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Old November 26th, 2015, 06:56 PM   #8321
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilhem275 View Post
But this leaves the door open to overvalued concessions, based on excessive growth expectations. You know how much you'll have to pay, but as a taxpayer you're not really sure the value was calculated properly.
And this takes us back to the issue of lack of trust in politics....
The model using availability payments is independent of actual traffic usage on the motorway. With low or high traffic volumes, the payments to the concession holder remains the same. The only factor in the long term may be that truck traffic could be higher than expected, increasing the wear and tear and maintenance cost.

The contract value is mainly dependent on construction cost, maintenance cost over the concession period and financing cost (interest). Usually the concession also includes winter services.

In the end it's just a government-financed project, but the major upside is that it can be constructed much faster because all funding is available immediately. That's why PPP projects are in particular interesting for large projects, which would otherwise suffer from fragmented funding availability.

The decision what to construct remains with the government. The concession company doesn't get to decide whether they construct four or six or even eight lanes. In addition, ownership of the motorway remains with the government as well.
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Old November 27th, 2015, 04:32 AM   #8322
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Well, i am surprised in a positive way. A nice discussion bringing up several things i did not think of before. And without name calling etc.

I don't think we ever get to a point where we have the same view of things. But still we profit from sharing our thoughts. Thats what i like in discussions.

TY.

Most important for me was the fact about the cost for planning etc, whihc the government does an is hidden in a way.

In germany municipalities needed to change their finance management from cameralistics to double-entry bookkeeping some years ago. This highlights the problems about infrastructure. This general change means, that before you just had a look what money came in, balances your spending. But you did not count, if the buildings roads etc. you had kept their value. This led to the trend to build something without having the money to keep it afterwards. Most States of germany introduced this system for the municipalities. But most states themselve and the Federal government made only small changes right now.

http://www.doppik-studie.de/begriff-doppik.html

This highlightens the fact that its always about what costs you take in account. The fun is, that this higher effort makes more sense with bigger projects. But in fact the municipalities do it, the higher levels of state don't.
You always need to think about that this efforts are also costly. So how much you juggle the numbers depends on the comparison to the amount of money in a project. For the municipalities it was expensive, that it changes anything to the better is not yet prooved.

And i like to had that it might improve my english, but its really hard to discuss such a topic in this language... Sry if something sounds very funny.
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Old November 27th, 2015, 11:20 AM   #8323
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Quote:
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I have a very negative bias on PPP, due to what I saw here in Veneto region: politicians saw them as a great way to launch projects in a short time span (immediate political return) and shift the economical downsides to a time when their career won't be influenced anymore. Thanks to this godsend, the dumbest projects were launched (or were about to be launched, just before the promoters were all arrested for massive corruption
The bad implementation, however, does not make the model itself bad.

Of course, any PPP project must be under a strict contract and control, as well as backed up financially.

The interpretation of the word "contract" seems to vary a lot across Europe. In the North, the contracts are to be followed literally, and the client expect the contractor to fulfill all the articles contained. (That was a big surprise to the French state owner company Areva which is building the nuclear power plant in Finland. The plant is delayed for years, and the financial losses are several billions of euros.) That is why most of the PPP projects have been successful in Finland.
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Old November 27th, 2015, 11:36 AM   #8324
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2. The risk is still on side of state. If the comany goes bankrupt, the state pays. If the money was not enough, the state does not cancel the treaty (nobody wants to start again and loose more time and money) but pays more.
That sort of risks are results of miserably failed negotiations. Proper PPP agreements are always backed up by financial institutions. If the contractor goes bankrupt then the bank sends money to the state, finds another contractor, or takes some other action.
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Old November 27th, 2015, 08:24 PM   #8325
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If poltiical governance is weak, it will affect both PPP and govenrment-led projects. Italy is a good example: PPPs sometimes get away with (financial) murder, but it is not like ANAS-led projects are free of problems either. And then you have really atrocious cases of "semi-independent publicly-backed" agencies (CAS).

My point is that in a country with better political governance, both models can work. But neither is a panacea for bad political governance.
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Old November 29th, 2015, 05:25 PM   #8326
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A3 @Marktheidenfeld

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The neighboring section b/n Marktheidenfeld and the bridge over river Main will be widened in 2016/17 (map). Two bridges over A3 were already reconstructed in 2013 / 2015. Additional preliminary works are ongoing. The Main bridge was reconstructed from 1997-2001.
Preliminary works like building of new overpasses and rainwater retention basins are ongoing. Some pics published by the road authority ABDNB taken in October 2015:











This pic shows the whole section. It begins about at the "b" of "Nürnberg" and ends in front of the Main bridge:


Traffic on the bridge is on the southern carriageway because of the ongoing widening works south of the bridge.

