
autobahn, baustelle, congestion, germany, highways, marode brücken, motorways, stau

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Related topics on SkyscraperCity


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 10:07 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Feedback Buttons provided by Advanced Post Thanks / Like (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2018 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.

SkyscraperCity ☆ In Urbanity We trust ☆ about us | privacy policy | DMCA policy

tech management by Sysprosium