More pics: > click <.
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Old November 29th, 2015, 05:51 PM   #8327
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B207 widening / Fehmarnsund crossing / Fehmarnbelt crossing

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The B207 b/n the end of A1 at Heiligenhafen-East interchange end and the beginning of the future Fehmarnbelt tunnel near Puttgarden is planned to be widened to 2x2 lanes. B207 will get a motorway-like standard. The plan approval procedure began in October 2011, the plan approval order was passed on 31st August 2015. It was delayed because of the A20 court decision. Many documents had to be revised, there were two revisions (Planänderungsverfahren).

Schleswig-Hostein Minister of Transport, Mr. Meyer, announced that the Federal government (in German we just say "der Bund") has promised funding, that means, construction works can begin if there are no appeals against the plan approval order. See press release.

I read earlier that the construction period is about 3 or 3,5 years. The project is split into two sections with a 2.7km gap in between:

B207: AS Puttgarden – north of Fehmarnsund bridge 10.0km (2016? to 2020?) – ? – map (SH; plan approval: October 2011 – August 2015)
B207: Fehmarnsund crossing 2.7km (? to ?) – ? – map (SH; early planning stage)
B207: south of Fehmarnsund bridge – AS Heiligenhafen-East 6.3km (2016? to 2020?) – ? – map (SH; plan approval: October 2011 – August 2015)
The approval order for the B207 widening is challenged. There are ten complaints (source; more (prior) details: > click < and > click <).

The efficiency analysis for the Fehmarnsund crossing is done. It's planned to build a four-laned road plus two rail tracks. The most efficient variant is a combined bridge for road and rail (100%). Followed by two separate bridges for road and railway (91%), an immersed tunnel for road and railway (74%) and a bored tunnel (73%). The preliminary planning should be completed by late 2017. It's still possible that Fehmarnsund crossing will be built from 2022 to 2028. The existing bridge will not be used for main traffic afterwards. See press release and news article.

The hearing within the plan approval procedure for the Fehmarnbelt tunnel has recently taken place (it lasted 8 days). The documents must be improved. It's announced that they will be completed in spring 2016. Afterwards, the plan approval authority will check the documents and start a plan supplemention procedure (Planergänzungsverfahren). Plans will be outlayed again. Please refer to press releases (1 + 2). The Danish Minister of Transport expects that construction works will begin in 2019 at the earliest and will be completed in 2027 at earliest because it's most likely that the plan approval order will be challenged. Source.
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Old November 30th, 2015, 12:45 AM   #8328
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The northern half of the A61.

The wooded area near Mönchengladbach.


6 lanes and all-around along ca. 8 km, is to be demolished.


The E31 route moves from one motorway to the other on their concurrency.


The A7 Kassel - Bad Hersfeld, if it would have constructed 30 years later (without considering 5 lanes).
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Old December 1st, 2015, 12:30 AM   #8329
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Recently resurfaced section Kreuz Koblenz - Ochtendung. Fortunately, I caught up after.


Do any of you remind almost empty A1? Please look to the southern part.


Poor quality, but I haven't found this stretch on YT.
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Old December 1st, 2015, 09:08 PM   #8330
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You do some amazing signwork
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Old December 1st, 2015, 10:53 PM   #8331
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yeah, the amount of information (and the amount of work you apparently put into it) is pretty amazing!
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Old December 5th, 2015, 10:43 AM   #8332
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Bundesverkehrswegeplan 2015

It was originally planned to publish the draft of the new "Bundesverkehrswegeplan 2015" (Federal road demand plan) in early 2015 (2012 version). This was delayed to Mid of 2015, fall 2015, October, November, December 2015 and it's know annouced that it is delayed by some weeks because it should be published together with the "Strategische Umweltprüfung" (strategical environmental audit). See news article and a press release of the Green Baden-Württemberg Minister of Transport commenting the delay.

The next farce of Mr. Dobrindt..... After the infamous car toll debate.......

It was announced that all data of the projects will be published via internet and citizens can comment the general plan. I expect to get a priorization of the projects which have been suggested by the states in 2013. It should be VB+ (urgent demand plus; especially for Autobahn bottlenecks), VB (urgent demand), WB* (further demand with planning permission) and WB (further demand without planning permission). In addition, I expect that some suggested projects will not be put on the list at all.
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Old December 5th, 2015, 11:28 PM   #8333
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It was originally planned to publish the draft of the new "Bundesverkehrswegeplan 2015" (Federal road demand plan) in early 2015 (2012 version). This was delayed to Mid of 2015, fall 2015, October, November, December 2015 and it's know annouced that it is delayed by some weeks because it should be published together with the "Strategische Umweltprüfung" (strategical environmental audit).
Isn't it fun, that a green minister complains about the fact that the environmental audit takes so long? As far as i understand its not to discuss environmental aspects of one project, but of the networkplanning at all. Thats not such stupid.

If you discuss what is most necessary to remove bottlenecks in the network, and think of environmental aspects also, this could make planning process of single projects even faster, because you don't need to discuss if, but only how it is built. The improvement of the general plan would fight NiMByism also if it is done in a good way.

But in reality, it would lead to jsut longer planning times, more paperwork etc. i guess. Bureaucracy could even make a curtail out of a good idea.

So in a way its funny (like a green minister beeing respronsible for law enforcement of Nuclear energy once), but mostly its sad.
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Old December 5th, 2015, 11:48 PM   #8334
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Do the long building times also apply to rail infrastructure?
To be more precise, how long will it take to rebuild this bridge?
https://www.ndr.de/nachrichten/niede...weener164.html
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Old December 6th, 2015, 10:12 AM   #8335
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Isn't it fun, that a green minister complains about the fact that the environmental audit takes so long?
He just complains that it's delayed again and again.

Quote:
Es wird langsam peinlich, immer neue Termine bekannt geben zu müssen, die nie eingehalten werden
Generally, Mr. Hermann often publishs press releases or gives interviews to blame the Federal Ministry of Transport.

The latest fight is about a pilot project for introducing a general speed limit of 120km/h on two long Autobahn sections in Baden-Württemberg (A81 and A96). It's a 4-years study which should begin in May 2016. It'is (officially) motivated by the "Vision Zero" which is also part of the coalition contract of the Federal Government (source).
Mr. Dobrindt asked Mr. Hermann to stop the study because it's not legal to introduce a speed limit without any reason but Mr. Hermann wants to do it anyway (source; there's a pic showing Mr. Hermann, the man with bald head, and Mr. Dobrindt; Green party vs. CSU party).
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Old December 6th, 2015, 10:33 AM   #8336
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B6n

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Quote:
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The final segment of the B6n Bernburg bypass will be opened on 29th May 2015. Source.

The B6n construction b/n A395, A14 and A9 (~130km; map) began in October 1997. It's a parallel west-east connection south of A2 and north of A38. The first section is in service since 2000. It's motorway-like b/n A395 and A14 but only 2+1 and partial with at-grade intersections b/n A14 and A9. The final 15km section b/n Köthen and A9 is announced to be completed by 2018 or 2019 (map). Funding for preliminary works is approved for 2015. It's planned to extend B6n to Torgau (~50km; map; 2+1; early planning stage).

It's discussed whether B6n could/should be rededicated to A36 b/n A395 and A14 but it's only RQ26 (cross section) instead of RQ28. IIRC, the space reservation next to the road does not fulfill the official motorway standard.
The final section was opened today. The first 2.7km section of the Bernburg bypass was already opened in December 2011. The entire bypass (7.3km) costs 92 million €. About 50% are funded by EU ERDF. The rest is funded by the federal "Infrastrukturbeschleunigungsprogramm I" and "Konjunkturprogramm II" (infrastructure speed-up program I or stimulus package II).
The official groundbreaking ceremony for the last B6n section b/n Köthen and the future A9 interchange Thurland in Saxony-Anhalt took place last week. The 15km section costs 51 million €. See press release. It will feature 3 lanes but it's only partial grade-separated.It's announced to be completed by December 2019, see news article. General project info: > click <.

The project name is B6n (n = new) but it will be dedicated B185.

B185 AS Köthen-East – AS Thurland (A9) 15.2km (November 2015 to December 2018) - ? - map
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Old December 6th, 2015, 12:52 PM   #8337
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B185 AS Köthen-East – AS Thurland (A9) 15.2km (November 2015 to December 2018) - ? - map
Originally it was planned to built it eastwards to B184. This would be a better endpoint. It would connect the easter side to the motorway also. I don't understand why they removed this small part (1,5km). It does not save much money, because no bridge etc. is saved...


Concerning the struggels between Federal and State of BW minister of infrastructure: I would prefer a general speed limit on german motorways. You could discuss how high it should be, must not be 120, could also be 140, as the trend is to lift it up someplace. But even at 200 it will brake down some people, that is indeed a safety issue.

If there should be any scientific digging in the facts any short test is useless. But i think germany will stay without general speed limit for long time. "it does not matter to the car industry, who is government below it."
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Old December 6th, 2015, 02:32 PM   #8338
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Originally it was planned to built it eastwards to B184. This would be a better endpoint. It would connect the easter side to the motorway also. I don't understand why they removed this small part (1,5km). It does not save much money, because no bridge etc. is saved...
I don't know details about the end of this section but it's still planned to extend the road to the east. That means "B6n" is planned to be extended to the Saxony border near Schemsal/Bad Düben** or Wittenberg. Please refer to a map published by the MZ in July 2015:



** According to the BVWP 2003 it was planned to extend the B6n to Torgau but Saxony has not submitted this project to be checked for the BVWP 2015.

I don't know any detail about variant 2 to Wittenberg but the demand plan proposal from September 2014 only contains variant 1. The short section b/n A9 and B184 should be 4-laned, the remaining section to the Saxony border should be 3-laned.
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Old December 6th, 2015, 02:55 PM   #8339
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Happened and expected openings in 2015

I'd like to update the list because there should be some openings next week .

The biggest opening ceremony will be the B96 opening on Rügen island. Chancellor Mrs. Merkel, Federal Minister of Transport Mr. Dobrindt, Minister President of Mecklenburg-West Pomerania Mr. Sellering and Minister of Transport Mr. Pegel will join the party.

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Motorway widenings:
A3: Kauppenbrücke – AS Rohrbrunn (2x3) 8.0km (April 2013 to Mid November 2015 / December 2015 ?) [partial 4 eastbound lanes] – projectmap
It was officially opened on 17th November 2015, see press release, but it's still 2x2 because of ongoing works at the median. It should be opened 2x3 on Tuesday.

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A10: east of AD Pankow (A114) – Berlin/Brandenburg border (2x3) 5.4km (2009 to Early November 2015) – projectmap
Opened since about 11th November 2015.

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Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
B road widenings:
B16: Ernsgaden-West – AS Ernsgaden-East (2+1) 3km (September 2014 to 4th December 2015) – ? – map
Delayed to tomorrow (source).

Full list:

New motorways:
A14: AK Schwerin – AS Grabow (2x2) 14.4km (November 2012 to 21st December 2015) – ? – map
A14: AS Groß Warnow – AS Karstädt (2x2) 10.8km (October 2013 to 21st December 2015) – projectmap
A23: AS Itzehoe-Center – south of Stör bridge (2x2) 2.5km (January 2007 to 26th October 2015) – projectmap
A26: AS Horneburg – AS Jork (2x2) 4.6km (Summer 2006 to 17th July 2015) [direction Hamburg]projectmap
A71: Etzleben – AS Sömmerda-East (2x2) 11.4km (June 2010 to 3rd September 2015) – projectmap
A448: rededication AD Bochum-West – AS Bochum-South (2x2) 5.0km (Mid 2015) – projectmap

Motorway widenings:
A3: Kauppenbrücke – AS Rohrbrunn (2x3) 8.0km (April 2013 to 8th December 2015) [partial 4 eastbound lanes]projectmap
A3: Main-Donube-Canal bridge (2x3) 1.3km (April 2014 to 18th December 2015) – projectmap
A4: AS Düren – east of AS Düren (2x3) 2.2km (? to 12th June 2015) – projectmap
A7: T+R Harz – AS Seesen (2x3) ~5km (August 2012 to Summer 2015) – projectmap
A8: east of AS Karlsbad – east of Klosterwegbrücke (2x3) ~6km (August 2009 to 26th 06 2015) – projectmap
A8: Temmenhausen – west of AS Ulm-West (2x3) 7.8km (May 2012 to 24th 09 2015) – projectmap
A8: west of AS Burgau – east of AS Burgau (2x3) 5.7km (August 2011 to Late July/Early August 2015) – projectmap
A8: west of AS Zusmarshausen – west of AS Adelsried (2x3) 7.4km (August 2011 to ~ 2nd November 2015) – projectmap
A8: west of AS Neusäß – AS Neusäß (2x3) ~5.0km (August 2011 to September 2015) – projectmap
A8: AS Neusäß – AS Augsburg-West (2x3) ~2.7km (August 2011 to June 2015) – projectmap
A10: east of AD Pankow (A114) – Berlin/Brandenburg border (2x3) 5.4km (2009 to ~ 11th November 2015) – projectmap
A40: Walzwerkstraße – AD Bochum-West (A448) (2x3) ~2km (Late 2009 to 18th June 2015) – projectmap
A57: AK Kaarst (A52) – AS Holzbüttgen (2x3) ?km (November 2013 to December 2015) – projectmap

New expressways:
B10: Walmersbach – west of Hinterweidenthal (2x2) 1.8km (June 2010 to 30th October 2015) – projectmap

New B roads and B road bypasses:
B2R: AS München-Sendling-Plinganserstraße (B11) – AS München-Sendling (A96) (2x3) 2.8km (August 2009 to 27th July 2015) – projectmap
B15: AS Rosenheim-West (A8) – AS Kolbermoor (St2078) 3.5km (August 2012 to 12th October 2015) – projectmap
B16: Dillingen bypass (2+1) 9.4km (June 2012 to 15th September 2015) – projectmap
B27: Waake bypass (2+1) 2.5km (March 2010 to 18th August 2015) – projectmap
B45: Nidderau bypass (K246 – B45-South) 3.9km (September 2009 to 22nd June 2015) – projectmap
B48: Enkenbach-Alsenborn bypass 0.7km (September 2009 to 09th October 2015) – ? – map
B68: Essen bypass 4.1km (August 2012 to 12th October 2015) – projectmap
B96n: AS Samtens-Ost – Scharpitz (2+1) 11.5km (June 2011 to 8th December 2015) – projectmap
B109: Anklam bypass 1.7km (July 2011 to 08th May 2015) – ? – map
B112: Brieskow-Finkenheerd/Wiesenau bypass (2+1) 10.0km (April 2012 to Late 2015 / 2016 ?) – projectmap
B212: Huntebrück-North – Huntebrück-South 1.5km (July 2009 to 10th December 2015) – projectmap
B237: Wipperfürth bypass 0.5km (January 2013 to Spring 2015) – ? – map
B245: Bebertal bypass 4.8km (September 2013 to 14th September 2015) – ? – map
B247: Duderstadt bypass (west of Westerode (B446) – north of Tiftlingerode) 3.3km (July 2012 to 16th October 2015) – projectmap
B249: Frieda bypass 2.2km (July 2013 to 12th September 2015) – projectmap
B255: AS Oberahr – north of Ettinghausen ?km (July 2007 to 25th March 2015) – ? – map
B304: Realignment near Mühlreit 2.0km (September 2011 to 23rd October 2015) – projectmap

B road widenings:
B12: Unterthingau – AS Geisenried (2+1) 3.3km (2nd quarter 2015 to August 2015) – projectmap
B16: Ernsgaden-West – AS Ernsgaden-East (2+1) 3km (September 2014 to 7th December 2015) – ? – map
B16: AS Bernhardswald – Wenzenbach (2+1) 2.6km (November 2014 to 11th September 2015) – projectmap
B28: K1029 – Herrenberg (2+1) 0.9km (July 2015 to Early December 2015) – projectmap
B41: east of Waldböckelheim – Waldböckelheim-Reitweg (2x2) 1.1km (September 2012 to 10th September 2015) – projectmap
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Which new motorways are currently under construction?
Which new motorways will be opened next?

See 'New motorway projects' thread

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Old December 7th, 2015, 12:09 AM   #8340
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichiH View Post
The latest fight is about a pilot project for introducing a general speed limit of 120km/h on two long Autobahn sections in Baden-Württemberg (A81 and A96). It's a 4-years study which should begin in May 2016. It'is (officially) motivated by the "Vision Zero" which is also part of the coalition contract of the Federal Government (source).
Mr. Dobrindt asked Mr. Hermann to stop the study because it's not legal to introduce a speed limit without any reason but Mr. Hermann wants to do it anyway (source; there's a pic showing Mr. Hermann, the man with bald head, and Mr. Dobrindt; Green party vs. CSU party).
C'mon . I would expect a huge public outcry against that. A 120 km/h general speed limit? In Germany? Don't they have enough (in BW) with long stretches of A5, A8 and A81 restricted to 120?
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